Matrix Timeline ...thoughts (SPOILERS)

[cersei]

Since I have read some confused thoughts about the actual time in the Matrix/Zion, here are my views (based on MIM-Matrix within a Matrix theory)

The Matrix and Zion runs in 100 year cycles. After looking at other types of timeline (including a perfect one) the Architect decides on 1900ish-2000ish....why? because as Smith puts it in first film, it is the "peak" of human civilisation...The first film takes place in 1999 and this one is around 2000 (or late 1999 anyway) since it is now about 6 months after that film (freed more mind in those last 6 months)

Also it is stated, Zion is about 100 years old and Morpheus thinks the world is about 2199 in first film....this would be accurate if if it indeed the first Zion...but it is really the 6th version hence more likely year 2699 though the Matrix remains 1999.

It does seem strange though that 23 individuals can propagate (including continuing to free new minds) to 250,000 people by end of 100 years....any sociologist able to tell me if this is scientifically possible?

 

[Tabitha]

Ok, I got some questions. And bear in mind that I am almost certain that the scenario is a Matrix-within-a-Matrix - but I think that the unplugged humans have to believe that the Real World exists, and that Zion is a part of it.

1) Where did you get the 100 year cycle bit from? I doubt that this can be the situation, because, as you mention at the end of your post, there is some doubt as to whether within one hundred years 23 people could create a Zion as large as they have. Childbirth is one factor, but even if every woman who was of childbearing age was ALWAYS pregnant, and a lot of people were unplugged, I find it unlikely that the thousands depicted in the Zion party scene could be mustered within one hundred years.

There are other factors against a one hundred year cycle - the last "One" would have lived for much of it. This fits with Morpheus' favourite prophecies, but Morpheus spoke of the previous "One" as being from a very long time ago, whereas if we were talking about a one hundred year cycle, chances are Morpheus would have known him as a young boy. And the Councillor who speaks with Neo? Must be around 60 - if we are talking one hundred years, he MUST have known some of the original 23.

Also, why would the previous "One" propagate the Oracle's propecies in a newly constructed Zion? Wouldn't it be better to tell the free humans the truth, and with this knowledge - i.e. knowing that the Architect exists and how the Matrix operates, they might have a better chance at successfully destroying it the next time around.

The fact that the freed humans believe that it is not that long after the original war with the Machines, and the fact that their hardware (Morpheus' ship) has apparently got a 21st or 22nd Century date stamp adds to the idea that what they believe to be the Real World is in fact another level of the Matrix. If there have indeed been 5 previous anomalous "Ones", even with the one hundred year cycle you mention, we are talking a long way beyond the war with the machines - would the ships and equipment last that long?




Arg. I am very confused by all this. but you know what? I think the Architect was lying.
Why would he have to give the "One" a choice based on reality? If the options are so limited, why does he need to tell the truth?

 

[cersei]

Let me help explain

well here are my explanations, Tabitha

100 years if taken from the way Zion has stood for about a hundred years to date (can't remember where or even which movie but I think it is mentioned). 100 does make numerical sense to a machine as well.

Each "the One" only arises towards the end of a cycle (ie a Thomas Anderson is born say about 70 years into a cycle if hundred year cycle is correct) as the anomaly builds up in each reload. When the One enters the source his code is reintegrated and that process helps choose (whether consiously or not I am not sure) the next 23 in new version of Zion...so that older version of the One is effectively terminated. Therefore, though (presumably by Oracle) legend spreads of another "One" whom freed the first of us, this is only legend for Morpheus. That is also why this previous One does not have a chance to tell anyone what he found at the end with th Architect. As Neo pointed out to the Architect, either no one knows or on one ever had chance to tell anyone of the Architect.

Can't be sure if Counciller Hahn is one of first 23...and if he was, he did make mention of being asleep his first 11 years or so ie he was freed that age. So he would be very old if it is hundred years.

I agree with your assessment that indeed that Nebucanezzer is made in 22nd centruy further reinforces idea of Matrix within a Matrix.

As for Architect lying, I am (somehow hehe) convinced that 2 general rules the Machines (Oracle and Architect anyway)seem to abide by:

1) They never Lie

2) They have to provide a Choice (albeit in most cases, artificial and events conspire to induce a certain choice over another)

 

[Dave]

Originally posted by cersei
I agree with your assessment that indeed that Nebucanezzer is made in 22nd centruy further reinforces idea of Matrix within a Matrix.

I'm not sure of that....

The Nebucanezzer name plate clearly says that it was built in the USA in 2069. I guess that would still be possible if it was built during the man-machine wars, then the Matrix was booted-up at an earlier Time Period to that in which the surviving humans were living.

I guess it is also possible that the Matrix runs for longer than 100 years. I thought 100 years based on the fact that it was 1999 inside the Matrix, but that Morpheus thought it was really 2199, and Agent Smith saying that 1999 was chosen as being the peak of human civilisation. But it could have already been running for 100 years previous to 1999. The peak of human civilisation is a little vague, and Morpheus is already proved wrong on his dates.

 

[cersei]

Morpheus says it himself...

watched Matrix Reloaded again, Morpheus says in his speech in Zion, "We have fought the Machines for a hundred years"

As for Neb having been built in USA 2069, simpler still.....if you prescribe to Matrix within a Matrix theory.....

So in order to make Morpheus and others think they are fighting their first war, they make those hovercrafts to be supposedly made in that era.

Each Zion version is set in "2100's" so no matter which reboot, the Neb will have that date....