Will women destroy "Stargate"?

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What an article! It described my feelings for DJ to the "T". I'm one of the females that feels that Stargate without Daniel Jackson is like Star Trek without Spock. I haven't seen this "Meridian" episode yet being the U.S. but it will be my last if DJ is not coming back!! Thanks for the article link, its good to know that I'm not alone in my feelings about this.:crying: :angry: :crying: :angry:
 
I did actually take the time to send a reply, so annoyed was I by this article. I absolutely cannot see the point of everyone deserting the show over this.

The letter that I sent to Salon has now been taken away, since it caused too many problems and I personally am not able to deal correctly with the comments made in subsequent postings.

Should anyone be curious as to why this argument has raged and wish to know what the contents of the letter are, please PM or email me privately and I will send a copy to you. Personally I don't think it's that important really for anyone to want to make the effort to know. It was just a letter to Salon stated my feelings which are well documented elsewhere anyway.
 
Interesting letter Anni.

I read the Salon article with interest. However, I noticed they focused on the loss of Shanks as the main reason the ratings have dropped. I think the ratings decline has a lot more to do with the abandonment of the original premise than anything else.

Of course, the reason the premise was changed was to attract the sacred 'young male demographic', or in other words "women over 25 can just **** off and die".

This, more than anything else, is why I'm so pissed. I really don't know why MGM is so surprised they've lost the core audience. They told us to take a hike, and guess what, we did!

Also, Corin Nemic is supposed to be a hunk! Get real, I thought he was bland and ordinary looking 12 years ago when he played Parker Lewis, and honestly, I can't say either his acting skills or his looks have improved since then.
 
I still can't believe they'd do that to Daniel! Not that I'm some one who watches the show simply because of him, but he was a great character. He gave balance between Jack and Sam, being the scientist you can understand.

I appreciate where you're coming from Anni, and I agree with you on most accounts. But killing off one of the main characters in a show isn't a wise decision unless it's the last episode. Similar to X-Files dilemma. They 'killed' Mulder and this caused a wide spread reaction of disgust amongst quite a number of fan, myself being one of them.

DJ was the only civilian on the show, so he gave a different perspective to what was happening. I look at it and say 'Hey, that's exactly what I would do!'

I haven't seen how Daniel went out, since none of the television stations in my area show SG-1 regularly, so I can't criticize that. However, I'm pretty touchy about killing people off now that X-Files messed itself up. I think that MGM made a wrong move, and now I can't help but wonder if they're going to kill everyone off, if the characters are all expendable.
 
Anni, you have your opinion and I have mine. I liked the show for my reasons and you liked it for yours as did a million other women. But for someone who talks about "rantings and ravings," "growing-up" and name calling shouldn't be talking "mature" in the same sentence. And by the way, I'm in my late 40's and I do consider myself to be mature enough to know what I like and what I don't like. Entertainment, whether it be scifi, drama, comedy, etc. is there to do just that, entertain, whatever you may find entertaining in a show others may watch the very same show and find something totally different entertaining and when the show stops being entertaining they have the right (which we are blessed with) to voice their opinion no matter what it may be. So I reiterate, you have your opinions and I have mine, and we never will always agree with each other but we should respect each other's opinion out of human decency.
 
Originally posted by Anni
The mystery of the Stargate and how it might explain anomalies in earth’s history and prehistory. The linking of this with one of the worlds greatest mysteries and fascinations……Ancient Egypt and its religions and lifestyles, something we just keep getting tantalising glimpses of in real life.
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I agree with virtually everything you say in that letter Anni especially the bit I've extracted above. I didn't start watching Stargate SG-1 becuase of the cast, I watched it because of the concept. I think that there are still alot of fans that would agree on this point.

The Poll on my site http://www.sg-1.co.uk/pollnow/pollnow.cgi?Poll=pollnow9 shows the Characters top with 48% but the Concept comes second with 24.7% (still a high slice of the cake).

So Daniel's out of it for a while - perhaps this injects a little realism - even spock died ! how many lives does a cat have afterall - Daniel has had a fair number of close shaves in his time at the SGC.

It's a shame to see him go but fans have got to realise Stargate has a unique opportunity with Season 6 to return to the style people who were there from the beginning really love.

I really don't want to be mourning all through Season 6 - life goes on - so must Stargate SG-1 !

<phew>
 
Originally posted by Anni
If it does offend some people
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...

Please take a damper, Anni, and while you're at it, please cut the young a little slack. The fact that you mention possibly offending some people seems to indicate that you knew your post would do precisely that. In which case, why press the ‘submit' button? Why set out to hurt people? I thought this was supposed to be a friendly and supportive forum. Was I so wrong?

Your disparaging invective, "the hysterical ramblings of an obsessional, hormonal female fan population who are screaming and ranting" was based on a sweeping and unsupportable generalization which I found as insulting as it was offensive, likewise the suggestion that anyone who regrets the demise of Dr. Jackson regarded him merely as "eye candy". That belittles both the actor and the audience.

You point out that there are other characters in ‘Stargate S.G.1' besides Daniel Jackson. True. There are likewise other interesting characters in ‘Great Expectations' besides Philip Pirrip, but I don't think the story would read nearly so well if he ‘ascended' three-quarters of the way through the book. As O'Neill said in ‘Fire and Water':

"Daniel Jackson *made this place happen*. As a member of SG-1, he was our voice, our conscience. He was a very courageous man. He was a good man. For those of us lucky enough to know him, he was also a friend."

**From the very beginning, his specialist knowledge made him the sine qua non of the Stargate Project.

You write of "The mystery of the Stargate and how it might explain anomalies in earth's history and prehistory. The linking of this with one of the worlds greatest mysteries and fascinations……Ancient Egypt and its religions and lifestyles, something we just keep getting tantalising glimpses of in real life."

Who do you think was the focus of those storylines? A special operations colonel, a theoretical astrophysicist, an alien warrior - or a geek with doctorates in archaeology/anthropology and linguistics? Which is why I for one think his departure will result in a programme, which used to be refreshingly different, falling back into the following pack of formulaic S.F. government cover-ups and military shoot-'em'-ups. Gak!

As for the proposed substitute, it will indeed be interesting to see what hoops the scriptwriters jump through to make the remains of S.G.1 show trust in, and accept as a replacement, someone whom they've only just met and who betrayed his world - with far less reason than Teal'c - by *stealing* Naquadrium to buy his way into their favours?! The shallowness is terrific...

Best wishes,
Hatshepsut - currently a *very* mature student reading Classics and whose earlier University career took her into experimental atomic physics and quantum physics.
--
 
Women will abandon Stargate so fast that heads will spin. That's what I'm hearing here. That's what I've seen happen to good shows the last ten years.

Some will leave because Daniel is gone. Some will leave because Sam Carter hasn't developed much as a female role model and gets belittled by every shipper nuance that's thrown into a episode. Some will leave because the stories aren't about the Stargate, universe and discovery.

The producers are being blamed for a lot. I sort of agree. Watch the special interview with RDA on the region one DVD. He's on about presenting exciting stories. So did Chris Carter his first year on the X-Files. Sadly, TV stories that get a lot of Internet coverage take on a life of their own. Ones that come out of the cult closet are doomed the moment the suits want to attract the money-spending young men. I've seen that happen on Earth: Final Conflict. It began as a "woman heavy" show due to a "older" male lead. It was billed to have a long and involved plot. By episode one of season two, that man was gone and an ex-soap star was in his place! They quietly covered up any interest and challange with his being half-alien and dumbed down the plot. The show's original strong female lead which was kept only stayed on until her "real life" became more important (like MS), she was replaced with a super-model like blonde.

I've held the opinion that SG is doomed because the cast was kept small and anyone we cared about was killed off or became arrested as part of the NID clean out in "Shades of Grey." A few more blue-eyed blonds for the women to cheer for would have helped. Giving some of the other "eye-candy" second stringers would have helped. The only ones they tried was Colin Cunningham's character and McBeath's.

The producers have woven thier rope. Now they gotta climb it, or hang. One thing for sure is the women are there to kick the chair out.
 
I hesitate to post again, but it is with a question for CynVision.

In the light of your opinion about why the show is doomed, if as the Salon article stated that Stargate was considered to be the next big series like Star Trek, why do you think Star Trek actually achieved it? What has Stargate done wrong compared with Star Trek, or is it just that the two shows are so different and perhaps appeal to different audiences?

I think it's a shame that the show has dwindled to the extent that the women can kick the chair from underneath it, I really do. It had such promise..... it had the promise to be many things to many people.

Sorry if what I am saying here offends anyone, I am just interested in CynVision's view.
 
Originally posted by Anni
I hesitate to post again, but it is with a question for CynVision.

In the light of your opinion about why the show is doomed, if as the Salon article stated that Stargate was considered to be the next big series like Star Trek, why do you think Star Trek actually achieved it
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Star Trek spent almost two decades in limbo before reemerging as Next Generation. Didn't they give Rodenbery the best effects people and a lot of lattitude because the original series had ideas and directions that no one else could have pictured or pulled off? They gave him this because the original series stood the test of time so well it was still rerunning in 1980.

Another thing I go on about when comparing ST to SG is the Next Generetion did a very clever thing with making a large ensemble cast. They mixed up the storylines and characters. ST:Enterprise is doing a lot of the same. In no way is it panning out to be "the Scott Bakula hour" the way SG has always been "the RDA Hour." A lot of episodes on Enterprise give a huge chunk of time to the talented unknowns they've signed on.

I'm thinking the Salon writer might be a bit weird. Sure, SG:Atlantis might be a like thing to ST:Mall in Space. But I wouldn't count on it happening in 2003. How about a whole new producing team in 2015? To me, that is far more likely. Does PdL have a child with a directing bent? That to me is far more possible a time frame. Holding your breath for this is to actually happen is bad for your health. :D

People are pointing fingers that all our trouble is because Glassner has pulled back some influence over the show. I'd say enjoy the final season while it's on. There isn't a holy vision infused into the producers driving Stargate SG-1 like that Rodenbery left the following ST series young producers after his death. SG-1 producers are more like five cats wrestling in the middle of a living room floor.
 
Word of Caution:

Almost everyone is aware that there is a battle raging between some of the Daniel Jackson fans and some of the fans that can envision Stargate without him. Some people have been threatened, some people on both sides feel that they can't voice their opinion without being verbally attacked, and some people just don't care one way or another.

Let's all try to remember that differing viewpoints are always welcomed here on ASciFi. However when posts become scathing and there is flaming of one person or group, that's when the moderators and admins will have to step in and put a stop to it.

Tell us your opinions, tell us what you're thinking, what you're feeling, but remember that others also have opinions, others are also thinking and feeling. Their opinions, their thoughts, their feelings are no less valid than yours. Take a step back, look at it from the other side before you hit submit. If after doing that you feel that you would be angered or hurt by what you just said, don't send it. We're here to exchange ideas, not blows.

Cheers,
 
To CynVision

Thanks for that. It's more or less what I thought too! I did notice that Enterprise is treating the storylines and their characters quite sensitively.

I liked the five cats wrestling on the living room floor analogy!

:cool:
 
Point 1. I probably fit into the target audience. I'm 17, female, and interested in the Classics and languages myself. A large part of why I like the show.

2. I do not object to 'eye candy' and would be stupid to do so. However, I do not find it a vitally important part of SG-1 or any show.

3. Losing any main character is hard on a show. Fact. And it can be sad. But it moves it on, and he isn't lost. He can come back.... duh...

4. Yes, a lot of mythology has gone. And Sam isn't the role model she could be. And a lot is not what it could. But i and you don't write for the show. it happens:(

5. What I do object to is personal flames. Please do not resort to insulting another person.

6. Each to their own. if you don't like my views, its alright, cos I do:)
 
Originally posted by Skip
4. Yes, a lot of mythology has gone. And Sam isn't the role model she could be. And a lot is not what it could. But i and you don't write for the show. it happens:(
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Someone ought to write an article on why realistic women introduced on the show are slammed.
like:
1. Laria made a move on O'Neill and she's booed at Gatecon when the Laria clips are shown. (There's another actor that might be intimidated from appearing at Gatecon, folks.)
2. And why does that young woman cadet get so bashed?
We women are sure critical.
 
One thing: FLAMING IS A STUPID THING. Mything, I think its getting out of hand:( Cant peopel discuss rationally?
 
Spetlana......it was actually quite sincere. I don't care whether you disagree with my opinion over Stargate at all, you are allowed to do that.

But the comments you made about my illness did very much hit home and have caused me a great deal of distress and certainly given me pause to rethink my involvement in the fan aspect of the show.

I can't give you my cross.....not even if you desperately needed the wood. I can't think why you would want it anyway. If contemplating my own death from something which was hardly my fault offends you then I do most sincerely apologise, I assure you.

You are not inside my head and are not feeling or seeing what I am feeling. I do not wish to defend my reality to you.

Should you wish to continue this apparent desire of yours to personally rub salt in the wound, then please PM me or email me privately and I will be delighted to oblige you.

Hatshepsut, I said I was sorry, I meant it and there is no need to keep hammering the point home. I will delete the letter and if anyone wants to know what I said they can email me and I will give them a copy. Does that make you feel better?

However, let us at least go back to the point of the thread for the sake of everyone else.
 
I started watching Stargate because I enjoyed the film.

I did not know any of the stars of SG1. Had sort of heard about RDA because of MacGuyver but never actually saw him in it.

I do really enjoy the show and would not have started collecting the DVD's otherwise. In one respect SG1 may lose something now that MS has left but the show did not revolve around him, it involved the other characters too.

If some people do not continue to watch SG1 mainly due to the fact that MS has left then that is their choice. I for one will continue to watch it regardless. If we do get another star to replace MS then lets hope he/she does not get slagged off because they don't fill MS's boots.

Thats all I have to say BUT at the end of the day it is each to their own opinion.


annette
 
What we should see is that Anni is right about the bias of the article. No opposing view what so ever was sought by the article writer. Salon is not supporting real journalism putting this article out this way. Not unless this is the start of a series of articles coveing the show in depth! Now for that I'd pay site fees!

This was as cheezy as the "pet" interviewer the studio keeps and trots out to submit "interviews" of the SG-1 people. Tomisana what's her name... :D
 
We can't play nice, we close the thread and delete a few of the posts that, to be honest, were pretty insensitive.

Sorry folks.

Cheers,
 
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