New guy alert.

[Kor]

Ok so i read R E Fiest, David Gemmel, David Eddings and several others and i see that while they have 1000-2000 posts in their threads that this dude has 25,000.

Is it a reflection on how great his stuff is and if so where do you recomend i start if im going to read his stuff. I do not want to read into the threads due to spoiling the experiance so please refrain from posting spoilers in here if you can.

Thanks you.

 

[Boaz]

Welcome, Kor. I was just playing the old Warlords game. Ahhh, that first strategy war game for the PC. Anyway one of the factions are the Orcs of Kor.

I read Eddings back in high school <ahem> thirty years ago. And I enjoyed it until I realized that fantasy could be more than just copying Tolkien.

I read Feist back in college. And I enjoyed Midkemia and the side quests while all powerful wizards and gods battled for total power... yet I wanted less magic and more intrigue. I enjoyed his world of Midkemia so much that I kept reading long after I realized the stories were completely formulaic.

I read Legend by Gemmell two years ago. He's not a great writer; his characters are one dimensional; his plots are transparent; and I detest the use of deus ex machina... yet I loved Legend. After reading many attempts, both good and bad, of morally ambiguous characters, of convoluted plots, of thinly disguised allegory pushing some environmental or universalist agenda, and stories of every anthropomorphic creature, bug, and alien out there, I found Gemmell to be delightfully refreshing. His heroes are heroic, his good guys are good, his bad guys are bad, his cowards are cowardly... Legend did not hold any pretense of intellectualism (okay, I'm guilty of that) nor did it get bogged down with minutiae. Gemmell got right to the heart of the story and the action. For anyone who's tired of prophesied teenage saviors, bored with the wizard/ranger/elf/dwarf questing party, frustrated with multi-layered shades of morality, and sick of political, environmental, and theological proselytizing... then Legend is the book for you.

Now if you want to see strong moral themes, believable characters, and a riveting world against a backdrop of political intrigue, social injustice, religious tensions, and convincing bloody realism, then Martin's epic A Song of Ice and Fire is what you should read.

The writings of many fantasy authors have inspired me for many years. Lewis, Baum, Tolkien, Burroughs, LeGuin, Stasheff, Howard, McCaffrey, Alexander, Brooks, Eddings, Feist, Kurtz, Weis & Hickman, Wurts, McKiernan, McMaster Bujold, Erikson and others (this is by no means meant to be a complete or exhaustive list) have all appealled to me at points in my life. I have found that I desire different themes and characters as I age... But doth not the appetite alter? A man loves the meat in his youth that he cannot endure in his age... When I said I would die a Tolkienphile, I did not think I should live till I found Martin.

My apologies to Mr. Shakespeare.

 

[No One]

There are people here who can give you a better opinion on how Martin compares to other fantasy authors, but I'd say he well deserves the attention (though these threads are probably fuelled in part by waiting for the next books).

For what it's worth though, I think the Song of Ice and Fire series is a masterpiece (even if it's not finished yet). Great storytelling and the best fiction I've read for a long, long time. If you want to start somewhere, the first book in the series - A Game of Thrones - is where to go. There are a couple of older stories that are based in the same setting, but they're not compulsory to reading the series.

And a wise choice to avoid the threads.

 

[Kor]

Welcome, Kor. I was just playing the old Warlords game. Ahhh, that first strategy war game for the PC. Anyway one of the factions are the Orcs of Kor.

I read Eddings back in high school <ahem> thirty years ago. And I enjoyed it until I realized that fantasy could be more than just copying Tolkien.

I read Feist back in college. And I enjoyed Midkemia and the side quests while all powerful wizards and gods battled for total power... yet I wanted less magic and more intrigue. I enjoyed his world of Midkemia so much that I kept reading long after I realized the stories were completely formulaic.

I read Legend by Gemmell two years ago. He's not a great writer; his characters are one dimensional; his plots are transparent; and I detest the use of deus ex machina... yet I loved Legend. After reading many attempts, both good and bad, of morally ambiguous characters, of convoluted plots, of thinly disguised allegory pushing some environmental or universalist agenda, and stories of every anthropomorphic creature, bug, and alien out there, I found Gemmell to be delightfully refreshing. His heroes are heroic, his good guys are good, his bad guys are bad, his cowards are cowardly... Legend did not hold any pretense of intellectualism (okay, I'm guilty of that) nor did it get bogged down with minutiae. Gemmell got right to the heart of the story and the action. For anyone who's tired of prophesied teenage saviors, bored with the wizard/ranger/elf/dwarf questing party, frustrated with multi-layered shades of morality, and sick of political, environmental, and theological proselytizing... then Legend is the book for you.

Now if you want to see strong moral themes, believable characters, and a riveting world against a backdrop of political intrigue, social injustice, religious tensions, and convincing bloody realism, then Martin's epic A Song of Ice and Fire is what you should read.

The writings of many fantasy authors have inspired me for many years. Lewis, Baum, Tolkien, Burroughs, LeGuin, Stasheff, Howard, McCaffrey, Alexander, Brooks, Eddings, Feist, Kurtz, Weis & Hickman, Wurts, McKiernan, McMaster Bujold, Erikson and others (this is by no means meant to be a complete or exhaustive list) have all appealled to me at points in my life. I have found that I desire different themes and characters as I age... But doth not the appetite alter? A man loves the meat in his youth that he cannot endure in his age... When I said I would die a Tolkienphile, I did not think I should live till I found Martin.

My apologies to Mr. Shakespeare.

Thanks for the welcome.

You are quite correct as i started with Weis & Hickman and forgotten realms books in my youth, then Tolkien, Brooks, Wurts, Eddings, Gemmel, Feist, Gene Wolfe and others over the years as i got older.

I will give A Song of Ice and Fire a shot as it sounds interesting.

 

[Eulalia]

Hi Kor. It wil definitely hurt your experience if you spoil yourself by reading most of the other threads, as you have guessed.
It would be a good idea to complete the series and be up to date before you discuss it here.

Why read it? If you like fantasy, great characters, history (except you don't know how this is going to turn out), detailed writing, grit, mysteries and challenging themes, then this series could be for you!

 

[Boaz]

Kor, literature is art. ASOIAF may not appeal to you... there's just something about being a certain age... having experiences that resonate with characters and themes... Janny Wurts and China Mieville are great writers and yet I am not thrilled with their stories. I loved Pern, Barsoom, Hyborea, and Midkemia, yet going back gives me no thrill. Tad Williams and Robert Jordan tell epic tales, and yet I've been there and done that. On the other hand, in twenty years I may not have any liking for Martin either.

 

[viZion]

I hate new people.

Wait, no, it's Bran that I hate. New people are cool.

A Song of Ice and Fire is the best fantasy series I've read and some of the best books I've read, period. I place a high value on entertainment but the actual prose is excellent as well.

However, I think it's VERY important to know that the series is nowhere near completion yet. I'm saying that it could be another 10 years or more before it's complete. There's a very real chance it will never be done (I know a lot of people don't like to hear that and I may get flamed for saying it). It's important that you know because these books are so good that there's a good chance you'll be sucked in and want nothing more than to find out what happens next. Unfortunately, it could be years before you know.

That said, I don't regret starting the series. And if another book in the series never comes out I still won't regret having started the series. It's been awesome to read it (twice) and then to talk about it with the fine people here. I'm extremely satisfied with the 4 books and few novellas we have now.

One last thing: Even the thread titles in this forum are highly spoiler-y. Careful!

 

[Koopa]

What are new people?
Modified old people?
Where you created yesterday?

 

[Boaz]

What are new people?
Modified old people?
Where you created yesterday?

Maybe it's the fact that it's 4am or mayhaps this is just funny... I dunno, but I'm crying 'cause it's so funny!

 

[The Imp]

GRRM is, IMO, the very rare author that has the 2 qualities needed to be labeled "great".

He's an amazing writer, who in AOSIAF uses incredible levels of detail, research and descriptiveness to create as diverse and beautiful a fantasy world as you'll find anywhere in ifction.

He's a master story-teller who knows how to weave an intricate plot in such a way that the threads all come together to form a story that is, perhaps, one of the grandest and ambitious ever seen in fantasy fiction.

I need to run out of the house now, but welcome, and I'll have a little to say about using the "25k hits must mean there's something good to be found here" theory.

 

[xLORDSNOWx]

Welcome New Guy!

1) Well you have a long way to go to get to where the rest of us are. You will more than likely have to re read all four books again to get a clear understanding. With the intricate details of this series its almost necessary so that you wont miss anything.

2) You can start going through the numerous threads to confirm the theories of what you have read.

3) You can start reading all of the crack pot theories. Some are far fetched and some will more than likely be right on.

4) Afterwards, you can join in the discussions about any and everything that comes to mind (being that this is an incomplete series, there are never any stupid questions or theories, just those not asked)

Prepare to be be late for work because of sitting in your car in the parking lot trying to finish a chapter. Nodding off at night because it's 4am and you just cant put the book down. Ignoring family members and being antisocial because this will be the only thing on your mind.

Like myself, you wont have any downtime in between books as i read all 4 last year and for that time period, i was almost totally inaccesible.

As everyone else has said, this may be one of the best sci fi stories told. Enjoy the ride, because it will touch on alot different emotions that you never knew were there. I think i may start on the series again, because just as many times as i have read the series i still seem to find a little nugget that connects several other things in my mind.

Have fun, and give your closest friends/loved ones a heads up that you may be away for awhile.

 

[Boaz]

Prepare to be be late for work because of sitting in your car in the parking lot trying to finish a chapter. Nodding off at night because it's 4am and you just cant put the book down. Ignoring family members and being antisocial because this will be the only thing on your mind.

I posted this somewhere else... but the day A Feast for Crows went on sale in Denver, I bought the book as soon as the store opened and I did not even wait to get home to read it. Instead, I holed up in my pickup truck right there in the parking lot and read for about five hours until I realized I was hungry. So I walked across the parking lot to a fast food joint and I sat there for two or three hours reading. Then I went back to my pickup and read until it was too dark to see... only then did I waste time driving home. I read until I passed out. Then I finished AFFC the next morning.

Kor, you must now be thinking, "Boaz is a total dork!", "Dude, don't you have a life?", and "Is A Song of Ice and Fire worth it?" Well, my responses are "I know!", "No.", and "Yes!"

Of course no story could live up to the billing we've given it here. You might find some comparisons of Martin to other authors in the general forums. I'm sure you'd find some who don't care for him. But I think by far the biggest complaint against Martin is his pace. viZ stated above that you must beware that you won't be reading a new book every year. The publication dates for the series so far have been...
A Game of Thrones, August 1996
A Clash of Kings, November 1998
A Storm of Swords, August 2000
A Feast for Crows, October 2005
So if you can deal with waiting five or six years between books, then start reading. A fun side effect of the long intervals has been the rise of Martin discussion forums. When an author cranks out a new book every year, what do the fans really have to discuss? And when an author finishes a series, the fan community have nothing left to discuss... e.g. the Harry Potter series. The discussions, the guessing, the silliness, and the anticipation make the waiting fun.

You mentioned Eddings, Feist, and Gemmell in your original post. In The Belgariad, did you really ever feel that Garion, Belgarath, or Polgara were in real danger of dying? How about Pug, Arutha, and Jimmy in The Riftwar Saga? None of the main characters were ever really injured (I'm not counting Belgarath's drained powers)... I never felt these characters could actually die... oh, peripheral characters could die, but not the main protagonists. In Legend, Gemmell sets up the death of Druss from the beginning... he definitely softened the blow.

Now let me just tell you something... A Song of Ice and Fire is not like The Belgariad nor The Riftwar Saga. Nor will Martin soften the blow. Caveat emptor.

 

[The Imp]

Kor, you must now be thinking, "Boaz is a total dork!", "Dude, don't you have a life?", and "Is A Song of Ice and Fire worth it?" Well, my responses are "I know!", "No.", and "Yes!"

Dork's of the world unite, you have only your pocket protectors to lose

That's a great story. It sounds like a wonderful day, one that I can totally relate to. I'm hoping for one like that really soon.

 

[Boaz]

It sounds like a wonderful day, one that I can totally relate to. I'm hoping for one like that really soon.

You're a dork!!! Get a life!!!

Or was that a sly hint, Mr. Martin?

 

[xLORDSNOWx]

Originally Posted by Boaz
I bought the book as soon as the store opened and I did not even wait to get home to read it. Instead, I holed up in my pickup truck right there in the parking lot and read for about five hours until I realized I was hungry. So I walked across the parking lot to a fast food joint and I sat there for two or three hours reading. Then I went back to my pickup and read until it was too dark to see... only then did I waste time driving home. I read until I passed out. Then I finished AFFC the next morning.

That had to be an exhausting day. Did you immediately go back for a re read, or did it sink in pretty well? I find my self going back often because i would be so tired and forget a whole paragraph that i read. I guess mixing reading and "mary jane" doesnt help

That's a great story. It sounds like a wonderful day, one that I can totally relate to. I'm hoping for one like that really soon.

I'm looking forward to that day as well. As soon as there is a confirmed date that Dance will be released, i will more than likely take some vacation time off of work. I would be useless the whole day until i got off, thinking about what's next. No kidding, i was really late for work often because time would just fly while reading the book. I had to introduce the series to my boss so he could understand, and he started coming in late as well for the same reason.

However, I'm still hoping that the audio version is released simultaneously with the actual book. With headphones on and in a total trance, I'm sure i will be bumping into everone and everything.

 

[No One]

First we're trying to figure out who's Martin, now it's who's a dork. I'll happily join that queue.

For the 4-5 months me and a friend of mine were reading the books they were literally all we talked about. I tried to pace myself with two or three chapters a day, which, for instance, I did with the first half of A Storm of Swords, before blasting through the second half.

And when (if - let's not tempt fate) Dance finally comes out I hope to have a 'Boaz Day' too (though I'll probably go to greater lengths to sequester myself and perform a blood sacrifice before reading). Seriously, I'm heavily into my literature but I have never bought a book that I thought I have to start reading immediately. That will change with ADWD.

 

[Boaz]

Kor, You don't know how difficult it is (and I think I speak for everyone here) to not SPOIL the story for you. I know the moment, the exact moment, when Martin hooked me. I won't give that away, but since that point I've read every new chapter at a non-stop break-neck pace. Then I've gone back and re-read to notice the particulars and the subtleties.

But it's not like GRRM does not leave hints of what he's going to do... If I'd read one chapter per week, taken notes, and mulled things over, then I think (wishful thinking, I'm sure) that I would not have been surprised... I'm shutting up now.

 

[Corn! Corn! Corn!]

^

 

[The Imp]

That had to be an exhausting day. Did you immediately go back for a re read, or did it sink in pretty well? I find my self going back often because i would be so tired and forget a whole paragraph that i read. I guess mixing reading and "mary jane" doesnt help



I'm looking forward to that day as well. As soon as there is a confirmed date that Dance will be released, i will more than likely take some vacation time off of work. I would be useless the whole day until i got off, thinking about what's next. No kidding, i was really late for work often because time would just fly while reading the book. I had to introduce the series to my boss so he could understand, and he started coming in late as well for the same reason.

However, I'm still hoping that the audio version is released simultaneously with the actual book. With headphones on and in a total trance, I'm sure i will be bumping into everone and everything.

The Harry Potter audio versions shipped shipped on the day the book was actually released. I have no idea why. I paid for overinight shipping (this was with the last book) and didn't go near the computer or TV/raio until I was done listening to the book. I couldn't risk some moron posting a spolier, either unintentinally or not. I will do the same when ADWD comes out, since we know that anything can happen and if it does, someone will talk about it.

 

[Boaz]

Imp, that is one reason why I raced through AFFC... it was the first new book since I found this forum and I did not want to read spoilers posted by some idiot. I wanted to be the idiot posting the spoilers... err, I mean I did it to spare you all the shame of being idiots... uh, that's why I take it upon myself... um, I actually do it to help you... You get the picture.