How Much Should You Put On Chrons?

The Bloated One

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Hi all,

This may have been dealt with already - couldn't find anything, so here are two questions;

a) If your intention is to be published, how much of a 100,000 word novel should you post for discussion on Chrons?

b) Are agents/publishers happy with work shown on a public forum?



TBO
 
a) as little as possible

b) not unless they're the ones doing it

I don't think that publishers will refuse to take a person on just because he's put 5,000 words of his book up here on Critiques, but the more there is the less happy they will be. Best to err on the side of caution, I'd say.
 
I don't know the answer, but I've always wondered how anybody would know you'd put it online? Is an agent likely to Google chunks of your work?
 
Perhaps not, but they might google your name to check publishing credits/your website which could give the game away. They might also ask!
 
I think it is usually 10% but I never put more than a few pages of an early draft of something up. I'd rather not lose out on a dream contract over it.
 
But the feedback is invaluable and you might not have got to that point with an agent without it... Difficult to be sure.
 
Honestly, a few thousand words of first draft is not going to blow your chances. Neither is running your book through an online critique group like http://sff.onlinewritingworkshop.com/ , http://critters.org/ or the share your work section of http://www.absolutewrite.com/forums/

No one is going to pinch your work either ;)

You need to find a few decent and willing beta readers who you trust to tell you the truth. If you haven't got a face-to-face critique/writing group near you online is the next best thing.
 
a) If your intention is to be published, how much of a 100,000 word novel should you post for discussion on Chrons?

All of it. Every last word. Just don't tell them that is was you, and when they find out, cry foul and say you're gonna sue. Then make sure the newspapers get wind of it. Nothing sells like some good old controversy!

On a serious note - what the others said. Don't share a significant portion of it. And if you already have shared some when you get in touch with an agent/publisher, it's probably better to be upfront about it and tell them that you have done so. Because if they find out later, they'll just think you've been hiding it from them, which will in turn make them wonder what else you've been hiding...
 
Hi TBO

a) If your intention is to be published, how much of a 100,000 word novel should you post for discussion on Chrons?
No right or wrong answers, I suspect, but as a general rule, post just enough so that the ensuing feedback improves the whole. That'll give you a better chance of getting picked up in the first place. Then you can enjoy the luxury of an argument about what you have already put out there!

b) Are agents/publishers happy with work shown on a public forum?
Agents and publishers see books as a business. Quite right, too. If they can sell something, they'll be happy. As should be the writer who seriously aspires to be professional. I can't really see too many situations arising where having a few thousand words out on a site like this would genuinely prevent someone who is excited about the book and who wants to make an offer from making an offer.

Regards,

Peter
 
All,

Thanks to everyone who took the time to give advice.

I thought a small portion of a novel was likely to be acceptable. Trouble is, I need to post most of my novel on Chrons just to get the help I need to correct it!!



TBO
 
All,

Thanks to everyone who took the time to give advice.

I thought a small portion of a novel was likely to be acceptable. Trouble is, I need to post most of my novel on Chrons just to get the help I need to correct it!!



TBO

Not really any serious recurring errors will be picked up either from a few pages or short stories. Once you know how to fix them you can do them yourself.

And someone above pointed out use it to find some good beta readers who you can trust to be honest and exchange work with. Those relationships take a bit of time - its taken me eighteen months to find a group of people who are reliable and will exchange things quickly.
 
Thanks Anyakimlin,

Chris Penycate is the grammar guru and helps me cross the 't's and dot the 'i's, but you are right, I need to foster a couple of 'creative' like minded Chronites to help me.


TBO
 
My own view is that the writing I submit here, or elsewhere, I am basically giving away for free. I won't ever be paid for it and unless it's an excerpt from a much larger work it won't be published.
 
I thought a small portion of a novel was likely to be acceptable. Trouble is, I need to post most of my novel on Chrons just to get the help I need to correct it!!

With respect, old chap, I don't think you do.

However good the crits are, ultimately it's down to you. Don't forget that most of us who crit are also unpublished wannabees, so our views need to be taken with fairly heavy doses of salt.

I think you'd be the first to admit that the same observations come up time and time again - Chris berates you about grammar and I berate you about pace and narrative voice. If you agree with us (and the other comments you get), you need to fix the problems yourself. Rewrite, rewrite, rewrite. You can get everything you need to know about grammar from books or online sources. You can pick up hints on pace etc simply by reading action books which do it well.

A crit isn't the same thing as a line editing service. If that's what you need (and I don't think it is, because you are a good writer), you'd be better off paying for it professionally. Same goes for proofreading.

Regards,

Peter
 
This may have been dealt with already - couldn't find anything, so here are two questions;

a) If your intention is to be published, how much of a 100,000 word novel should you post for discussion on Chrons?

b) Are agents/publishers happy with work shown on a public forum?

a) as little as possible

b) not unless they're the ones doing it

Absolutely agree!


Trouble is, I need to post most of my novel on Chrons just to get the help I need to correct it!!

No you don't!

Most writers think they have to post a load of work, so people can get into the characters and events. Nothing is further from the truth.

From long experience, I can state plainly that a couple of hundred words is easily more than enough. That will demonstrate your style, pacing, word craft, and similar issues - their positives and their flaws. And people will respond to that.

The biggest turn-off for a critique is to post a big wad of content - no one wants that. Most people have a life and don't have time to volunteer much to contribute.

Therefore a small section is easily enough, it invites reading, and any issues with the text will become very apparent indeed.

Frankly, most writers have issues that show plainly in the smallest piece of text. It's only once they develop a sharp and advanced understanding of their writing that they no longer need to ask for short crits.

In which case, when you reach that stage, it's time to either a) find a dedicated crit group of advanced writers, or b)pay for editing services such as from Teresa Edgerton or John Jarrold.

Personally I side towards editing services, on the grounds that if you're going to get someone to critique your work for submission to the publishing industry, then better to have someone do so from the other side of the industry with the benefit of the knowledge and experience that brings.

I know Teresa has said she doesn't do line editing, but I would imagine any simple errors will be pointed out, with her preferring to focus on story and characters - the very thing most people try and get critiqued, BEFORE they have developed a proper tight writing style.

So overall, little steps - develop your style using short excerpts posted here and take the feedback as required, then move to editing for the bigger concepts.

And, yes, publishers are potentially very wary of material already published even on forums, as it potentially invalidates the digital rights of the piece. And we have a strict policy of not deleting material from chrons, precisely because we warn people not to post any large excerpts anyway for precisely that reason!

Hope that helps, anyway. :)
 
exactly why i stopped posting material from MC a while back. TBO, all the advice above is good - writers' groops and places like Critters are your way forward now, i think.
 

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