'Fess up, now: truly creepy?

Extollager

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Would folks like to respond to the following?

I began to read HPL when I was about 14, back around 1970. In the next couple of years I read "everything" by him, and some of his stories several times. I enjoyed my immersion in HPLiana a lot.

But I don't think that, in general, I found his stories very creepy. I was fascinated by HPL-and-his-fiction. It made quite an impression, at an impressionable age; it enhanced my interest in old buildings, for one thing. But creepy? Usually not very creepy. I have a vague memory that when I read "The Rats in the Walls," that creeped me a little.

For the sake of contrast, I would cite A. M. Burrage's "One Who Saw" as a story that I did find creepy; and when I read it for the first time I wasn't a susceptible (??) teenager, but about 30 years old.

So: 'fess up. Has Lovecraft's fiction truly struck anyone as creepy? If so, which stories?
 
Truly creepy? Absolutely!

Dagon
The Statement Of Randolph Carter
Facts Concerning The Late Arthur Jermyn And His Family
Celephais
Nyarlathotep
The Picture In The House
The Outsider
Cool Air
The Case Of Charles Dexter Ward
 
The Colour out of Space
The Music of Erich Zann
The Shadow out of Time

are the ones that spring to mind.
 
Most certainly, "The Colour Out of Space" heads the list. I also find "The Music of Erich Zann" very effective. Others which provide that frisson would be

"The Call of Cthulhu"
At the Mountains of Madness
The Case of Charles Dexter Ward
"The Curse of Yig"
"The Festival" (especially the middle section and that quote from the Necronomicon)
"Nyarlathotep"
portions of "The Nameless City"
"The Shadow Out of Time"
and even, to some degree, "The Strange High House in the Mist" (especially that final paragraph, with its implications)
and, as I get older, "The Tomb" has also regained its ability to chill, as I appreciate the subtle touches of that tale (which is really quite complex considering it was his first in nine years), more and more....

It isn't the sort of reaction one would experience with the physical horror of so many stories, but that quieter, but often more profound terror (as Poe would say) "of the soul"; and depends as much upon a careful structure and use of language for shading and imagery on a poetic level as it does on actual incident or plot.

Then again, I tend to read HPL very intently and critically, rather than simply for entertainment, much as I do Baudelaire, Balzac, or Maupassant; or, in the more direct line, Mrs. Radcliffe, Walter de la Mare, or Nathaniel Hawthorne....
 
Please keep going, people. I'm enjoying your responses. But I want to mention that "The Picture in the House" is my other mirth-provoking Lovecraft story. Somehow I almost imagine it as an early MAD magazine comic-art story illustrated by Will Elder in the manner of his immortal "HEAP!"

"'Ef 'twas more the same -- '"

!!
 
It would help if one were to define "creepy". If you mean feelings of fear, then I would have to say I no longer find HPL frightening, and am not sure I ever did. However, if you mean the sensations of wonder and mystery which arise as HPL overthrows the laws of time and space, and confronts us with the truly alien, then, yes, in that sense he is "creepy".
 
I've got to admit that I've never found that one particularly humorous in any way. Grotesque, yes. Pure grue, yes. But humorous? Even gallows humor? Not really.

As for the dialect there (and elsewhere in Lovecraft)... as Jason Eckhart pointed out many years ago, that dialect serves several purposes. It is largely based on the phonetic representation of dialect from James Russell Lowell's Biglow Papers, a dialect which was even then dying out. So it is an authentic New England dialect, and reflects the region. It also indicates the unnatural in these tales in various ways. In "The Picture in the House" it tells of the prolonged life of the recluse by having him speak in a manner out of date for nigh on a century... a fact the narrator calls attention to, as he would indeed be sensitive to such things and their placement in time, given his researches in old documents, diaries, and the like. In "Innsmouth" and "The Dunwich Horror", it indicates the way these regions are lands which lie outside of normal space and time; they are not just cut off from the modern world but places where the past still exists and holds sway. These dialects also serve as a sort of homely contrast to the scholarly and sometimes poetic prose which surrounds them, providing an odd sort of "earthiness" which makes the encroachment of the cosmic even more powerful as a result -- this is especially true with "The Colour Out of Space", where Nahum's dying soliloquy is in sharp contrast to what is occurring and the concepts he is attempting to convey; concepts which he himself, despite having experienced them firsthand, can only dimly comprehend. In this case, too, it provides a point of pathos and tragedy at the utter senselessness of the fate of the Gardner family (and, by extension, the entire region and -- possibly -- the world itself).

HPL himself was, as I have mentioned in other posts, well aware of the alienness of this dialect to even the most rustic of countrymen in his day, commenting that, were he to use it in addressing such, he would be regarded as someone having wandered from some theatrical troupe....
 
JDW, that's interesting about the dialect in "Picture in the House."

I don't know if HPL intended the story to be funny in an over-the-top way, but that's how it hits me. It's not just the dialect. You have the narrator's increasing uneasiness -- then SPOTCCCHHH! a drop of blood lands in front of him. He freaks out (as who of us wouldn't!) and hightails it out of there, and KA-BOOM! lightning hits the old house.

To me, this story is more like something you'd tell around the campfire -- and get roars of approving laughter and Ewww's -- than anything much more profound. It practically cries out to be presented in such a setting; the dialect would definitely be a big part of its success.

In fact, I remember regaling my cousins with a "picture in the house" yarn of my own when I was a kid, but I'm not sure if I'd read the HPL story by then.

Incidentally, picky point, but for the record perhaps I shouldn't have said that I "literally" got tears (of mirth) to my eyes when reading the hilarious phoneticized scream in "Shadow Over Innsmouth."

I'll grant that a little of my mirth may be due to some tension built up when reading the two stories.

That, by the way, raises a new topic for discussion. Here we go:

People have known at least since Shakespeare that, in an extended work of suspense, you need to give the audience or readers a break; otherwise, they may become "tired" from so much suspense, and your later material less effective. So, notoriously, in Shakespeare's Macbeth, you have the scene with the drunken porter "at the gate of hell," with his urinous philosophizing. It is a great, masterful touch.

Now let's list a few long works by HPL: "The Whisperer in Darkness," Charles Dexter Ward, At the Mountains of Madness, "The Shadow Over Innsmouth," etc.

Do any of these need a break(s), something to ease the tension so that their subsequent developments will be more effective? If so, do they have such breaks? What do you think?

I'm not saying, by the way, that all stories of supernatural dread do need such breaks.

In Blackwood's "Willows," you have, not a humorous easing of tension, but some dead wood of occult philosophizing. It might be, though, that that dead wood does have an "easing" function. In "The Wendigo," you have Defago's disappearance, and the hunt for him, which is interesting but not keyed-up like the material just before it.

But I hope others will also comment on the initial topic -- are there any Lovecraft stories that struck you as creepy?
 
Lately The Dunwich Horror has been creeping me out. In the annals of stories that have a shocker ending that is put into italics, somehow this one just has a hideous effectiveness every time I read it. And the weird screaming of the twin with alien language mixed with Englsh just has a creepiness that actually affects me. I know this story has been criticized as hack work by Joshi, but I think the technique of putting all the descriptions into the words of back-woods primitives makes the action all the more scarier. It reminds me of a cosmicist version of Deliverance.
 
I'm not sure HPL needs comic relief in his stories. Unrelenting tension just makes me squirm in my seat all the more, like At The Mountains Of Madness. If I need a break I stop reading for a while.
 
Keep the discussion going about which HPL stories, if any, are creepy (define as you will), please.

But here's a question with reference to the phoneticized scream in "Shadow Over Innsmouth":

Does anyone want to make the case that the addition of a phoneticized scream(s) might enhance the power of, say, Blackwood's "Wendigo," M. R. James's "'O, Whistle, and I'll Come to You, My Lad,'" Poe's "M. Valdemar," etc.?
 
JDW, I wanted to pick up your comment, "I tend to read HPL very intently and critically, rather than simply for entertainment, much as I do Baudelaire, Balzac, or Maupassant; or, in the more direct line, Mrs. Radcliffe, Walter de la Mare, or Nathaniel Hawthorne...."

Hawthorne's a favorite of mine, and in no small degree because of his wonderful journals. The first is the American Notebooks, then the English (which I am reading now), then the French and Italian (which I have yet to read). The American volume has some wonderful nuggets. Perhaps my favorite bit is Hawthorne's nonchalant reference to a winter day when he expedited his return home from a walk by stepping onto an ice floe. His companion that day was Henry David Thoreau. What a loss to American literature if those two had drowned! As one who lives in North Dakota, three minutes' walk from a river that freezes for months of every year and breaks into floes in the spring, I assure you that clambering on ice floes is not what you should be doing! I just about lost my dog to the river a few years ago...

I also appreciated the reference to Mother Radcliffe, whom I am reading for the first time just now; The Mysteries of Udolpho, a couple or a few pages a night before lights-out. My interest was largely prompted by artist Samuel Palmer's fondness for her books. ("Extollagers" is what some rural folk called Palmer and his fellow young "Ancients" during the Shoreham period -- see Geoffrey Grigson's Samuel Palmer: The Visionary Years. There is a story of the fellows setting out at 10:00 one night to get hold of one of her books.)

All right, hope no one minded the digression, back to HPL.
 
You raise some very interesting points, and I must thank you both for the discussion in general and for that story about Palmer in particular; this was something I was totally unaware of.

On the subject of Hawthorne: I have by no means read everything of the man's, but I do have a huge selection of it set aside for reading (and, in many cases re-reading) following my (extended) reading of Poe (which has included not only his fiction and verse but letters, critical essays, reviews, and any other documents by him I have been able to come across; for the tales, sketches, and verse, where possible I have been using Prof. T. O. Mabbott's annotated edition). I have read large portions of Hawthorne's notebooks before, though, as well as most of his novels and his complete short stories, and some of his letters; but I am very much looking forward to doing so again, as Hawthorne has always had a firm place in my estimation.

On Mother Radcliffe: I hope you enjoy Udolpho, though that is by no means the easiest of her books to begin with (I am assuming it is the first; though I could be misreading you there). I read them in order, beginning with The Castles of Athlin and Dunbayne, and have read all but Gaston de Blondeville several times now, my appreciation for them growing each time. That one exception is due to two things: I do not have a copy in my personal library, unlike the others; and I found that, though this is the one instance in which she kept the supernatural as a real phenomenon, I felt that the writing here was much weaker overall. It seemed to lack her usual polish (or finish, if you prefer), making it feel at times almost makeshift in comparison to her other works.

As for your points about "The Picture in the House"... I can see where you are coming from; it just doesn't tend to strike me that way. Incidentally, the narrator doesn't "hightail it out of there", but freezes, simply closing his eyes, only to open them again on a scene of devastation following the "thunderbolt". A point which has always stirred some controversy, as it leaves it open to question how the narrator survived, whether what he encountered was a "ghost" house and its inhabitant, whether the stroke of lightning was a judgment of some sort (something which would be completely alien to Lovecraft's usual atheistic approach), and, indeed, just how reliable this narrator actually is. There have been some interesting articles written on this one over the years, as a result....

No, I don't think Lovecraft's longer pieces necessarily "need" any such humorous interlude. I tend to agree with him that, in the main, when it comes to works centering on terror, such actually dilutes the effect, often making it nearly impossible to regain the tension and genuine atmosphere of the otherworldly. However, this is not to say that Lovecraft doesn't have some lighter touches. There is some dry humor in "The Whisperer in Darkness", I think; and certainly his comment about Gilman studying too hard in "The Dreams in the Witch House" would seem to be an excellent example of such wit, as it serves as a rather acidic comment yet increases the horror of the situation. Ward does, I think, have one moment which may or may not have been intentionally of a humorous nature. That is during Charles' defense of his incantations and the sort of psychological realm he must inhabit in order to get full benefit from them. This smacks of exactly the sort of occultism Lovecraft derided when used by others, and has always struck me as an awkward passage as a result. He may, indeed, have intended this as a slap at exactly this sort of nonsense in weird writing; but, if so, I fear that it still constitutes, if not an artistic blunder, at least an artistic misstep. And, of course, The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath is peppered with bits of humor, both dry and otherwise (I believe it was George Wetzel who remarked on the "gargoyle"/"gar-ghoul" pun concerning Carter's encounter with some of Pickman's cohorts).
 
Dask, that's a good point about the reader's liberty to take a break from the reading. It reminds me of the probability that, when I began to read HPL in my mid-teens, I read just that way -- not reading any of the longer stories from start to finish in one go. On the other hand, though, doesn't your comment assume that the reader, on his own, senses when and where in the reading to take such a break, with relatively minimal loss to the impact of the story?

Back of my mind is Poe's comment about writing a story such that it can be completed in one sitting, so that the reader is at the author's mercy. In such a situation the writer can strategically place comic relief, or passages of lesser tension, or what have you. I suppose, however, that few readers read "The Whisperer in Darkness" or At the Mountains of Madness "in one sitting." So you're going to get breaks in the tension.

This raises yet another topic, namely whether HPL wrote his stories with breaks for serialization in mind. My impression is that he wanted to place At the Mountains with Weird Tales, though it ended up, split across two issues, in Astounding. Did he originally figure it would be serialized? I don't think WT serialized any of the stories published in his lifetime.
 
JDW, the anecdote about Palmer and other Ancients setting out for Sevenoaks at 10:00 one night to get a copy of The Mysteries of Udolpho is on pp. 51-52 of Grigson's book.

Yes, Mysteries of Udolpho is the first Radcliffe I have read. She paints some excellent landscapes in words. I forget whether she mentions the paintings of Salvator Rosa (whom HPL does mention somewhere) -- I saw recently that there's an exhibition of his paintings going on somewhere.

Most of the time when I refer to the HPL stories, even quoting, I'm going by memory, I admit!

There's a little Ambrose Bierce-type humor in "Cats of Ulthar," no?
 
Dask, that's a good point about the reader's liberty to take a break from the reading. It reminds me of the probability that, when I began to read HPL in my mid-teens, I read just that way -- not reading any of the longer stories from start to finish in one go. On the other hand, though, doesn't your comment assume that the reader, on his own, senses when and where in the reading to take such a break, with relatively minimal loss to the impact of the story?

Back of my mind is Poe's comment about writing a story such that it can be completed in one sitting, so that the reader is at the author's mercy. In such a situation the writer can strategically place comic relief, or passages of lesser tension, or what have you. I suppose, however, that few readers read "The Whisperer in Darkness" or At the Mountains of Madness "in one sitting." So you're going to get breaks in the tension.

Actually, most people I have either spoken to or read on this topic do ten to read Mountains in a single sitting. It is a rather short novel (total 104 pp. in the Arkham edition), so actually more of a novelette than a true novel.

This raises yet another topic, namely whether HPL wrote his stories with breaks for serialization in mind. My impression is that he wanted to place At the Mountains with Weird Tales, though it ended up, split across two issues, in Astounding. Did he originally figure it would be serialized? I don't think WT serialized any of the stories published in his lifetime.

Certainly he thought it would be so serialized:

It is divided into 12 sections, & is capable of a major serial division in the exact middle.

-- Essential Solitude: The Letters of H. P. Lovecraft and & August Derleth: 1926-1931, p. 325​

To be pedantic, it was actually split up into three sections in Astounding: Vol. 16, No. 6 (February 1936), pp. 8-32; 17, No. 1 (March 1936), pp. 125-55; and 17, No. 2 (April 1936), pp. 132-50. It was also terribly butchered, with large sections of text being removed, not to mention many other examples of editorial tampering... which led HPL to declare that, in his view, the thing still had not been published!

JDW, the anecdote about Palmer and other Ancients setting out for Sevenoaks at 10:00 one night to get a copy of The Mysteries of Udolpho is on pp. 51-52 of Grigson's book.

Thank you. I will have to look that up sometime; just the sort of thing which fascinates me so....

Yes, Mysteries of Udolpho is the first Radcliffe I have read. She paints some excellent landscapes in words. I forget whether she mentions the paintings of Salvator Rosa (whom HPL does mention somewhere) -- I saw recently that there's an exhibition of his paintings going on somewhere.

Yes, she does mention Rosa, though I'm not sure whether she does so in Udolpho or not (albeit I dimly recall such being the case). Certainly Rosa was a major influence on Radcliffe, and on several of the Gothic writers of the time. Incidentally, I would assume you have read Edmund Burke's "A Philosophical Inquiry into the Origin of Our Ideas of the Sublime and Beautiful"? This was certainly a major influence on Mother Radcliffe and the entire school, and is a fascinating and thought-provoking piece in and of itself, along with Anna Letitia Barbauld's "On the Pleasure Derived from the Objects of Terror"; I highly recommend both these and Sir Devendra P. Varma's book, The Gothic Flame....

There's a little Ambrose Bierce-type humor in "Cats of Ulthar," no?

Had not thought of Bierce specifically in that connection, but I suppose one could make a case for it... especially in light of "Oil of Dog", for instance....;) CAS certainly felt that "In the Vault" had a strongly Biercian flavor to it....
 
I'm thinking of reading The Romance of the Forest after I finish The Mysteries of Udolpho.
 
I'm thinking of reading The Romance of the Forest after I finish The Mysteries of Udolpho.

I am particularly fond of that one, I must admit. My first encounter with Mrs. Radcliffe was in excerpts from that which were included in Jack & Barbara Wolf's Ghosts, Castles, & Victims... which I first read around the age of 14 or so....
 
Yes, Mysteries of Udolpho is the first Radcliffe I have read. She paints some excellent landscapes in words. I forget whether she mentions the paintings of Salvator Rosa (whom HPL does mention somewhere) -- I saw recently that there's an exhibition of his paintings going on somewhere.

Her landscape descriptions are truly stupendous -- but a heroine who spends 800 pages weeping and fainting and fainting and weeping has not encouraged me to re-read it in the past 12 years.

There's a little Ambrose Bierce-type humor in "Cats of Ulthar," no?

Hmmm... never thought of that, but yes, quite possible. HPL found Bierce anomalously late, in 1919.
 

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