God & the Stargate

[Tabitha]

just a random thought... i haven't seen all of s4 yet, so hopefully I won't sound too daft...

Why haven't we seen a goa'uld posing as god yet? When I first started thinking about this i thought maybe that couldn't have happened because earth's stargate was buried ages before the advent of christianity.... but then you had that bloke (whose name has just slipped my mind) posing as the devil in season 3, so why not?

Maybe we would regard the christian god as an all-good type, which might not fit the goauld mould... but i thought Ra was supposed to have been pretty benevolent in Egyptian myth

So what do you think? Could the show pull something like this off without offending half its audience? I think it could be quite a novel method of invasion

 

[Rowan]

God

Since other than the episode 'Demons' [set in/around 1000-1000AD Western Europe], the three major Earth religeons: Christianity, Jewdism and Islam, have not been touched... only the so-called 'Pagan' religeons.

Being a practicing Wiccan - which makes me a Pagan for sure - for the last 30+ years of my life, I find that interesting. Is it an attitude of 'It's fun to mess around in other people's backyards, but not ours.' or it it the desire not to tick off what probably constitutes over 95% of their viewing audience.

I will use the deffinition of "any religeon that is polythestic" as Pagan since monothesim is the major defining fact in the "major" three.

[Sorry with my spellng... I'm on a very sticky keyboard right now...]

Commentary?

 

[jsc]

I have always wondered about that lack of using the Judeo/Christian, Islam and Buddahism and Hinduism. It probably would make the marketability of SG-1less if they were used. Buddahism is used only lightly in Maternal Instinct (season 3) and again in Season 4's Absolute Power. Christianity wasn't even examined in Demons. I think that marketability is the answer as the conservative members of these religions could make showing and distribution difficult. I just can't see people being very happy if the Prophet Mohammed or his family was used by the goa'ulds or Jesus was shown to be tempted by goa'ulds. Hillel would not make a good target either. So I think outside of fan fic these religions will only be touched very gently...if at all.

 

[Tabitha]

I definitely think that the creators/writers wouldn't be that interested in pursuing a line of thinking that might possibly offend so many people.
And thats a pity, because the way I see it, it could be a very interesting and powerful storyline which could investigate the players outrage at their own religions being perverted rather than very old, mostly dead religions... or possibly indecision in the face of what *could* have been the origins of the big three


I love sg1's mythological basis, but it'd be nice if they tackled somthing a bit more risque

 

[imported_TheDoc]

personally, I love the idea of sg1 meeting god. why is it ok to use other religions for a tv show, but not their own.

but can you imagine what uproar this would cause? I don't think too many people would be bothered here in europe, but judging from my experiences and from the rant on some "christian tv guides" I doubt they'd risk to lose out on selling commercials with such an episode.

(my favorit comment on one of those sites was (about daniel jackson): "he always sleeps around, but always pays for it". now I sure know what the girl meant to say .... but you see what this *looks* like ...?)

the doc :blpaw:

 

[Tabitha]

Originally posted by TheDoc

(my favorit comment on one of those sites was (about daniel jackson): "he always sleeps around, but always pays for it". now I sure know what the girl meant to say .... but you see what this *looks* like ...?)

the doc :blpaw:

thats just made me think - but didn't trek pull it off in whatever the movie before generations was.

Didn't shatner face off with god or something?
Memory is a bit fuzzy here, added to the fact that it was by a million miles the worst trek feature film imo

and as for the attitudes of the "religious right"in america, they just do my head in, I have just graduated with a degree in (mainly modern american) history, and I could rant along forever about how crazy they seem... but I agree, I think us euros wouldn't have such a big problem with such a topic, which is interesting, because it has always seemed to me that america has a lot more ethnic/cultural/religious diversity than Europe in general. Just less tolerance...

And when it comes to t.v. - american shows are not really gonna take that much notice of the strength of the european audience, in comparison to domestic numbers.
But hey, I remember reading somewhere that the only reason Due South lasted as long as it did was cos of its british audience....

poor daniel, not that I agree with the above sentiment, but that girl's kinda got a point, not only is he the no.1 whipping boy, but he also can never get the lurve thing quite right can he?

 

[imported_TheDoc]

yeah, you're quite right - but at the end of the movie the "entity" proved not to be god after all, so they didn't *meet* god. and I fully agree, this was the worst trek movie ever made, definitely on my list of "crimes of celluloid" (if I remember correctly, he was even nominated for the razzy!).

just musing - as america is such an incredible big country, they can't think small - it's always up to the extreme, whether it concerns the size of hamburgers or beliefs. there's always only black and white, no shades in between. and there's hardly a subject more suitable for being extremistic and fanatic about than religion. fanatism, no matter what over, is a frightening, unexplainable and disturbing phenomenon, and I steer clear of it wherever I can. ::shudder::

ah well, the golden whipping boy ... well, I dunno, but I guess he'll never hop on the love train, for the audience definitely prefers someone to swoon over with no strings attached. so I can really only warn any actress who gets a job offer to be daniel's love interest on the show - this can only lead to certain death (the "red shirt factor")!

the doc :blpaw:

 

[Tabitha]

Originally posted by TheDoc
::shudder::

the doc :blpaw:

thanks for your thoughts doc, they seem pretty similar to mine on religion/fanaticism. Interesting view on america though, and has led me to think about the americanisation of the rest of the world, seems a shame that a culture that has such a potentially enormous scope is actually pretty narrow, and unfortunately rubbing off on the rest of us. Its amazing that people can think of themselves as American at all - i mean how much can 270 million people really have in common?
I know that I don't feel particularly european, and I could probably tell you a lot more about US politics than I could about British... and I think that most of my cultural references are more than likely from american film and television

anyway, I have kinda gone off on about 3 tangents in this post alone - sorry

 

[jsc]

America has many problems... Religious and cultural intolerance being among the top but also we seem to like the extremes in individualiam. Rambo, Billy Jack, etc. the little guy going againt the system (what ever system is preceived as large at the time) and winning are cases in point. And why is this because the vast majority sit and do not do but let someone else do the complaining and work. So it looks as if we all sorrifully agree that the producers are not going to get to touch religion as it doesn't sell...unless it has been dead many years.

 

[Tabitha]

cheers

thanks guys, for interesting thoughts & perspectives...

I only joined up yesterday, but I just finished my finals and have spent the day messing about on the net & chillin out - I love these message boards and have posted loads already...
I am off to australia and thailand for a month tomorrow, so no replies from me for a while, see yas!:rolly2:

 

[imported_Nemesis]

i guess SG-1 could meet god but i just think it'll get a tad bit boring...think about it, 'god' wont have an interesting name like ra or apophis, he'd judt be God. u can just imagine how boring his introduction would be, 'hi, i'm God, your God' boring or what?
but at least Jack would be making jokes about this in every scene

 

[Tabitha]

aww come on, use your imagination... he could have jaffa that had wings n stuff :rolly2:

 

[Anni]

Hmm.... Jaffa with wings. Interesting concept. Do you think they'd fare any better against the amazing four from SG1?

I mean, don't they hurl express trains off their tracks in their spare time, freeze water with a single glance and leap over tall buildings with a single bound?

I thought they WERE God........

:evil: :evil:

 

[jsc]

That sounds like a combination of superman and Mr. Freeze.....with wings!LOLLOL!!!

 

[ysm]

:evil: You'd better believe that if there was a show with, say a Hindu god as a go'uald, every Hindu in America would be up in arms. America was founded on Christianity and we just don't seem to have a very good understanding or tolerance of other religions. But, I'd like to see something written by someone with true knowledge of a completely different religion than what we're used to. (Hindu, Hoodoo, Shinto, even Satanistism). It would definitely be interesting and probably controversial.

 

[Rowan]

Meeting 'God'

Careful, Nemesis. Maybe God is a Furling.

Seriously, it's hard to write a piece that will give you a good understanding of the dynamics of a religeon within a 44 minute framework. I think focusing on the Egyptian pantheon is the thing that's helped SG-1 ties it's self together. They are the underlying theme.

Being of a 'non-christian' path myself, I do agree that the primary dermographics for the show are aimed at the Judeo-Christian sociological market and for that main reason they, the show, will stear clear on the most part. Their one touch into that area was downplayed by placing it in the middle of the European 'Dark Ages' [prompting one of my all time favorite Daniel lines, BTW] so that the emphisis could be shifted to the time period, not the theology itself.

Such is the name of marketing.



:smilej:

 

[shiloh]

Yeah, it's unfortuante that real world considerations have to come into play. It'd be an interesting excersie. Certainly the christian god can be a pretty vengeful and p-ed off guy at times. But it'd never "play in Peoria" as they say.

It would have been fun to see some other pantheons really deeply explored. How about Shiva and Kali?
Kali, "destroyer of life", Shiva, "god of destruction and reproduction" -- that'd work as a description of the goa'ulds, especially Hathor, wouldn't it?! But once tied into the Egyptian pantheon, it would have been hard to venture too far from it.

Rowan: what's the favorite line from Demons? "They didn't call them the dark ages because they were dark"? That's one of my all-time favorites!

 

[Anni]

I'm not sure that they aim the show at any particular religion, although they certainly wouldn't want to annoy any one religious group in particular. Shintoism, Hinduism are both living religions still practised in the world. Voodoo is considered to be a religious practise in places like Haiti and many forms of Voodoo still exist among the African tribes (where the practice in face originated, it was brought over to the Americas and the Carribbean by the slaves). The idea of the Tokoloshe as a vengeful spirit leaps to mind. Many Africans still fear the Tokoloshe and would rathe visit a medicine man than a trained doctor. So I guess that Voodoo is also a living religion. Although you might be able to stretch a point and use it in the show, but only if the producers, writers and actors particularly wish to be revived as zombies in a wave of revenge from voodoo practitioners!

:evil:

Satanists are a group out on their own, but people practise black magic today as well as those who practise white magic. Although you could say that since practising Satanism is considered to be very questionable, you could probably use that in something like Stargate without too many repercussions. Then again, only if you don't want the Stargate production teams to be turned into horned toads!



So if you base anything on living cults, practices or religions then you're probably asking for trouble. Whereas effectively 'dead' religions, such as the Egyptian, Roman, Greek, Babylonian, Mesopotamian, Chinese, Norse pantheons and even perhaps some of the gods worshipped in Britain.... Cernunnos (The horned god, the green man of legend, The Wild Hunt) would be safe enough bets to use because using them is unlikely to cause an outcry from any group.

I think that the Egyptian pantheon was a good choice because unlike the Greeks, a lot of the real mystery attached to these deities was maintained especially since most knowledge of the Egyptians was buried and a mystery until Napoleon went to Egypt and found the Rosetta Stone. The show has by no means exhausted the possibilities, although it could be said that the fanfic writers haven't been as backward in coming forward with their ideas!

All I hope is that any deity they DO use doesn't get turned into a comic opera character as they have turned others....

 

[nic]

Hey guys!
Personally, I wouldn't have a problem with exploring the foundation of our more "popular" religions... but perhap I can understand why people could become offended.
I did an animation with year and lets just say it was met with.... "mixed" reviews.
My short COMEDY was set around these sexually repressed nuns and it had all this sexual/phallic symbolism in it.
Most people loved it, they viewed and judged it based on what it was - a joke.
However, there was a small audience that looked a little too deep into it, viewing it as an attack on christain culture.

Basically, I'd like to see stargate explore our more modern day believes (I like shows that push the bounaries - I mean, if we didn't push boundaries of taboo/taste etc.. how would social acceptances develope?)

I don't know if that makes sense, but I know one thing for sure... I'm going to hell for laughing at nuns... at least thats what an elderly lady told me!

 

[Koala]

Originally posted by Tabitha
Why haven't we seen a goa'uld posing as god yet?

In this world infected with the political correctness plague they wouldn't do it towards any "regular" religion because it could result in a boycott or at least potentially anger some viewers.

Disney has this disease big time, going as far as to recall movies and redub the audio.

Most recently, the movie "Pearl Harbor" did the same thing. Besides not being historically accurate in US distribution (the most accurate being "Tora! Tora! Tora!"), they drastically modified numerous scenes for the Japanese distribution. In Japan (since at least the 1960's) the students aren't even taught how Japan started the war.