Finding a 'Voice'

[Boneman]

So: my narrator tends to slide between stentorian and uninterested (with occasional flashes of genius!). I seem to have a real problem deciding between the character's voice and the narrator's, and worry endlessley that both seem unreal. I know that I'm still struggling to find my voice in my writing.

One suggestion has been that I rewrite a chapter, as an exercise, in the first person, which I'm doing currently. Has anyone else any suggestions, or can tell us how they found their own writing voice?

Many thanks!

 

[Ursa major]

As I've just mentioned in another thread - the one about "passive dialogue" - I try to make the narration match (to some extent) the POV's character. Some narrations are very formal, some quite informal, and most somewhere between**.

Even where the language is formal, though, I'm doing my best to sit as close to the characters thoughts as possible. Even then, though, you can have variants:

Why couldn't he do as he was told, she thought.

as opposed to:

Damn idiot! Tell him to do one thing and he does another.

The benefit (in my eyes at least) is that you are transmitting something of the characters of one's POVs. (Is this showing, not telling?)

Whether an agent or editor would see this as writing without underlying consistency, I don't know. (If so, I've an awful lot of editing ahead of me.)





** - There are passages in first person, but not in the meat of the books.

 

[HareBrain]

I can't find my narrative voice either. I kind of thought the idea was to expunge it completely, when you're writing third-person intimate: as Ursa said, you write each POV in the style of the character's thoughts. Trouble is, because it's not the style of your own thoughts, this makes you doubt every line you write.

Once upon a time, there were writers who wrote as though they were telling tales to people sat round a fire, and they did have their own narrative voices. They also head-hopped like a hat with a frog in it. But because they, as narrator, stayed slightly aloof from the characters' perspectives, that worked.

The best recent example of that is Robert Redick. I'm currently reading his Rats and the Ruling Sea, set in an 18thC-style world, and written (as befits that period) with a strong narrative voice. He gets away with this unfashionable style by using the device that his narrator is actually a character of that period (likely one of the "cast", though writing in third person).

Those writers who stick very closely to their characters' perspectives, such as GRRM, I'm not sure have a particular overall voice at all.

 

[Ursa major]

Trouble is, because it's not the style of your own thoughts, this makes you doubt every line you write.

Ah! So my constant fiddling with the text is not simply because I'm a perfectionist manqué. (This explains a lot; possibly.)

 

[Teresa Edgerton]

Has anyone else any suggestions, or can tell us how they found their own writing voice?

This probably won't sound very helpful, but the only way that I know to do it is to just keep writing (and writing and writing). And don't worry about finding it; relax and let it find you.

That's how it happened for me. Somewhere around the fifth or sixth draft of Child of Saturn, the opening paragraphs just came into my head (previously, of course, there had been other opening paragraphs, but those turned out to be the wrong ones). I sat down at my typewriter and the next few pages flowed out effortlessly. It was all quite different from the way I had been telling the story before, but it felt right, it felt like me. I showed those pages to my husband, he read them, was silent for about a minute, and then he said in a surprised voice, "This is good." And there it was. There were times after that when I struggled with other parts of the book, writing and writing and throwing things out, but from the time I first wrote those opening paragraphs to publication of the book several years (and a lot of revising) later, I know I only changed a handful of words in those first pages. Besides being the right beginning for the story, they gave me my own right voice.

Which is not to say that my style and my voice haven't evolved at all during the twenty years since then, but it was the right voice for who I was then.

(And people have always told me since then that I have a strong narrative voice, but I don't head-hop. The two do not necessarily go together.)

So don't feel discouraged. Just keep writing and improving, and somehow in the midst of the process it will happen, because everything else you are doing is leading you toward that moment. The best analogy I can think of is something my father (the chef) told one of his cooks who was stirring a pot of soup: stir the sides and the bottom, and the top and the middle will take care of themselves.

 

[The Judge]

I may be talking out of the back of my head here, but to me 'voice' can mean two different things: the POV of the narrator -- which will vary if you have multiple POV characters as Ursa and HareBrain have pointed out -- and the overall feel or style of a piece. The latter will also vary in that an action scene will be written (one hopes) in a different way from a death-bed scene, and the emotion in both will be different, but there will be a kind of background feel which unites them, so they are patently written by the same person in the same novel. Indeed, that feel may well be the same from novel to novel so one recognises a Jane Austen and can distinguish her work from something of the Brontes'.

To my mind, this style-voice comes directly and naturally from the author. I don't think it can be taught, so much as discovered and developed. Write, write, write. Write different kinds of things. Take scenes from someone else's work and re-write them. Try writing pastiche for a while -- I think it used to be the case that aspiring artists were told to copy the Old Masters to learn techniques, and use that as a springboard to find their own styles. Experiment. And keep writing.

J

EDIT: Teresa beat me to the post, so sorry this is repeating things a little.

 

[reiver33]

I always use first person and would struggle otherwise, although this is probably a consequence of my own quirky psychology rather than a sober literary decision. Hence my main character is always male and the presentation as if he is recounting events - I have this terrible fondness for classic Film Noir and it shows! I don't 'head hop', nor can I imagine doing so (well done those who can). I would say the most natural 'voice' to use is the one which gives you (the author) the most comfortable perspective on the story as it unfolds.

 

[ventanamist]

OK Boneman. How about doing some text-free, seat of the pants real genuine story telling. No script, no crib sheets, preferably no plan. You must have some children around, your own or your relatives', or just pull some in off the street - no maybe not. Other adults, pets, vagrants, people in doctors waiting rooms. Persist and several story teller personas will emerge. They might be strange but they will be interesting and they will know how to communicate.

 

[Boneman]

Some excellent suggestions, thank you all.

I've started writing a chapter of my work-in-progress, in the first person, (and I find it damn difficult) and the emphasis has changed completely, which I think is pointing me in the direction I need to go, to get emotions over. An exercise I'd recommend... unless you're writing in the first person, in which case it's useless.

Vent, funnily enough I used to do this with my own children; problem was, they'd then ask for the same story a week or two later, and I couldn't remember it. I'm lecturing some adult students later today, (my intended audience for the book) maybe I'll just tell them a story, instead...

 

[2ndchance]

Hi mate, up the 'Seagulls' (Brighton & Hove Albion football club) (soccer)

Three things helped me greatly.

1. I heard my voice standing away from the keypad, in the garden, going over said bit in my head.

2. You once said to me that I have a strong voice, I thought about this and realised I do on here, so I transferred it.
As Teresa says 'let it come to you.'
Be natural, type as you speak and worry about the grammar after.

3. I put myself in my characters head, how he or she would see it, first person if you like and then replaced I with he or she. Make sense? It did for me.


Steve

 

[crystal haven]

Some excellent suggestions, thank you all.

I've started writing a chapter of my work-in-progress, in the first person, (and I find it damn difficult) and the emphasis has changed completely, which I think is pointing me in the direction I need to go, to get emotions over. An exercise I'd recommend... unless you're writing in the first person, in which case it's useless.

Nearly all my writing is in first person. I find it extremely useful to write a page or two in first person for any character I need to understand better. It gives me an insight into the way they think, how they would behave.

 

[dreamhunter]

So: my narrator tends to slide between stentorian and uninterested (with occasional flashes of genius!). I seem to have a real problem deciding between the character's voice and the narrator's, and worry endlessley that both seem unreal. I know that I'm still struggling to find my voice in my writing.

One suggestion has been that I rewrite a chapter, as an exercise, in the first person, which I'm doing currently. Has anyone else any suggestions, or can tell us how they found their own writing voice?

Many thanks!

I dont know if this could help you, Boney. But I also went through periods, or moments, when I felt indecisive, unconfident or hesitant about something I felt I wanted to write. Like I was worried that something I wrote would sound too unreal, or too audacious.

And then after a while, I thought, WTH, I'll be as audacious n unreal as I want. This is my creation. I'm its master, its creator, so to speak. I can do anything I want with it. N then I pushed ahead as I had wanted to, n it felt really good afterwards.

Might be easier said than done, but just imagine tossing out, or squeezing out, the fear n the worry. It's the writer's arch enemy, cos the reader is somehow gonna sense it. Learn to relax n flow, instead of tensing n struggling.

You dont want your reader thinking that his author is a scaredy cat, or a nervous wreck, would ya? Even if you're one. LOL.

You want him to think that you're a fearless, nonchalant lion, invincible n indestructible.

Try it some time, Bone. Write a page or two, or three or four, of the most audacious scene you could imagine, for your story. Then leave it there to soak for a while, n see how it feels.

If it still feels unpalatable after a week, just rub it out. No harm done. But let a few other guys see it first, before you chuck it out. N dont transmit your own fear to them, cos fear, they say, can be infectious.

But if it still feels good, then well, who knows. You might have got yourself a killer scene.

 

[Prototype]

OK Boneman. How about doing some text-free, seat of the pants real genuine story telling. No script, no crib sheets, preferably no plan. You must have some children around, your own or your relatives', or just pull some in off the street - no maybe not. Other adults, pets, vagrants, people in doctors waiting rooms. Persist and several story teller personas will emerge. They might be strange but they will be interesting and they will know how to communicate.

I've started telling stories at school this year in my lessons and whilst I don't know whether it helps with my writer's 'voice' or not it has definitely given me ideas and techniques to explore in my own writing.

In addition, I've used this approach with the children I teach and it definitely works for them. I'd allow a sketched plan as I think that tends to allow the mind to do its job rather than having to focus on 'Crumbs! Where am I going next!'.

Just my 2c.

 

[Nik]

I'm no 'Raconteur', I just enjoyed SciFi adventures and would invent my own-- This was fortunate, as I used to improvise them as bed-time stories for my brother...

( Oddly, I NEVER did fan-fic-- Go figure... ;-)

A lot of my stories are mostly or entirely '1st person', following a single character, because that lets me log the protagonist's thoughts. Several are pure '3rd', because that's the only way I can tell the tale.

Unfortunately, I lack the skill to re-write with different POVs and have it look good each way. If one approach flows, perforce I go with it...

 

[Prototype]

I'm no 'Raconteur', I just enjoyed SciFi adventures and would invent my own-- This was fortunate, as I used to improvise them as bed-time stories for my brother...

( Oddly, I NEVER did fan-fic-- Go figure... ;-)

A lot of my stories are mostly or entirely '1st person', following a single character, because that lets me log the protagonist's thoughts. Several are pure '3rd', because that's the only way I can tell the tale.

Unfortunately, I lack the skill to re-write with different POVs and have it look good each way. If one approach flows, perforce I go with it...

No you don't... it just requires practice.

I never did Fan-fic either... (Except for a very loosely based Star Wars story when I was about 8).

 

[Boneman]

Thanks all, for the continued input.

2nd Chance: up the 'ammers! Are you the guy whose buying 50% of them?

Dreamhunter, not sure if you read a thread about multiple writing, but it occurs to me, after reading your post, that it's distinctly possible that I'm writing for others and not for m'self, and thereby limiting the way I use my narrative. I have another work that I use, to really indulge myself, write exactly what I want, how I want, in a totally different voice to my major opus, and it's really fun to do. My main work is entrancing me but it's not fun to write, I'm a little too serious. Someone else said I should combine the elements of bothWhat you said made me think twice. or thrice, actually, so thanks muchly for the advice.

I'll keep y'all posted as to what works best.

 

[dreamhunter]

That's good to hear, Bone. Creative work MUST be fun. For it to continue to be creative.

Now that I know that you're a footballer, or at least a watcher of footballers, let me use a footballing analogy.

Could you guess which of the footballers would be using the 'relax n flow, instead of tensing n struggling' approach in their play? The maestros among them, of course. The 'creators', so to speak. Guys like Cristiano Ronaldo, Lionel Messi, Ronaldinho etc. Not forgetting David Beckham, or Frank Lampard, of course. Guys who aint worried one bit about what others think of the way they play. Not your average water-carrier type of player, no way. That's what enabled them to become maestros at what they do, in the first place, isnt it?

N they always end up making their AUDIENCES happy, dont they? That's cos guys like them are more concerned, n more focused as a result, with making THEMSELVES happy, first n foremost.

Even if we cant all play like Cristiano Ronaldo, at least we can diligently watch how he does his shuffles, shimmies n stepovers, n eventually come up with our own best versions, cant we? LOL.

 

[Window Bar]

Finding a voice is never easy, and yet it may the most important facet of the narration. I often like to use the general cadences and humor style of somebody I know ... usually someone a bit off-beat.

Vocabulary (even in the narration, not just in the dialogue) should be within that person's world experience and mind set.

 

[Boneman]

So... reporting back on progress so far. I had written a piece that I wasn't even sure would be in the book (a prologue), and with the encouragement of my writing group I submitted three pieces for consideration: i) the original (written in the third person, but lacking je-ne-sai-quoi) ii)the same piece written in the first person iii) the same piece written in the third person again. What a difference: writing in the first person shifted my focus so that I saw (and wanted to write about) what he was seeing, his emotions, even the scent of the women he was leaving behind.

Because my narrator has always been a bit of a 'soulless' story teller, those strands had not been there before, despite my attempts to show his emotions in the farewell. One of my group even suggested that my 1st person narrative was stronger than the second 3rd...

So now I'm doing more of this, and I'm really enjoying it. I'll even try writing in the 2nd person... maybe.

But I would recommend this to anyone stuck in a scene, because it makes you see so much more clearly if you really look through your character's eyes, and then shift to writing from his pov.

All I've got to do now is rewrite my first book two more times!

Dreamhunter: Frank Lampard? FRANK LAMPARD??? I can see the others, but Frank Lampard? Peter Ward, maybe, but honestly... But you are right, about the fun bit and this exercise was certainly easy to do, and certainly fun, and I'm pretty sure, more creative. Watch this space.

 

[dreamhunter]

Yes, Frank Lampard. He is the architect of many of Chelsea's moves, isn't he? He was their inventor long before Michael Ballack turned up on the scene. And he's a great finisher, too.

Guys talk about (swashbuckling, supposedly) John Terry (he got whacked out cold once, by someone's wild boot in his face), Diving Didier etc., but Frank is the main man. Around the penalty area, he is smoother, more confident and more dangerous than Beckham.

What makes him special is his controlled, elegant, deliberate, unhurried play. The complete opposite of Steven the Storm Gerrard. You know who his style reminds me of? Franz Beckenbauer. Yes, he is that good. Only, Frank is a more prolific goalscorer than Franz ever was.

Remember what I said? Relax and flow. That is always the mark of the maestro. That's Frank for you, Bone.

His is the way of the eagle, surveying silently from far above, then making the final, inevitable swoop that no prey can escape. Not the way of the duck, quack, quack, quack, backward and forward, forward and backward. LOL.

Lamps is Chelsea's creator, mate. Besides, his new gf is hawt too. Which just goes to show, that our Frank's a maestro in more ways than one, more fields than the turfed one.