Define YA (Young Adult Fiction)

[RJM Corbet]

Let's try and get this right once and for all.

What is/not YA fiction?

 

[alchemist]

Harry Potter is.

American Psycho isn't.

Glad to have been of service...

(I'm on my phone so can't post the link, but there's a thorough definition in the YA forum here. It's in-depth but probably too proscriptive)

 

[RJM Corbet]

Harry Potter is.

American Psycho isn't ...

So you're telling me all this vampire/zombie stuff is aimed at adults?

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Young Adult is literature aimed at and of interest to people aged between 12 and 21. This usually means a protagonist within that age range or just slightly older. The books usually have easier to understand (not dumbed down) language, a faster flow etc They also tend to be shorter, Strange Chemistry is asking for around 60-100K.

I actually think Harry Potter at least the first three volumes are classed as junior fiction in some libraries and bookshops (ages 8-12) although i am sure there is disagreement on that. The Hardy Boys and Nancy Drew are usually junior fiction as opposed to young adult despite have teen protagonists.

 

[RJM Corbet]

Young Adult is literature aimed at and of interest to people aged between 12 and 21. This usually means a protagonist within that age range or just slightly older. The books usually have easier to understand (not dumbed down) language, a faster flow etc They also tend to be shorter, Strange Chemistry is asking for around 60-100K.

I actually think Harry Potter at least the first three volumes are classed as junior fiction in some libraries and bookshops (ages 8-12) although i am sure there is disagreement on that. The Hardy Boys and Nancy Drew are usually junior fiction as opposed to young adult despite have teen protagonists.

Ok well here I can begin to understand. It is the same thing as the fascination with celebrity. It's a wannabe syndrome? It's not what you are, but what you aspire to? In the sense that a 10yr olds will be watching/listening to singers older than they are?

It's just that there seems to be something happening here that won't go away. What is this fascination with vampire stuff? Why are so many people wanting to write it? Is it because there's a potentially lucrative market out there? Obviously this is a a SFF site, which seems to many to mean the same thing? But just who is actually reading it?

And is it YA fiction?

If not, what exactly is it?

 

[AnyaKimlin]

It's just that there seems to be something happening here that won't go away. What is this fascination with vampire stuff? Why are so many people wanting to write it? Is it because there's a potentially lucrative market out there? Obviously this is a a SFF site, which seems to many to mean the same thing? But just who is actually reading it?

And is it YA fiction?

If not, what exactly is it?

Vampires are on Twilight's bandwagon. Just like young wizards jumped on Harry Potter's. Although right now I think zombies are more popular than vampires. Lots of people read young-adult, my bestfriend (librarian) says it is particularly popular with gay men and mums with small children. Because it is usually (not always) shorter and easier to read.

YA fiction can be and is any genre but like with adult stories some things are more popular than others. Some names do better than others.

If you want to write a book that is trendy then you could risk vampires still doing well in a few years time or try to be the next big thing instead.

 

[RJM Corbet]

... If you want to write a book that is trendy then you could risk vampires still doing well in a few years time or try to be the next big thing instead.

Ok maybe the thread is mis-named and the question should be rephrased: Should vampire/zombie popular fiction be regarded by its writers as YA?

Harry Potter obviously falls into a different bracket?

 

[Colbey Frost]

You could have a vampire novel and a vampire YA novel... it's not what it's about, but how it's written I think.

 

[RJM Corbet]

You could have a vampire novel and a vampire YA novel... it's not what it's about, but how it's written I think.

Yes. The original 'Dracula' by Bram Stoker isn't exactly YA. Nor are the Ann Rice novels.
But you know, and I know, that much if not most of the material offered on the crits forum on this website, for instance, seems to be vampire/zombie fiction. And I'm just raising the question: who is it aimed at?

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Ok maybe the thread is mis-named and the question should be rephrased: Should vampire/zombie popular fiction be regarded by its writers as YA?

Harry Potter obviously falls into a different bracket?

Whilst Harry Potter like Tales of the Otori is now classed as crossover fiction I am sure the first Harry Potter was classed as Junior Fiction and not YA. However Artemis Fowl and Dark Materials which were sold on Potter's coat tails (despite being very different) were YA.

Young Adult, Junior Fiction, Early Readers etc are age categories rather than a specific genre.

If the vampire/zombie fiction is of the sort to be of interest to or written in a YA style then it is YA. If it isn't then it is adult paranormal.

My sciencey highish contemporaryish fantasy is YA fantasy because the language is tilted that way and the main character is a seventeen year old boy. It deals with coming of age issues: teen pregnancy, gay family member, self esteem, sibling rivalry, issues with parents etc

 

[RJM Corbet]

Whilst Harry Potter like Tales of the Otori is now classed as crossover fiction I am sure the first Harry Potter was classed as Junior Fiction and not YA. However Artemis Fowl and Dark Materials which were sold on Potter's coat tails (despite being very different) were YA...

Yes, Harry Potter had to grow up to keep pace with Kay Rawlings own children, that he was originally created for.

She knew who she was writing for. The fact 'adults' also liked it was obviously a surprise, that it had such a general appeal? But that's due to its gentle humour really. Harry Potter is funny. Platform nine-and-three quarters, etc. Roald Dahl's the same. And the way the children always win against the grown-ups. Children love that, it's the essence of children's books. Juvenile fiction, then.

I'd say YA would be aimed at mid-teens?

By 18 there aren't many 'kids' reading 'kids' stuff?

By 17 even, they're reading 'adult' fiction (I know, so find a better word then, I'm too tired)

 

[AnyaKimlin]

JK Rowling says she didn't write with an age group in mind. It was just a story. I know with my own my plan wasn't to write a YA book. It just kind of happened when seventeen year old Angus took over the narration from his dead father.

I'm a bad person to ask, because I was reading adult books by the time I was seven (Jane Eyre was my first) and at thirty-five I unashamedly read junior fiction (Spy Dog being my current favourite).

The age group targeted by YA is 12-21 (some bookshops/publishers are 12-18 and one or two I've spoken to say 12-25). YA aged readers read grown up books and grown ups read YA. Most of my friends in their 20s will look at the YA shelves as well as the grown up ones, because books like Tales of the Otori, Dark Materials, Harry Potter etc have made them worth looking at.

 

[RJM Corbet]

Ok but I know there's also an element of aspiration. People read about who they want to be, not about who they are. In the case of kids this means 'older looking' and in the case of their elders perhaps 'younger looking'. Please don't take this comment too literally, or as always true. But ... in general?

 

[Warren_Paul]

It's just that there seems to be something happening here that won't go away. What is this fascination with vampire stuff? Why are so many people wanting to write it? Is it because there's a potentially lucrative market out there? Obviously this is a a SFF site, which seems to many to mean the same thing? But just who is actually reading it?

And is it YA fiction?

If not, what exactly is it?

I don't think it's specifically the "vampire" that makes Twilight so successful, and it's the only vampire novel designed for kids that comes to mind for me, and other I think of are certainly aimed at adults, like Charlaine Harris and Laurell Hamilton.

What set Twilight off was Bella and that fact that she was written so two-dimensional that every teenage girl can imagine herself being Bella and living through this story where she gets to meet and fall in love with the most "perfect" man ever. Notice how Edward is described in Twilight, as being perfect everything, the being a vampire just makes Bella's love interest in him that much more illicit - which relates to teenagers so well, because having relationships so young is often considered taboo by parents. So it gets across to the teenager that they are doing something they shouldn't, and teenagers love breaking the rules, it's almost compulsory in their age group.

Twilight is YA because of its focus on teen romance, and how true it falls into that catagory. It represents what teenage girls feel about such things quite well.

Also, if it was targeted at adults, the writing style would get torn apart. Only by being written for YA can it get away with being so shallow and breaking so many good writing practices.

I think Anya handled the definition of YA quite well. It's all about a teenage protagonist living through a story that YA readers can relate to.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

One of my favourite writers is Gervase Phinn, I've no desire whatsoever to be a middle aged, male, Yorkshire School Inspector. I doubt many of his fans do either. He's funny, warm and lovely to spend time with.

Who seriously would want to be a hobbit?

Does anyone really want to be Jean-Baptist Grenouille, Dorian Grey, Michael Henchard, Holden Caulfield, Becky Sharp etc ?

Anne Rice put me off Vampires years ago, but Buffy the Vampire Slayer and David Tennant in leathers tempted me back. (I know it is film and TV).

I think for a lot of readers it is about a character they want to spend time with rather than identify with. Especially in my teens and early twenties a sexy character would get me more than anything. Whether that was Mr Rochester, Mr Darcy, Theodore Laurence, Andrew Ryan (Kathy Reichs), or Maguerite Labbe's new creations.

 

[TheDustyZebra]

I'm a bad person to ask, because I was reading adult books by the time I was seven (Jane Eyre was my first) and at thirty-five I unashamedly read junior fiction (Spy Dog being my current favourite).

I know just what you mean! I'm the same way -- although I don't know what Spy Dog is. I'm currently reading Artemis Fowl, and am on #5. I also heartily recommend the two I read in the middle of the Fowl books, "A Whole Nother Story" and "Another Whole Nother Story", by Dr. Cuthbert Soup. I would say all of those are Junior Fiction or YA, depending on who's doing the reading. The library files them as JF.

Anne Rice put me off Vampires years ago, but Buffy the Vampire Slayer and David Tennant in leathers tempted me back.

Err...David Tennant in leathers? Do tell!

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Spy Dog is written by Andrew Cope and is about Lara a dog who is a spy. I laughed and cried through the first book it is wonderful. There is a further series called Spy Pups about her children.

And Fright Night:

 

[TheDustyZebra]

Oh, my. I can't say more than that, as it is a family site, after all.

Oh, my.

I need a new lifesize door poster. I haven't had one since Indiana Jones and Mad Max.

 

[RJM Corbet]

So it's literature for teenagers from 7 to 97 years old?

Ok. I think I've got the idea now.

Thanks

 

[Piousflea]

Isn't this one of those semantic paradoxes like "Define a game" or "Define pornography"?

I suppose the correct answer would be "You know it when you see it."