Apophis in S5 (spoilers)

[kelsi]

OK, after watching Threshold the other night, I was fascinated by Apophis' costume, mythology wise. What was his costume supposed to represent? It seemed to have feathers on or something... what's that got to do with the Egyptian snake god Apophis? And what was up with the scarab beetles on his breastplate thingy? Any ideas on what that's supposed to represent?

 

[HeyLynny]

I dunno?

Good question.....I have absolutely no idea. I can't wait to hear what everyone else has to say...I'm sure someone out there has the answer.

 

[kelsi]

I noticed that in CoTG, he's wearing snakeskin, which is quite apropriate

 

[imported_storm]

Hey!

Not much activity in this forum lately( grr... those writers... give us more cultures...grrr etc).

This is an interestin question kelsi.
Without re-watchin the episode, I know that the link between serpent and bird exists in the creation myth of the Kiche Indians of Guatemala. ( i got this from a book by Lewis Spence(no infringement intended)). He says that in the Popol Vuh, Xpiyacoc and Xmucane are" the ancient serpents covered in green feathers."
And for some reason, this idea is stuck in my head that there was somethin similar in Egypt.
Mabey im gettin confused with the frogs and serpents in the Hermopolian Ogdoad. (but im sure i saw somethin...)

Anyway, im startin to confuse myself, mabey its cos birds and snakes both come from eggs(!), i dunno.

my brain is gettin tired, im gonna go think about this.(itll probably keep me awake!)

ST:rain:RM

 

[kelsi]

I think I know who you're talking about storm; the feathered serpent of something? Quetzalcoatl? Or am I on a totally different wavelength?

 

[imported_storm]

Yeah, thats it! The same book also says that birds and serpents come together in Ra, as well as Quetzalcoatal. Which is interesting because they (Ra and Apoohis) were supposed to be enemies, but doesnt really answer you question in any way! Sorry.
(btw, how is Quetzalcoatal pronounced?)

ST:rain:RM

 

[kelsi]

How it's pronounced...

Exactly as you say it. Quet (kwet) zal (sall) co (ko) at (at) l (like the ll in full). You sound every letter; quite a mouthful, just like most other Aztec gods!

 

[Hungry]

Scarab bettles were featured in the the movie "the mummy" as well - does neone know wot them symbolised in the Egyptian culture ?

 

[imported_storm]

I think they were asociated with the god Ra, because they are a type of dung beetle, and symbolised the movement of the sun across the sky.

 

[Dendarah]

The feathered serpant comes from the nocturnal voyage of Ra, but it depends on which kingdom you research. In some of the myths during the older kingdom the serpant is feathered while in later periods it is a plain serpant without its feathers, but the feathered serpant is usually dipicted as a barque of some kind in Egyptian Mythology ususally riden by Ra or Horus (or major deity).

 

[Hungry]

ah ...........:alienooh:

 

[kelsi]

But whats the symbology of the feathers? I thought that was only an Aztec thing?

 

[Dendarah]

Nope, most people don't know the feather thing because it comes in the Old Kingdom, which unfortunately, other then the pyramids many look over. The barque which Ra flys over the sky during the day as the sun uses these feathered serpants (hence the wings) and when he journey's down in the dark after life he uses the barque as well to be re-born the next day. It is an odd assortment serpants and feathers but it is documented in very old scrolls, with the story of Ra and his daily journey through the sky.:rolly2:

 

[kelsi]

Do you know where any textual refernces are? Like, in the Book fo the Dead, or something?

 

[Dendarah]

Nope, not too much about the barque with the feathered serpant is recorded because it was in such an early period of Egyptian myth only a few reliefs are able too be seen with this picture but it came out of the creation myth of Ra traveling over the sky as the sun and traveling into the underworld. As time goes on the serpant loses its importance especially when Aphophis is concerned. In the Book of the Earth God, Book of the two ways, Book of the Gate, and Book of the Caverns the feathered serpant is taken away from the barque because know when Ra is in Amduat (when he is in the underworld for twelve hours/ twelve realm) he is constanlty attacked by Apophis, so this myth continued on too the latest dynasty. But a featherd serpant is sometimes shown being riden by Horus, I've only seen a couple of these reliefs on very remote temples such as Badari, and Hamamiyeh which are really close to each other. The middle and new dynasty take on this myth can be seen on papyrus, most are in the Cario museum, the most well known is from 900Bc, during the Twenty first dynasty. Unfortunately as Dynasties changed and Kingdoms left behind their own beliefs everything changed to suit the needs of the pharoahs and people, so that's why the feathered serpant was lost first it was a sign of strength, then danger then evil when it concerned Apophis. Very few snakes have such pull pretty much the asp and the cobra are respected as a sign of strength and the snakes of Ra (cobras, asps protecters of the pharoah).

 

[kelsi]

I'll take your word for it ...

I can kind of understand the symbolism of a feathered sperpent as regards Horus (him beign mostly a bird), but with other, I don't really understand why, especially with Ra and Apophis (although I agree they might be depicted as serpents, or asps or something).