nightsavior
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 24, 2006
- Messages
- 48
How objectivism can seem noble but isn’t
Wizard’s first rule and Stone of Tears Examples
Yes, Terry Good-kind is an objectivist.
1. Richard helps Kahlan a mysterious girl being assaulted by a quad of thugs. This was non selfish. Richard risked his life to help Kahlan knowing very well he’d get nothing in turn and could die in the attempt. Thus it was not really in his best interest. This is perhaps one of his few unselfish acts in Goodkind’s book.
2. Richard helps the mud people fix their roofs. It was nice of him but the whole reason he is there is to have them call on their ancestors to get information about the boxes of Orden. By doing so he puts them at risk and while they’re gathered discussing things in a lodge outside the main villain Darken Rahl is slaughtering innocent people. Richard lets it happen with the justification he could “die” fighting Rahl and thus it is anti productive to his greater cause to defeat Rahl. The point is however Richard could have gotten information in other ways without sacrificing innocent people indirectly and even if he faces Rahl with the knowledge to stop him he still might fail just as he might have failed saving the mud people. In truth the knowledge of how to defeat Rahl was with him the whole time (Book of counted shadows) he just wasn’t clear on the meaning of every detail.
3. Giller the wizard is nice to a serving girl named Rachel. However since he has the lost Box of Orden Rahl seeks he is using Rachel to hide the box and spirit it away. You can argue once again Giller risked Rachel’s life for a greater cause but being a wizard means he might have been able to hide the box in other ways without risking her life. Once again we have something that seems noble and inherently good but is actually selfish.
4. Shota a beautiful prophetess confronts Richard and puts Kahlan in peril. Through all of it she tells Richard how now matter what he does charitable or otherwise it is selfish and in his best interest. She further tells him that is how it should be and he must be willing to kill any who get in his way even his friends. This is a very Randian outlook . Indeed the interaction of Shota and Richard can be perhaps substituted with Terry talking to Ayn Rand or seeing her as a goddess worthy of following. Regardless this is sickening in my opinion. We can further our causes without harming our friends even if they initially stand in our way. There are always other options. Patience can sometimes bring a solution with less consequences then being harsh and trigger happy. Also what if it is we who are wrong in our cause but our friends are right? We must always entertain that possibility.
5. Richard saves the egg of Scarlet , a majestic red dragon. Is Richard helping Scarlet because she is a caring mother coerced into helping Rahl because he took her egg? Is it because Dragons are rare and beautiful creatures worthy of saving? No on both counts. Richard needs to use Scarlet so she’ll fly him around so he can search for his friends. Though he maybe sympathetic to Scarlet his main motivation isn’t to help her just because it is the right thing to do.
6. Through clever manipulation Rahl has Richard captured. During this time he is tortured by mistress Denna a Mord Sith (Dominatrix skilled at arts of pain.) However by getting to know Denna intimately Richard realizes she has been abused and brain washed to be who she is yet deep down is a kind hearted loving individual. One of Rahl’s conditions is Richard can leave to find his friends but only if he kills Denna. Once again Richard could have manipulated events to save himself and Denna or perhaps deceive Rahl but he opts for the easy solution and runs Denna through with the sword of truth. Denna strangely goes along with all of this as if it is expected of her. Once again there is radical objectivists overtones. That we should elevate ourselves above others and sacrifice them for our personal needs.
7. Zedd the wizard knows the dangers of Richard becoming a seeker but bestows it upon him anyway. First of all wizards in fantasy are renowned for starting a hero on his way. They aren’t always selfish to do so. Yet Zedd’s motives are questionable. At nowhere does it say it takes a seeker to kill Rahl. If anything a confessor has far more importance to the boxes of orden. One could argue Richard is needed to protect Kahlan. She is after all the mother confessor. He also has knowledge of the book of counted shadows which gives descriptions about the boxes. (Zedd doesn’t really know this.) Put bluntly Zedd has a personal vendetta against Rahl. Rahl killed his wife and daughter. So he could be in fact using Richard to kill his arch rival. Later in Stone of tears Zedd heals a seer woman but only so she’ll tell him of the visions related to Richard. Would he have helped her just because she was a good person in pain? I don’t know really. Once again however most everything Zedd does is for his gain be it directly or indirectly. There is the slight debate that “no” everything he does is in fact to help Richard. However since Richard is the one in power at the end of Wizard’s first rule it is in Zed’s best interest to help Richard. Friends of celebrities and politicians do get a lot of perks after all.
8. The sisterhood of light arrive to help Richard control his blossoming magic. They say if he does not accept their aid his headaches will kill him. When Richard refuses help the first time one of the three sisters kills herself. In objectivism there is a strong underlying belief if you cannot be worthy of a certain task you should take your own life for the greater good. This is why many extreme objectivists maybe unsympathetic to failure or those who are handicapped and disabled. It seems that the saying “dust yourself off and try again” has no meaning to objectivists. If anything their code is more along the lines of “Do or die!”
9. In Wizard’s first rule Richard kicks out the teeth of a little girl called Violet. It should be noted Violet was a mean spirited brat. She told Richard that if her men got a hold of Kahlan she’d have those men rape her and then she’d personally have Kahlan shaved bald. The first thing I thought was that Richard was somewhat justified. Violet did after all have the “power” to do what she said. She was a princess and commanded authority. This made her a real threat. But then I also rationalized no eight year old girl I know or have known would be capable of being so vile. I’ve yet to know children for example that even know what rape is. Also it is obvious Violet’s behavior is much more the fault of Milena her mother. Though Richard may have somewhat been in a state of confusion and pain at the time he failed to see “the parent” was the real problem. Had he killed the queen instead and captured Violet he could perhaps have reformed her and raised her into a kind hearted woman. Young minds are still impressionable and capable of changing. Adult minds are normally not. Lastly even if Violet lived through having her teeth knocked out and her jaw shattered would she have recognized it as a moral lesson? Would suffering such a trauma encourage her to be good? Unfortunately it would not. The act was too extreme. If anything it would just have filled her with more hatred and loathing towards other human beings, especially men.
I could go on. I’m sure there are other instances in which Objectivism is symbolized. There might even be a few fleeting instances in the books in which Richard , Kahlan, or Zedd do kind things without expecting to get something in return. However I’ve rarely seen cases of it. It was sad how much I enjoyed these books before studying Objectivism. As much as I try I really don’t want to read the novels further as they are a narrow minded attempt to champion a self serving agenda.
Thoughts?
Wizard’s first rule and Stone of Tears Examples
Yes, Terry Good-kind is an objectivist.
1. Richard helps Kahlan a mysterious girl being assaulted by a quad of thugs. This was non selfish. Richard risked his life to help Kahlan knowing very well he’d get nothing in turn and could die in the attempt. Thus it was not really in his best interest. This is perhaps one of his few unselfish acts in Goodkind’s book.
2. Richard helps the mud people fix their roofs. It was nice of him but the whole reason he is there is to have them call on their ancestors to get information about the boxes of Orden. By doing so he puts them at risk and while they’re gathered discussing things in a lodge outside the main villain Darken Rahl is slaughtering innocent people. Richard lets it happen with the justification he could “die” fighting Rahl and thus it is anti productive to his greater cause to defeat Rahl. The point is however Richard could have gotten information in other ways without sacrificing innocent people indirectly and even if he faces Rahl with the knowledge to stop him he still might fail just as he might have failed saving the mud people. In truth the knowledge of how to defeat Rahl was with him the whole time (Book of counted shadows) he just wasn’t clear on the meaning of every detail.
3. Giller the wizard is nice to a serving girl named Rachel. However since he has the lost Box of Orden Rahl seeks he is using Rachel to hide the box and spirit it away. You can argue once again Giller risked Rachel’s life for a greater cause but being a wizard means he might have been able to hide the box in other ways without risking her life. Once again we have something that seems noble and inherently good but is actually selfish.
4. Shota a beautiful prophetess confronts Richard and puts Kahlan in peril. Through all of it she tells Richard how now matter what he does charitable or otherwise it is selfish and in his best interest. She further tells him that is how it should be and he must be willing to kill any who get in his way even his friends. This is a very Randian outlook . Indeed the interaction of Shota and Richard can be perhaps substituted with Terry talking to Ayn Rand or seeing her as a goddess worthy of following. Regardless this is sickening in my opinion. We can further our causes without harming our friends even if they initially stand in our way. There are always other options. Patience can sometimes bring a solution with less consequences then being harsh and trigger happy. Also what if it is we who are wrong in our cause but our friends are right? We must always entertain that possibility.
5. Richard saves the egg of Scarlet , a majestic red dragon. Is Richard helping Scarlet because she is a caring mother coerced into helping Rahl because he took her egg? Is it because Dragons are rare and beautiful creatures worthy of saving? No on both counts. Richard needs to use Scarlet so she’ll fly him around so he can search for his friends. Though he maybe sympathetic to Scarlet his main motivation isn’t to help her just because it is the right thing to do.
6. Through clever manipulation Rahl has Richard captured. During this time he is tortured by mistress Denna a Mord Sith (Dominatrix skilled at arts of pain.) However by getting to know Denna intimately Richard realizes she has been abused and brain washed to be who she is yet deep down is a kind hearted loving individual. One of Rahl’s conditions is Richard can leave to find his friends but only if he kills Denna. Once again Richard could have manipulated events to save himself and Denna or perhaps deceive Rahl but he opts for the easy solution and runs Denna through with the sword of truth. Denna strangely goes along with all of this as if it is expected of her. Once again there is radical objectivists overtones. That we should elevate ourselves above others and sacrifice them for our personal needs.
7. Zedd the wizard knows the dangers of Richard becoming a seeker but bestows it upon him anyway. First of all wizards in fantasy are renowned for starting a hero on his way. They aren’t always selfish to do so. Yet Zedd’s motives are questionable. At nowhere does it say it takes a seeker to kill Rahl. If anything a confessor has far more importance to the boxes of orden. One could argue Richard is needed to protect Kahlan. She is after all the mother confessor. He also has knowledge of the book of counted shadows which gives descriptions about the boxes. (Zedd doesn’t really know this.) Put bluntly Zedd has a personal vendetta against Rahl. Rahl killed his wife and daughter. So he could be in fact using Richard to kill his arch rival. Later in Stone of tears Zedd heals a seer woman but only so she’ll tell him of the visions related to Richard. Would he have helped her just because she was a good person in pain? I don’t know really. Once again however most everything Zedd does is for his gain be it directly or indirectly. There is the slight debate that “no” everything he does is in fact to help Richard. However since Richard is the one in power at the end of Wizard’s first rule it is in Zed’s best interest to help Richard. Friends of celebrities and politicians do get a lot of perks after all.
8. The sisterhood of light arrive to help Richard control his blossoming magic. They say if he does not accept their aid his headaches will kill him. When Richard refuses help the first time one of the three sisters kills herself. In objectivism there is a strong underlying belief if you cannot be worthy of a certain task you should take your own life for the greater good. This is why many extreme objectivists maybe unsympathetic to failure or those who are handicapped and disabled. It seems that the saying “dust yourself off and try again” has no meaning to objectivists. If anything their code is more along the lines of “Do or die!”
9. In Wizard’s first rule Richard kicks out the teeth of a little girl called Violet. It should be noted Violet was a mean spirited brat. She told Richard that if her men got a hold of Kahlan she’d have those men rape her and then she’d personally have Kahlan shaved bald. The first thing I thought was that Richard was somewhat justified. Violet did after all have the “power” to do what she said. She was a princess and commanded authority. This made her a real threat. But then I also rationalized no eight year old girl I know or have known would be capable of being so vile. I’ve yet to know children for example that even know what rape is. Also it is obvious Violet’s behavior is much more the fault of Milena her mother. Though Richard may have somewhat been in a state of confusion and pain at the time he failed to see “the parent” was the real problem. Had he killed the queen instead and captured Violet he could perhaps have reformed her and raised her into a kind hearted woman. Young minds are still impressionable and capable of changing. Adult minds are normally not. Lastly even if Violet lived through having her teeth knocked out and her jaw shattered would she have recognized it as a moral lesson? Would suffering such a trauma encourage her to be good? Unfortunately it would not. The act was too extreme. If anything it would just have filled her with more hatred and loathing towards other human beings, especially men.
I could go on. I’m sure there are other instances in which Objectivism is symbolized. There might even be a few fleeting instances in the books in which Richard , Kahlan, or Zedd do kind things without expecting to get something in return. However I’ve rarely seen cases of it. It was sad how much I enjoyed these books before studying Objectivism. As much as I try I really don’t want to read the novels further as they are a narrow minded attempt to champion a self serving agenda.
Thoughts?
