1950 Syndrome?

[Blackrook]

I bought four books about how to write as part of my effort to improve my writing skills.

The first essay of the first book was written by an editor for a science fiction magazine, Analog, I think, who said only 2% of all stories submitted are published.

What he said was something I never heard before. He said that most of the 98% articles rejected (if not outright bad) are rejected for one reason: what he called "1950 syndrome".

He gave examples of people who, even though they supposedly lived in the future, had lives which were no different than the way life was in 1950. Men commute to work on flying cars, but they still commute to work. Most women are stay-at-home mothers except for the occasional saucy woman reporter, who quits her job when she gets married. The social changes of the 1960's never happened.

I pondered this.

Two days ago I started a science fiction story not knowing what I would write before I began. I ended up writing a murder mystery featuring your typical hard-boiled detective, meeting an informer in a nightclub and then a diner. A waitress was injured in a hit-and-run accident and the detective visited her in a semi-private hospital room.

At this point I stopped, appalled at what I had done.

A hard-boiled detective is the ultimate 1950 character. He even wore a hat and raincoat.

Diners are so out-fashioned they don't even have diners were I lived. Diners were very popular in 1950 though.

Nightclubs were very popular in 1950, more popular than today.

A hit-and-run accident is something that could happen in 1950 and I can't imagine what I was thinking when I put it in.

In what way is all this a science fiction story?

The only reason it needs to be is that clones eventually figure in. But otherwise it's a setting that is all too familiar. It is the setting we see on TV and in movies. It is the comfortable, conservative world Hollywood has pushed on us which is not at all like real life. People are generally happy and content with their lives. Unhappiness is a temporary problem which ends when the story ends. Everyone has a happy ending.

I'm locked into this because I've been watching TV and movies all my life. If the Analog author is right, my stories will never get published until I learn to get out of this comfort zone.

Any suggestions?

 

[Xelebes]

First thing first, understand why you have this allure to tell a story in such a narrative. From the sounds of it, you are wanting to tell of a bygone time that should be modelled in the future. Is there a lingering fear that the current trends, politics and design are more scary than what was there before? If there is a fear, maybe it would be a good idea to explore this fear and write something about that.

 

[Kith]

When was the essay written?

Trends come and go all the time, and maybe it was simply that that particular editor (perhaps at that particular time) was not fond of stories that featured "1950s Syndrome." That doesn't mean those sorts of stories won't get published, or that they shouldn't be written.

My opinion is to write about what you love, because that will be your best work. Good writing and a good story trumps cliches and trends and "statistics" about what sells and what doesn't.

 

[Dimentio]

Hahaha... Wonder how they would see my novel then. The technology is on the 1950's level (but culture and society is different).

 

[Nik]

What goes around, comes around...

So it is a themed Club / Mini-Mall. Look at the way the Japanese kids have gone crazy for neo-Victorian stuff. You must dress the 50s (1950 not 1850) part else the robot bouncer gives you the evil eye...

And the 'hit&run' is really, really bad news as the Perp has managed to run the vehicle 'off the grid'. That's impossible three ways, but it happened. Chief's hoping it was a 'commercial' hit, and the mess can be kept quiet. The nested implications have everyone running ragged, even the AIs who are worrying that they've been corrupted. Speaking to the eye-witness, whose iLog was EMP'd, is the only solution. She worked in a neo-50s bar, she had immersive training to stay in character, but now concussion and partial amnesia have stuck her there. Your Detective protagonist must play the part.
{FX: Moan about 24 hrs of retro down-loads, left thinking in cliches, doing silly accent etc etc etc. }

Um, when you can fake electronic comunication using a lap-top, when a home-grown quantum computer can hack 512 bit keys faster than you can blink at the iris reader, face-time is important. A hand-shake on a deal in a shielded room may be the only way to ensure an un-hackable link for high-level encrypted transfers. At least you know you're not dealing with a script-kiddie...

D'uh, you can make more than lemonade from a crate of lemons-- Rust remover, primary cell, antidote for some rashes / stings etc etc. IIRC, the juice even shifts essence of skunk...

 

[Blackrook]

First thing first, understand why you have this allure to tell a story in such a narrative. From the sounds of it, you are wanting to tell of a bygone time that should be modelled in the future. Is there a lingering fear that the current trends, politics and design are more scary than what was there before? If there is a fear, maybe it would be a good idea to explore this fear and write something about that.

You're right. I don't like where our society is heading and I don't feel like writing a story where current social trends continue.

I think (here's where I get controversial) we are headed towards a godless future where human life is cheap, medical ethics has been tossed out the window, medical care is denied to those deemed "useless" to society, and churches have all been converted to offices or retail stores.

I understand (this may offend you but here goes) that Europe is a lot further down this road than the United States, but it's only a matter of time. If the United States adopts socialized medicine it will be a big leap "forward" because the bill before Congress sets up a system where medical care would have to be rationed, and the old and handicapped may end up denied healthcare.

I don't want to start a political debate because this is a not a political forum. I am simply telling you how I feel so you can understand why I hate the future and feel reminiscent about the past. I know the past had problems too (discrimination against women and blacks), but there were many good things that have been lost, one of them being respect for the marriage vow and cohesiveness of the nuclear family.

Now you might advise me that I should write a story where I warn people about the future I fear. The problem is, it's too late. Abandonment of the old ways is now irreversible. Any warning I might raise would be considered reactionary and would not be welcomed.

On the other hand, I cannot write a story where my characters routinely engage in the immoral conduct that has now become the norm because it is so discouraging to me. In my world, people would not fall in the sack on a first date. There would be a certain respect for women that is lacking in the world today. So yes, it would be like 1950. I'm not sure what I can do about that.

Here comes the flames...

 

[thatollie]

Alright, I'll have a crack at this.

Going on the idea that too much SF is set in a thinly veiled 1950s, first we need to know why. I think it has to do with the fact that the standards of the genre were set around that time. Asimov, Heinlein, Pohl and several others were active in this period.

This may have nothing to do with how you personally feel about the 1950's compared with today. In fact I'm damn sure of it, because the figure quoted (98%) is too large for that. It seems therefore that this is about authors of today deriving ideas from the authors of that period.

And you're getting caught up in that because of you nostalgic view of the 1950's. I have nothing against that view, but I think you take it a little bit too far.

On the other hand, I cannot write a story where my characters routinely engage in the immoral conduct that has now become the norm because it is so discouraging to me.

Like this for instance, you feel that to sell a story to a modern audience your characters need to engage in immoral behaviour. That makes me feel like you're misjudging 21st Century society. There are still moral people in this world.

You mentioned this quote in your opening post.

He gave examples of people who, even though they supposedly lived in the future, had lives which were no different than the way life was in 1950. Men commute to work on flying cars, but they still commute to work. Most women are stay-at-home mothers except for the occasional saucy woman reporter, who quits her job when she gets married. The social changes of the 1960's never happened.

So forget about the big social changes, what about the little ones? Like people working from home, or communicating with people they've never met before, or the fact that anyone can put their opinion up for public perusal.

I think I've just about covered my thoughts on this topic, you can make up your own mind.

 

[Blackrook]

I think you're on to something. Most of the science fiction I've read was when I was a boy and it was all Heinlein and Asimov and mostly written in the 1950's. That must be influencing my writing style.

 

[HareBrain]

On a wider note, it does seem to me that very few people these days, whether SFF writers or politicians, have any positive vision for the future. I think we could do with some futuristic stories where society has progressed in a positive way from today's, but first you'd have to work out how that's going to happen.

 

[Dimentio]

On a wider note, it does seem to me that very few people these days, whether SFF writers or politicians, have any positive vision for the future. I think we could do with some futuristic stories where society has progressed in a positive way from today's, but first you'd have to work out how that's going to happen.

The Venus Project

 

[Susan Boulton]

On a wider note, it does seem to me that very few people these days, whether SFF writers or politicians, have any positive vision for the future. I think we could do with some futuristic stories where society has progressed in a positive way from today's, but first you'd have to work out how that's going to happen.

There's the up coming Shine Anthology.

SHINE anthology guidelines « Shineanthology’s Weblog

 

[Kith]

I think you're on to something. Most of the science fiction I've read was when I was a boy and it was all Heinlein and Asimov and mostly written in the 1950's. That must be influencing my writing style.

I think you need to update your reading list! Reading more recent stuff might help shake up old ideas or create new ones (and will certainly go some way to allay fears of 'is this too cliche/overdone?' etc), and since you are writing with publication in mind, having a good idea of the current market is no bad thing. I don't really read sci-fi myself, so I'm at a loss for examples, but I'm sure some other Chrons will pip in if you're interested in suggestions.

I also think you'd enjoy speculative fiction, which is less focused on the technology of the future world, and more on the society and people within it - dystopias and utopias, etc. I have a feeling you would enjoy Ursula Le Guin's The Dispossed for its discussions and oppositions between the societies of two alien worlds (although it's not a recent book).

Marge Piercy's Woman on the Edge of Time, while set (IIRC, I may not!) in a 70s American mental ward, deals with a prospective utopian future and how that future is under threat by the decline of the modern world. So that might be useful (and it is a wonderful book, too).

--------

Back to your own writing, why not take the ideals of the 1950s and evolve them as though the last sixty years never happened? What if we had had space travel then, or aliens had whisked a section of society away? How might those people have evolved away from the influences that have made our society what it is today? Would we be better off or worse off?

Why not just write in an alternate 1950s, where aliens and such are already (or are becoming) common-place?

You could also go so far into the future that things have come full circle. A radical change in government and ruling? Old moral strictures might be enforced, or they might have become preferred. Or you might write about a small section of society that has cut itself off in protest of modern society - perhaps even forgetting that there is another world outside their own (what was that film where it turned out they were living in a nature reserve?).

Or you could abandon western culture entirely.

I imagine what the editor was railing against was writers mindlessly taking the ideals and traditions of a time period, and plastering them over some ill thought out future without thought of how they might have changed or adapted in the time in between. Anachronism. That doesn't mean you can't write in a world that has parallels to the 1950s.

Have faith in what you want to write, controversial or not, because if you're passionate about it, chances are there are readers out there who will be too.

Final thing:

Like this for instance, you feel that to sell a story to a modern audience your characters need to engage in immoral behaviour. That makes me feel like you're misjudging 21st Century society. There are still moral people in this world.

QFT.

 

[thatollie]

I think you need to update your reading list! Reading more recent stuff might help shake up old ideas or create new ones (and will certainly go some way to allay fears of 'is this too cliche/overdone?' etc), and since you are writing with publication in mind, having a good idea of the current market is no bad thing. I don't really read sci-fi myself, so I'm at a loss for examples, but I'm sure some other Chrons will pip in if you're interested in suggestions.

Reading current works in your genre is always a good idea. It'll keep you on your toes.

I'd also suggest getting to grips with recent scientific breakthroughs, and also breakthroughs that are expected in the near future.

 

[FionaW]

Joy in the future, well, let's think about what is likely in the next 50-100 years:

genetic treatments for cystic fibrosis, Huntingdons, muscular dystrophy etc etc etc
Immunomodulation to cure multiple sclerosis, motor neurone disease etc
Targeted killer cells to cure various forms of cancer
Finding bacteria on Mars with a different genetic code that revolutionises our view of exobiology
Laser powered rockets
Nanotechnology (not even going to try and break that one down)
Solar grids that will make today's solar panels look like AA batteries
living fabrics that change as you wear them
every person being scientifically literate; children taught logic, reasoning and critical thinking
children forming worldwide communities and refusing to participate in the prejudices of their parents.

I've avoided harping on some of your more incendiary comments: 'respect for women' (bud, people respect me because I'm very, very good at what I do, and because I try to be a kind and thoughtful human being. My gender is irrelevant. I hold the door open for anyone, male or female, because it wouldn't occur to me to do otherwise), 'godlessness' (75% of all the doctors I've ever worked with have been atheist, and every doctor I've known who has worked for MSF or the Red Cross has been atheist), 'falling in the sack' (actually, most people don't do this. You have a very jaundiced view of the younger generation.)

I have to wonder if a lot of your anxiety is caused by the disconnect between what your upbringing/Faux news is telling you, and the actual reality of the world out there. It's really a much more positive, exciting place than you'll let yourself believe.

Having a one night stand doesn't make you a bad person, nor does it mean that society is coming apart at the seams. I suggest you watch some of the documentaries made by the late, great Molly Ivins - a woman of the older generation who delighted in the freedoms and opportunities offered to the young, and had the most refreshing attitude to sex of any american I've ever encountered. I'd add a link to the best one, but it's NSFW and the title contains a word which will get asterisked by the mods. If anyone wants to know (and by 'eck, you won't regret it; you'll laugh until your head falls off) PM me.

 

[Ursa major]

Joy in the future, well, let's think about what is likely in the next 50-100 years:

genetic treatments for cystic fibrosis, Huntingdons, muscular dystrophy etc etc etc
Immunomodulation to cure multiple sclerosis, motor neurone disease etc
Targeted killer cells to cure various forms of cancer
Finding bacteria on Mars with a different genetic code that revolutionises our view of exobiology
Laser powered rockets
Nanotechnology (not even going to try and break that one down)
Solar grids that will make today's solar panels look like AA batteries
living fabrics that change as you wear them
every person being scientifically literate; children taught logic, reasoning and critical thinking
children forming worldwide communities and refusing to participate in the prejudices of their parents.

There's a lot to that, FionaW. But in a close 3rd person (or 1st person) narrative set in a future where all this is true - in the sense that it has already happened - it's quite difficult to get across how wonderful this may be. The character will not dwell on any of it unless it impacts them at (or round about) that time.

I hope no one would even dream of including something like this in their writing:

One benefit of his new volantur was that while it did all the work of driving, Kalen could relax into the back seat and list all the mediacal advances of the last couple of centuries, the ones that meant you rarely saw anyone sick because there were no illnesses; not anymore; not since....

This is akin to someone walking down a street and, on seeing a chimney, going on at length about how wonderful it is that children are no longer sent up to clean them. A "modern" day character would think about his or her own life: the good things, the bad; the opportunities, the failures. They will not dwell on the past and the improvements since then unless something real forces them to.

Now there are ways round this for SFF, including two favourites: the outsider from a less advanced society seeing how things are better (if they are); the cataclysm that threatens to roll back all those advances.

 

[dustinzgirl]

Is this thread about social welfare and thus should be moved to World Affairs, or is this thread about writing about a culture with or without social welfare and thus should remain here?

 

[Ursa major]

I see it as an Aspiring Writers thread, Dusty. (I don't know about anyone else.)

But I can see that the temperature can rise if people don't understand what is going on with a piece of writing.

For instance, the way people think about issues in their writing does not necessarily represent what they themselves think. (As such, it's an important component of the POV-issue which I find is permeating quite a lot of the recent threads - but that may be because of my growing interest in the topic).

I have grown up seeing the narrator as being closely connected to (and perhaps even representative of) the author, unless, that is, it's a first person narrative (and sometimes even then). But now, when the 3rd person POV is so closely tied to the POV character that we are literally observing the world only through the perspective of that POV character, we have to recognise that the formerly disembodied "voice" that floated above the action cannot represent the author's views unless they happen to coincide with the POV character's. (If it's well written, that is).

There is a danger that as we move ever closer to the POV character, some readers will be left behind and think that the author agrees with whatever thoughts and drives the "current" POV character has. I think this may lead to some arguments that are really about nothing: a case of more heat than light.

* temporarily gets off hobbyhorse.... *

 

[Interference]

I bought four books about how to write as part of my effort to improve my writing skills.

The first essay of the first book was written by an editor for a science fiction magazine, Analog, I think, who said only 2% of all stories submitted are published.

What he said was something I never heard before. He said that most of the 98% articles rejected (if not outright bad) are rejected for one reason: what he called "1950 syndrome".

He gave examples of people who, even though they supposedly lived in the future, had lives which were no different than the way life was in 1950. Men commute to work on flying cars, but they still commute to work. Most women are stay-at-home mothers except for the occasional saucy woman reporter, who quits her job when she gets married. The social changes of the 1960's never happened.

I pondered this.

Two days ago I started a science fiction story not knowing what I would write before I began. I ended up writing a murder mystery featuring your typical hard-boiled detective, meeting an informer in a nightclub and then a diner. A waitress was injured in a hit-and-run accident and the detective visited her in a semi-private hospital room.

At this point I stopped, appalled at what I had done.

A hard-boiled detective is the ultimate 1950 character. He even wore a hat and raincoat.

Diners are so out-fashioned they don't even have diners were I lived. Diners were very popular in 1950 though.

Nightclubs were very popular in 1950, more popular than today.

A hit-and-run accident is something that could happen in 1950 and I can't imagine what I was thinking when I put it in.

In what way is all this a science fiction story?

The only reason it needs to be is that clones eventually figure in. But otherwise it's a setting that is all too familiar. It is the setting we see on TV and in movies. It is the comfortable, conservative world Hollywood has pushed on us which is not at all like real life. People are generally happy and content with their lives. Unhappiness is a temporary problem which ends when the story ends. Everyone has a happy ending.

I'm locked into this because I've been watching TV and movies all my life. If the Analog author is right, my stories will never get published until I learn to get out of this comfort zone.

Any suggestions?

Write more essays like this. You have given us a cogent, literate, accurate portrayal of what appears to be a common malaise. Nice piece, BR.

 

[dustinzgirl]

Write more essays like the one you have just presented to us. It's a cogent, literate, accurate portrayal of what appears to be a common malaise. Nice piece, BR.

Actually, this is a good way to get a foothold in a writing career. Non-fiction essays aren't glamorous and nobody will remember you name, and they don't pay a LOT, but if you can get published in a few journals or high end magz like the Smithsonian, you have something nice to put on your resume when you approach fiction editors.

 

[Tansy]

Sci Fi alway bemuses me as its people in the future living by and referencing things to today's standards..

It never sits easy with me which is why I am a fantasy gal.. so much more simpler

I tried to write a story set in a world turned upside down and it was just soooo hard to imagine how we'd all react that it became to difficult, just trying to work out how the language could have eveloved what with text speak etc blew my mind that I gave up not to mention the male/female dynamic of such a world

I'm hoping there are more imaginitive people out there than me

I agree with Ursa's post above - if you live in a place where there is no sickness you don't think about how it was in 1995 and the national health service,, illness just wouldn't cross your mind as you grew up in a world where everyone was healthy and that was the norm, you'd just take it for granted unless people suddenly started becomming sick and only old fashioned medicine could help