Some things that rowling *might* have copied from other authors

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orionsixwings

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I'm sure some of you noticed that too, the similarities between her work and Tolkien's. But you know, she might have been inspired by other authors, too, and she might have copied some stuffs from other authors. (or I could just be making this up to have something to talk about here.)

Anyways, the things that I noticed so far are the following:

  1. DEMENTORS and SPECTRES. The description of the two entities are strikingly similar and while the Dementors are in Harry's world, the Spectres are in Lyra's (The Subtle Knife, His Dark Materials trilogy, Phillip Pullman). They actually basically do the same thing: suck out people's soul, leaving behind an empty, zombie-like shell.
  2. THE KNIGHT BUS and CROWLEY'S CAR. Both have the uncanny ability to squeeze through the busy London traffic without anyone (Muggles or humans) noticing them. Only difference is, the Knight Bus is public transportation, while Crowley's 1926 black Bentley is for his own personal use only, and is an extension of his person in a way. He is capable of operating it without physically driving it and has kept the car scratch-free for over sixty years. (Crowley is a devil from GOOD OMENS, by Gaiman and Pratchett).
  3. HARRY POTTER and TIMOTHY HUNTER. Hunter, like Potter, is also the main character in the books series penned by NEIL GAIMAN called, BOOKS OF MAGIC (*gasp!*). And both characters have glasses, both need to learn magic, both have a giant for a friend, and well, you judge: here is a picture of TIMOTHY HUNTER. As you can see, the similarity is right down to the pet owl (only Tim has a macho barn owl while Harry has a sissy white owl
    biggrin.gif
    )

I'm sure there are others, but I'm want to make this fun for everyone. Post your own observations.
 
Wow, the picture is uncanny; when was that print done, O6W? Good thread. Will think on it some.
 
Grimward said:
Wow, the picture is uncanny; when was that print done, O6W? Good thread. Will think on it some.
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That picture is from the Vertigo Paperback edition released April 14, 1993, and the first Harry Potter Book - the Philosopher's Stone - was published 30 June 1997.
 
Figured as much. I've not read much Neil Gaiman (have read some of the comic book work, although it's been awhile). Tell me that Timothy has a lightning bolt scar and I'm really gonna start wondering....;)
 
Grimward said:
Figured as much. I've not read much Neil Gaiman (have read some of the comic book work, although it's been awhile). Tell me that Timothy has a lightning bolt scar and I'm really gonna start wondering....;)
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No. He doesn't. And Rowling has had her time with that too. People have accused her of stealing Gaiman's work (well, as far as Harry's physical appearance is concerned anyway), but Gaiman (being the gentleman that he is) dispelled all that talk and said that aside from the superficial similarities, nothing else can be compared between the two characters.

But if you ask me, Gaiman was just being nice to her. I mean, everyone knows about her history--single mom, abandoned by ungrateful husband with nothing to provide a decent life to their children, and struggling to get published. Gaiman did it to give her a hand. But if he knew she was going to be THIS BIG, I don't think he would have let that slide that easily.
 
orionsixwings said:
No. He doesn't. And Rowling has had her time with that too. People have accused her of stealing Gaiman's work (well, as far as Harry's physical appearance is concerned anyway), but Gaiman (being the gentleman that he is) dispelled all that talk and said that aside from the superficial similarities, nothing else can be compared between the two characters.

But if you ask me, Gaiman was just being nice to her. I mean, everyone knows about her history--single mom, abandoned by ungrateful husband with nothing to provide a decent life to their children, and struggling to get published. Gaiman did it to give her a hand. But if he knew she was going to be THIS BIG, I don't think he would have let that slide that easily.
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It makes me wonder though if in, say, five years time another author hits it big with a book 'borrowing' elements of HP if Rowling would do the same. I would say not, given how litigious she has been so far in protecting her work...
 
Culhwch said:
It makes me wonder though if in, say, five years time another author hits it big with a book 'borrowing' elements of HP if Rowling would do the same. I would say not, given how litigious she has been so far in protecting her work...
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Well, she's too rich to be grateful to anyone so I think you're right on that one.
 
Dementors to me represent the human incarnate of depression; just a thought
 
That websites strains to find connections and make some very dubious points, but it does touch on one or two things that are worth noting, particularly the Larry Potter books.

Rowling likes to claim that her ideas are wholly original, and as far as I am concerned that is utter nonsense. Anyone who is particularly familiar with children's fantasy can see that she has, consciously or unconsciously, drawn from a number of different sources -- or, at the very least, comes up with ideas so obvious that many writers before her have thought of them, too. Where she excels is in writing a page-turning story, and she really does seem to have a nearly magical ability in that regard.

But everyone has sources of ideas and inspirations. That's inevitable. It isn't plagiarism, it isn't even copying, unless you take too much from any one source and you don't have any original ideas of your own or give the material your own unique interpretation.

I think in Rowlings' case there are a great many things that are clearly coincidental, and others that are unconscious borrowings, and maybe some ideas where she knows darn well where they came from and won't admit it, but never is there enough of it from one source that anyone would have to buy anyone off to avoid lawsuits. Which makes that theory of Warner Brothers paying off Neil Gaiman, Serena the Teenage Witch, etc. utter nonsense, too.

I would never trust a writer who's not willing to name their sources of ideas and inspirations. I've certainly never met or heard of such a writer before. Most are eager to give you long lists. But that doesn't make her a plagiarist. It just makes her a vain woman who is exceptionally careful about maintaining a certain image that bears very little relation to the truth -- although by now it's possible that she's convinced herself that it's all true.
 
I'm having this really weird feeling of deja vu. Anyone else see it? :p Narya? You see it don't you :D

I do like that link, Grim. It is very insightful, though bad with English but who am I to complain?
 
That website was put together by someone who has absolutely no idea of what "in the public domain" means.

If the ideas are in the public domain, no one could possibly be suing anyone over them. You can't have it both ways, but whoever put that site together is trying to do just that.
 
Majimaune said:
I'm having this really weird feeling of deja vu. Anyone else see it? :p Narya? You see it don't you :D

I do like that link, Grim. It is very insightful, though bad with English but who am I to complain?
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SHHHH! I am Orion on this board.
 
I don't know if its vanity or legal fees that is making her so defensive. Remember her books are worth a very large fortune and if some one can prove or get her to admit to plaguarism then they could get onto a winner and there are enough lawyers who would be willing for such a case. So it would make sense that she would be getting legal advice which would be more direct, certain and (overall) harsh and selfish sounding inorder that she defend herself from possible legal action.
Like I said remember these cases might not come to anything, but it will still cost her in time and money to get rid of them - and it also leads to bad publicity - something both she and her publisher would be keen to avoid
 
Writers always copy from each others. That's kind of the point of writing because you can't be a good writer unless you rival with others. There must be at least millions of orphans, underage heros, dangerous quests, magical tools and dragons in the genre of fantasy. Whether the imitating is obvious or not on the text itself, is of course a different subject.
 
hopoffhopon said:
Writers always copy from each others. That's kind of the point of writing because you can't be a good writer unless you rival with others. There must be at least millions of orphans, underage heros, dangerous quests, magical tools and dragons in the genre of fantasy. Whether the imitating is obvious or not on the text itself, is of course a different subject.
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Agreed, which is my gripe with Rowling since she seems oblivious of this fact and arrogantly repels the idea that she copied anything from anyone. So, I wanted to prove to people that she's not entirely original and yes, there had been others who thought of that world before.
 
The HP books reminded me of two books that Anthony Horowitz wrote, long before HP. I also read it years before HP came out. I will mention some similarities.


Groosham Grange (1988)

A boy (David) about Harry's age or Harry age.
He has a abusive home
A letter arrives (magically I think) at his home from a school
David is send to that school which is located at a fairly isolated place
The school has water surrounding it
The school has a dark forest near it
It also has a cemetery
The school has not a very "normal" (odd) name
The school is a school for witchcraft and magic
David first needs to go to a trainstation
After that, he takes a hearse
And after the hearse, a boat to arrive at his school
On his way to the school he makes friends
Two friends
One is a boy, one is a girl
One teacher is a werewolf
David also has some sort of family connected history, with him being the seventh son of a seventh son

This one I am not sure of anymore, but it is possible that he is relatively wellknown for the whole seventh son family background and position as such, similar to Harry's family background and his position make him famous.

I thought that the school is a old building, but I am not sure about that either.


The Unholy Grail (1990, the sequel)

David tries to win a Cup, the (Unholy) Grail
He isn't really liked as participant
He has a rival
He gets sabotaged/tricked along the way
Some evil force is at work

In both books there are odd teachers.

And I believe that in both books, the students get lessons in making potions and flying a broomstick. Or it is featured in just one book. Not sure about that.


I had to use Amazon as resource, because I only remembered half of the things I mentioned in the list :eek:. It has it's fair amount of similarities. And there might be more that I have not mentioned. It's up to you to decide which similarities are too much of a coincidence or if it is normal that a author would make up these things (anyone would come up with the idea to have their fictional magic school give potion lessons, as example), when they try to create a story about a boy who goes to a magic school.

I'd like to point out that HP and Groosham have not the same atmosphere; Groosham is darker in tone. HP has more imagination put in it (the ceiling that shows the sky, etc.). Also, in HP magic is more or less neautral; you can do good and bad with it. In the Groosham books, magic is dark. You could probably do some good stuff with it, but in the Groosham universe, as far as I can remember (correct me if I am wrong), all magic is pretty much not "good" magic, but black magic, fitting to the darker tone of the books.
 
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