"Ayra"

T

timekiller

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so whata your thoughts on the fake ayra. Heres some of mine

1. Is she Jeanny Pool? <sp?> (i added that <sp?> just for you weirwood =P)
2. Will Jon go to the wedding and what will his reaction be when he sees that it isnt Ayra?
3. What will the boltons reaction be when they find out?
4. If Jon says that ant Ayra will they try to kill him?
5. What will be the reactions of the other living Starks be?
6. Will the Lords at White Harbour bring Rickon <sp?> to the wedding as a page or something? We havent seen anything of him for a while
7. Will any of the main southern Lords go to it i.e Lannasters, Tyrelle's <sp?> etc and so be present when Jon maybe revealls that it isn't Ayra
8. What will come of this?

i think im going on a bit now so i'll stop
 
AHHHHHHH!!!! Spelling? The thread is misspelled! Her name is Arya. Otherwise, it's all good. Oh, and the other girl's name is Jenne Pool. The houses are spelled Lannister and Tyrell.

Okay, spelling Nazi is gone. Good questions, I wish I had the answers.
 
timekiller said:
so whata your thoughts on the fake ayra. Heres some of mine

1. Is she Jeanny Pool? <sp?> (i added that <sp?> just for you weirwood =P)
2. Will Jon go to the wedding and what will his reaction be when he sees that it isnt Ayra?
3. What will the boltons reaction be when they find out?
4. If Jon says that ant Ayra will they try to kill him?
5. What will be the reactions of the other living Starks be?
6. Will the Lords at White Harbour bring Rickon <sp?> to the wedding as a page or something? We havent seen anything of him for a while
7. Will any of the main southern Lords go to it i.e Lannasters, Tyrelle's <sp?> etc and so be present when Jon maybe revealls that it isn't Ayra
8. What will come of this?

i think im going on a bit now so i'll stop
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1) probably.

2) No. One, he probably isn't aware of it and as far as he's concerned she's missing presumed dead.

Two, he has his duty to the watch and westeros.

Three, he's grown up a lot, he's no longer as big a fool as Ned. I doubt very much he'd walk into another red wedding. They have after all just betrayed and murdered his brother and step mother.


HOWEVER, there will, I am certain, be a titanic battle of the bastards at some point. Possibly after he learns his fave little sisters has just been married off to a treacherous, oath breaking, rapist/mutilator. Then there will be hell to pay :) :D

3) I'm certain they already know. And I’m equally certain they don't care. It doesn't even matter if everyone and moon boy knows. Anybody who knew arya intimately is dead, or banished to the wall. If the King and Lord Bolton say she's arya stark, whose going to disagree? Without incontrovertible proof, she IS arya stark.

4) If he is stupid enough to go the wedding, they will have to kill him. As he's just about the only person (that they know of) who can scupper their plans. Still, he's a traitors *******, so I wouldn't put it past them getting away with it even if he does out them. They are lords after all, he is no one.

5) "Oh, my sister's just been married to a guy whose favourite hobbies include: Burning down my ancestral home, murdering my small folk and retainers, oh, and he's also a semi professional taxidermist. How wonderful! We MUST send flowers!" :rolleyes:

6) Good god no! Well, if he's with that oaf manderly, possibly. but I have every confidence in Osha putting the fat tub of lard in his place. If the Bolton’s get even a whiff of rickon's whereabouts, they will turn all their might on crushing him. Ramsay is marrying "arya" because she is the heir to the north, if rickon lives her claim is invalidated.

7) I'm sure they all have much more important things to do frankly. Highgarden is infested with iron islanders, and the rest is in a god awful state. Honestly, I doubt they'd go in peacetime, I don't think the dreadfort is the most attractive of holiday destinations.;)

8) Well, it will come out eventually. That's a given. What then? Who knows? Martin's made such a big fuss about the horrifying consequences of oath breaking and king slaying I suspect the house of Bolton will only be a few steps behind the freys on the road to hell, but who will wield the blade? Could be any number of people. :)
 
tsw, I'm with you regarding spelling.

Jeyne Poole is almost certainly the fake Arya. This is revealed in either a Jaime or Cersei chapter. Someone comments or remembers that Littlefinger had the responisibility of dealing with Jeyne and that he is the one who produced the fake Arya. The person remembering also surmises that the fake Arya is the daughter of Vayon Poole, Ned Stark's steward. So unless Littlefinger is providing a fake Jeyne Poole to be the fake Arya (layers on layers of deception), then Jeyne is now Arya.

If any Lannisters or Lannister sympathizers recognize that Arya is fake, they probably won't say anything.

I would assume that Littlefinger and Roose Bolton are smart enough to not let Jon see Arya. Littlefinger may not know that Jon and Arya were exeptionally close, but he would know that Jon also knew Jeyne.

If any members of the Stark's household realize the truth, they should be smart enough to hold their tongues upon pain of death. But what if someone recognizes that Arya is not Arya and travels to The Wall to tell Jon and Stannis? This person would have needed to have been close to the Starks and to have held Eddard in deep respect, must have seen many of Ned's traits in Jon, must hold a grudge against the Bolton betrayal, and have heard that Jon was a hero in the defeat of Mance in order to make the journey to tell Jon this news.

If any nobles loyal to the Starks recognize Jeyne and if they want to be vocal about this, then trouble might arise. But in the end, might makes right in Westeros.
 
Boaz said:
tsw, I'm with you regarding spelling.

Jeyne Poole is almost certainly the fake Arya. This is revealed in either a Jaime or Cersei chapter. Someone comments or remembers that Littlefinger had the responisibility of dealing with Jeyne and that he is the one who produced the fake Arya. The person remembering also surmises that the fake Arya is the daughter of Vayon Poole, Ned Stark's steward. So unless Littlefinger is providing a fake Jeyne Poole to be the fake Arya (layers on layers of deception), then Jeyne is now Arya.
Click to expand...

How do I miss these things? I will now light myself on fire....

With my self-immolation done, the OP brings up some interesting points....the most glaring one in my not so humble opinion is the relationship between Whiteharbour and Stannis. Is the supposed exodus of Rickon and Osha to Whiteharbour related to the missive Cersei receives detailing the beheading of the Onion Knight? I find it hard to believe a POV would be beheaded off-screen like that, so I have to surmise that the OK hatched a plan of some sort to keep Rickon safe. Although why Manderly would trust Stannis I have no idea.

Any thoughts would be appreciated
 
Boaz said:
Jeyne Poole is almost certainly the fake Arya. This is revealed in either a Jaime or Cersei chapter. Someone comments or remembers that Littlefinger had the responisibility of dealing with Jeyne and that he is the one who produced the fake Arya. The person remembering also surmises that the fake Arya is the daughter of Vayon Poole, Ned Stark's steward. So unless Littlefinger is providing a fake Jeyne Poole to be the fake Arya (layers on layers of deception), then Jeyne is now Arya.
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Its stuff like this that makes me feel like Hodor. How the hell do you people even catch these details???? :p

At any rate, Im not keen to speculate. Let the story unfold as it will. GRRM does a better job than I!
 
Aegon and TG, don't beat yourselves up. This is the ONLY detail and semi-hidden plot development that I have caught in four books! I apologize for not having a specific citation for my answer. Hopefully, Raven or Werthead will see this thread, they'll post and clear it all up for us.
 
I remembered today that Arya spoke with Jaime when she left King's Landing for the North. I scoured all the Jaime chapters of AFFC and came up with zilch. So I looked for my copy of ASOS but could not find it. So I turned my attention to the Tower of the Hand website and found this.

http://www.towerofthehand.com/articles/a/0023/

It appears that this article has all the citations to fully fill out the Fake Arya = Jeyne Poole theory.
 
WTF. Now, we have to concern ourselves about a snivelling little girl named Jeyne Poole as a possible major plot line in the Jon, Arya, Sansa, Davos and possibly other (Rickon, Theon) POV's...Oh, GRRM enough with the details already!!! ;)

P.S. Nobody thought about Theon and that he would recognize Jeyne as being a fake would he not???
 
Good point TK, I think he should recognize her as she was at Winterfell. For that matter he would know Arya by sight and everyone knows he was Eddard's ward, so the Reeds will have to address that issue. Most likely with some wholesome flaying.
 
If we're going to carry conjecture all the way through- They only need to keep "Arya II" alive until she has her first child, say a year. Once she pops one out, they kill her and bury the evidence. I doubt they'll let Jon near her within that year, and I doubt he'll be able to get away from the wall now that he has "Barbarians at the Gate."

Was Jenne's father a Knight? It would be interesting if she was grabbed by the "good guys" as a "witness" against the Lannisters and the Boltons.

Also Sam met Brandon and without realizing it met the real Arya. I wonder if GM uses him to bring the whole family back together. GM could eaasily weave this in (as he writes 10 more books to finish the series, rake in the cash and tie Jordon).
 
the smiling weirwood said:
AHHHHHHH!!!! Spelling? The thread is misspelled! Her name is Arya. Otherwise, it's all good. Oh, and the other girl's name is Jenne Pool. The houses are spelled Lannister and Tyrell.

Okay, spelling Nazi is gone. Good questions, I wish I had the answers.
Click to expand...

ok you've gotta make a thread full of spellings just for me
 
timekiller said:
ok you've gotta make a thread full of spellings just for me
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I think you forgot the word "mistakes" after spelling (with no s). ;) (Unless I misunderstood what you actually meant by your post.)

Geeeesssh. What are they teaching these days. I guess, when you hear the way teenagers speak, you can't expect them to write a prose...:D
 
ummm yea...what he said...

its not my fault your only taught spellings up to primary 5 (i think its primary 4 in eng) then its all learning for transfer test (gives selection for secondary school so smarter kids get into better schools or somethin like that) which they're getting rid of now then in secondary all u do in english is plays, poetry, creative writing etc. (reading Of mice and men in english atm =D not a complete waste of time as usual).

Oh and if anyone even complains about my puncuation when i take over the world i'll drown them in cream cheese.

you've been warned
 
Wil said:
If we're going to carry conjecture all the way through- They only need to keep "Arya II" alive until she has her first child, say a year. Once she pops one out, they kill her and bury the evidence. I doubt they'll let Jon near her within that year, and I doubt he'll be able to get away from the wall now that he has "Barbarians at the Gate."

Was Jenne's father a Knight? It would be interesting if she was grabbed by the "good guys" as a "witness" against the Lannisters and the Boltons.

Also Sam met Brandon and without realizing it met the real Arya. I wonder if GM uses him to bring the whole family back together. GM could eaasily weave this in (as he writes 10 more books to finish the series, rake in the cash and tie Jordon).
Click to expand...
Wil, good points.

Yes, Jeyne Poole is as good as dead after she bears a son.

Jeyne's father was not a knight. But then again, many nobles in the north do not take the holy vows of the Seven. Ser Rodrik Cassel, Ser Jorah Mormont and all the Manderlys come to mind as those who are/were knighted. Neither Ned, Benjen, the Umbers, the Boltons, the Reeds, the Karstarks, nor even Jeor Mormont (iirc) were/are knighted. Poole seems to be a very minor house of the North.

And ties Jordan? Don't even joke about that!
 
Boaz said:
Wil, good points.

Yes, Jeyne Poole is as good as dead after she bears a son.

Jeyne's father was not a knight. But then again, many nobles in the north do not take the holy vows of the Seven. Ser Rodrik Cassel, Ser Jorah Mormont and all the Manderlys come to mind as those who are/were knighted. Neither Ned, Benjen, the Umbers, the Boltons, the Reeds, the Karstarks, nor even Jeor Mormont (iirc) were/are knighted. Poole seems to be a very minor house of the North.
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I was thinking that very thing. We have the rising potential of a Religious war. If that comes to fruition then poor Jeyne can testify all she wants and the faith will be able to ignore her. It will be to see how that addition division will impact the North. We have a hint of it at the Wall-The drunken Priest declaring Jon a savage who worships false gods.

p.s.
I fear the thought of a 15-book series, and so I joke. (I would rebel at 8, hunt down GM and Jordan, tie them together in a sack along with a 45 pound weight and drop them in the Hudson river.;) )
 
timekiller said:
3. What will the boltons reaction be when they find out?
Click to expand...
Something tells me that the Boltons are well aware of who they are receiving into their family. And that they feel that "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." The only person who is 100% sure that Arya has survived up to this point is Arya. Everyone else has only seen her for part of her journey.

Theon is a prisoner of the Bolton house, just as Jeyne Poole is. That is, if there is anything left of Theon other than a bit of leathery skin, at this point. As someone said, Jeyne is only necessary as long as she provides an heir.

This does bring another question to mind, however:
Roose Bolton married Fat Walda Frey as part of his deal with the Late Lord Frey. I'm sure there was some sort of inheritance drawn up for whatever children she bore him. This could cause some issues down the line, with the "Stark" heirs competing with the Frey heirs. Just food for thought... maybe Ramsey will be driven to do away with his old dad.
 
AryaUnderfoot said:
This could cause some issues down the line, with the "Stark" heirs competing with the Frey heirs. Just food for thought... maybe Ramsey will be driven to do away with his old dad.
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oh i hope so i would prefer Ramsey to his dad. All he did was burn winterfell and kill the smallfoalk and maester umm Luin... *whispers* little help with the spelling weirwood please* Oh and the stuff he did before that too.

where as his dad betrayed Robb, greywind, his mother, uncle, his lords all the northmen and riverlands men who were in the army. Thoose Lords who he sent to get killed by the badass himself Randyll Tarly and Ser Gregor, killing a third of Robb's strength. If not for Boltons support the red wedding wouldn't have happened and that third of Robbs strength would still live.

So I say go on Ramsey kill him
 
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