Daredevil

[ray gower]

Matt Murdock has a number of problems. First he is a attorney (well everybody has to eat), the second was the promise to his father that he would never use violence to solve a problem, the third and slightly more serious is that he is blind.

Despite these small, but significant, obstacles he has the urge to read the great cities of crime and avenge the death of his father.

How? Obvious really. One don's a red lycra body suit, with a DD emblazoned on the chest (ominously looking like the motif of a very bad fizzy beer that sparked that sparked the Campaign for Real Ale into life). Convince yourself that in the funny suit you are not Matt Murdock so can brain anybody you like, and that not being able to see means that you can fall from buildings and catch any stray drainpipes that you can't see, but will obviously be there.

Or at least that was idea for Marvel superwriter Stan Lee and artist Bill Everett in 1964. What followed were a series of ever more increasingly unlikely stories, drawn by an ever increasing range of artists, that kept the series alive, but never really hitting a high spot, even with the Black Widow as a partner from 1970, right upto 1979, When Frank Miller took over and turned Daredevil into a far darker character, though not necessarily improving the stories, before moving on to better things.

Daredevil is still in production and is shortly to be the subject of a film (14 Feb 2003)

Sources
http://www.toonopedia.com/daredevl.htm
http://www.1earth.com.au/comicbook/daredevil.html
http://www.gottawiz.com/Comics/Marvel/Daredevil/Daredevil.htm
http://www.geocities.com/cheeksilver/daredevil1.htm

 

[ray gower]

Daredevil Vs Superman

On the face of it Daredevil and Spiderman are very similar. Both nerds in their non-superhero persona, both from the same deranged pen, both make death defying defying feats of acrobatics.

Just that DD has never really matched the popularity of Spiderman. Strangely though it has always managed to be consistent in its placings in the comics hit parade, where as Spiderman has waxed and waned.

Any thoughts?

from http://internettrash.com/users/jl/news4home.html
Storyline:
Over the last couple of months, the Spiderman comics have been staying pretty much on the same storyline, and that is, Mary Jane's death, and how it effects Peter. Daredevil's storyline has been constantly moving, and that gives more entertainment to the reader.

If Spiderman wants to regain his lead at the top, they need to start giving better plots that change often and don't stay in one place.
Conclusion: Daredevil wins

Enemies:
Spiderman comics have always had very effective and interesting enemies, and they are all different, which gives the reader more variety.

Daredevil has some variety as well, but the enemies aren't making the cut. They just aren't as fun and exciting as Venom, the Green Goblin and the rest of the bunch.
Conclusion: Spiderman wins

Characters:
Characters can make or destroy a comic. If a comic doesn't have any characters to fill in the background, like J.J. or Robby Robertson, then it has no depth, and the story is to unrealistic to the point that it isn't fun, and tends to get very boring.

Spiderman comics always have alot of characters in the background. It makes the story fun, and gives the comic, not just the superhero's life, but it tells about other character's lives as well. It's really neat when you think about it.

Daredevil comics also have alot of characters. They have done just about as good with that as the Spiderman comics.
Conclusion: Tie

Art:
The last few issues of Spiderman, Peter Parker, and the Amazing, have been very well drawn. They give Spiderman the actual spider feel and look. That's the way he was meant to be drawn. But, since we're going back to plain, normal John Romita Jr., things will be back to normal, which means Spiderman art, will look like any other superhero's.

Daredevil, recently, has had some great artwork with new views and ways of looking at things. They've been doing a real good job.
Conclusion: Daredevil wins

The Past:
Spiderman, has really been more succesful in the past, why should we leave him just because his comic is going through rough times. The art will get better, artists change, so do writers, so the story will get better too!

Daredevil has done alot worse in the past. He hasn't always been in the spotlight. He's getting his turn to shine, but things change. Spiderman will regain his spot at the top.
Conclusion: Spiderman wins

 

[imported_iBrian]

Don't forget the Frank Miller (Batman: Dark Knight Returns; etc) adaption - I have that in graphic novel format and, as should be expected from Miller, it's rather bl**dy good.

 

[Tabitha]

HOw on earth did I manage to miss this thread? I devoured all the Daredevil TPBs I could find last year, and I rate them very highly. Frank Miller's run on Daredevil some 20 years ago is what really made this character such a central part of the marvel stable.

Daredevil has always seemed to me to be much closer to DC's Batman. The angst and the depressing events that occur in these character's lives (in between the fantastical adventures) seem to make them a lot more human than Spiderman or Superman. Even though they have incredible skills and/or powers, they are fundamentally flawed characters that we can identify with on a closer level than the happier-go-lucky types.


If you are interested in getting into more recent Daredevil, perhaps to get a taste of what the movie might be like, may I humbly recommend having a look at Kevin Smith's (Of Dogma, Jay and Silent Bob, Clerks and Mallrats fame) work on the title from a few years back. I never would have read the Miller stuff if I hadn't picked up Smith's run first.

Daredevil Visionaries: Kevin Smith

Marvel's Daredevil is supposed to be one of the better written comics out there. From 1979-1982 Frank Miller (of Dark Knight Returns fame) took over writing of Daredevil and saved a minor character. The series was languishing in poor sales and apparently close to being cancelled. Daredevil began life as a Stan Lee creation in the 60s. Many consider Daredevil to be Marvel's finest creation. In many ways he is Marvel's Batman. While he does technically have some superpowers they are fairly minimal compared to many superheroes. He lost his sight and the rest of his senses operate at a heightened level. He fights relatively weak villains. The X-Men and Fantastic Four fight virtual gods. Daredevil fights crimelords.

In 1998 Marvel launched a new imprint (Marvel Knights) and a second Daredevil series. Kevin Smith was tapped to write an 8-issue story. Marvel reissued those 8 issues in one of their "Visionaries" collections.

I don't really know the Daredevil story at all but I picked up most of it as I went along from this story. Apparently Matt Murdock saved a guy once or something from a speeding truck. He lost his sight but some "isotope" heightened the rest of his senses to superlevels. (He can hear heartbeats, for instance.) By day, Matt Murdock is a high-powered but big-hearted lawyer. By night he is Daredevil who prowls the streets of New York's Hell's Kitchen saving the little guy from the big bad guy.

The basic story starts out pretty good although it unravels a little bit at the end. Matt Murdock is a lapsed Catholic, pretty much like Kevin Smith himself. Recently Matt's girlfriend up and left one day ("Dear John...."). One day he comes across a girl who is being chased by a mysterious group. The girl claims he baby was conceived immaculately. An angel in a dream tells her Matt Murdock is Daredevil and she gives him the baby for protection. She says the baby is the saviour come again. A representative from the mystery group shows up and says the baby is the anti-Christ. An old flame comes back into his life. The old girlfriend shows up again. Bullseye shows up. The old girlfriend gets killed. Daredevil finally saves the baby, unravels the mystery, etc, etc. But what is up with the villain letting the child go? That didn't make much sense. Daredevil didn't know where the kid was, the kid was going to die. Did the bad guy have a sudden change of conscience before blowing his brains out? This didn't make much sense to me.

The writing is pretty good and the art is fantastic. They do a really good job of conveying action in what is essentially a "talking" story. I like how they focus (a little bit, not much, granted) on how Daredevil is essentially a "second stringer". He'll never be a Superman or Green Lantern. I really like a lot of this newer style of comic art. It seems like they use shadow and colors in more interesting ways. Maybe that is just me, though.

It has made me want to read more of Daredevil, though. Some of the plot stuff went over my head because I'm not familiar with the characters and story lines. Like who was the final villain? And why was he ****ed at Spiderman? The world may never know. I don't know if the other story arcs are as interesting or drawn to my taste but I suppose we'll find out. Marvel has several other Daredevil Visionaries volumes out from the first Frank Miller era. And I think the Essential Daredevil compiles the first few issues of the original comic (albeit in black and white and not the original color

[From http://www.ryoohki.net/mt/inhale/archives/review/000122.html]

Sorry - I couldn't find a third person review that was as detailed. Lovely art, interesting and adult story. I urge you to read it.


Further ascifi chat about the forthcoming movie can be found here:
http://www.ascifi.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16530
http://www.ascifi.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12705

(ominously looking like the motif of a very bad fizzy beer that sparked that sparked the Campaign for Real Ale into life).

Ray, you crack me up, and yet you have a point. Have you seen the movie trailers yet? Can't imagine Camra doing something so bold as creating flaming symbols on the ground in scary inner-city areas

 

[ray gower]

Originally posted by Tabitha
HOw on earth did I manage to miss this thread?

I was beginning to wonder too! :rolly2:

Ray, you crack me up, and yet you have a point. Have you seen the movie trailers yet? Can't imagine Camra doing something so bold as creating flaming symbols on the ground in scary inner-city areas

Camra were never much into flaming symbols, more soggy ones, ceremoniously breaching kegs of DD and Watneys
Happy to report I saw one set of trailers whilst waiting for The Two Towers to start, even started a thread for you in to get excited about in Films. (You missed that too! )

Some rumours suggest it is going to be better than Spiderman!

Currently trying to track down enough to look at the original Daredevil

 

[Tabitha]

I must have missed your film thread because I had a few others on the go! Sorry Ray

As a point of interest you may like to know that the trade paperback collection of Kevin Smith's Daredevil stories has an introduction from none other than Daredevil himself, Ben Affleck. I can't help feeling very positive about the film when I know that both the star and the director are huge fans of the character

 

[ray gower]

OT

Originally posted by Tabitha
I must have missed your film thread because I had a few others on the go! Sorry Ray

There was I thinking I was right up there and 'With It', ahead of the great Tabitha, rather than my customary 5 years behind!

 

[Tabitha]

Yep, I have been obsessed by this movie since the first pics leaked out last April!

Can't wait, Looks like it is going to kick butt!

 

[ray gower]

Finished looking up Silverstreaks original Daredevil and put him here http://www.ascifi.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16652 to keep this thread free

 

[L. Arkwright]

I think one of the best american comic stories I have ever read was Daredevil Reborn. I liked Daredevil before this series but thought it was fantastic after and how the character was re-invented sensibly.