Direct forms of address & military ranks

[Bowler1]

I use military rank a lot in my current WIP and I need to be sure I'm getting the direct form of address correct.

‘Aye, Corporal, what do you want?’ - In this example, I use a capital C as I'm using the rank as a name. So because corporal is referring to an individual, I used a capital.

'Hello, Captain Jones.' - Both capitals, as I'm refering to an individual.

'I hate all corporals and captains.' - Not referring to any specfic individual, no capitals.

My understanding was that, confusingly, both the below can be correct.
‘Aye, Corporal, what do you want?’
‘Aye, corporal, what do you want?’
Writers' choice.
Anyway I'm getting myself in a muddle, which is not good - help please.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

hmmm, I think this is my fault:

http://www.sffchronicles.co.uk/forum/537091-sir-sir-again.html

one I had a while ago, see if it helps. J.

 

[Bowler1]

Yes, Springs, you got me thinking ok, but if it means I get details correct then no worries, mate.

That link is very similiar to sir/ma'am question I posted a while ago, and lower s/m is what I use. In this case it's the rank when used instead of a name, that question does not seem to have been clearly answered in the link you just provided. So I'm still muddled.

 

[MstrTal]

According to a grammar site:

Rule: Capitalize a title when used as a direct address even when the person is not named.

Also from what I remember of seeing on my Fathers desk when he was the acting Executive Officer on one of the smaller Navy Bases that he was stationed at this seems to hold true.

 

[Hex]

Maybe it's different in the US -- my impression from springs' link was you only capitalised when you used the title before a name.

Corporal Smith -- "Hey, corporal!"

I think you're right with your examples, Bowler, although I probably wouldn't capitalise the first 'corporal' unless it's the guy's name (ie: his parents called him 'Corporal') but like you say, that seems to be the writer's decision, not a Rule Handed Down From On High. Teresa's point that capitalising 'sir' is quite old fashioned is probably the answer here.

These two answers were really helpful: http://www.sffchronicles.co.uk/forum/537091-sir-sir-again.html#post1622705

http://www.sffchronicles.co.uk/forum/537091-sir-sir-again.html#post1622608

 

[Peter Graham]

‘Aye, Corporal, what do you want?’ - In this example, I use a capital C as I'm using the rank as a name. So because corporal is referring to an individual, I used a capital.

Sort of. It's capitalised because Corporal is a formal mode of address which replaces "Mr". All formal modes of address are capitalised. Corporal Jones, Ms Middlemiss, Reverend Green, Lord Grantham, Mr Tickle and so on.

'Hello, Captain Jones.' - Both capitals, as I'm refering to an individual.

Yep, provided that a) he really is a captain or b) it's actually his name (this doesn't mean he had to be christened that way - Jack the Ripper is another example of the same thing).

'I hate all corporals and captains.' - Not referring to any specfic individual, no capitals.

Yep.

My understanding was that, confusingly, both the below can be correct.
‘Aye, Corporal, what do you want?’
‘Aye, corporal, what do you want?’

It's almost certainly the first one. "Corporal" is still being used as a formal mode of address.

If it was shortened to "corp" (see also "sarge"), it would no longer be capitalised. The confusion might arise because you are unclear about whether the word is being used formally or not. A good example is "mister" (used in the sense of "oi, mister, lend us a tanner will you and no mistake"), which is a colloquial form of the formal mode of address - Mister Holmes - but which carries precisely the same spelling as the formal form. In this case, it is the context which tells you if it is being used "properly" or not and this in turn dictates whether or not it is capitalised.

Simples.

Peter

 

[Glen]

All formal modes of address are capitalised... Mr Tickle...

Surely it is impossible to address Mr Tickle formally?

 

[Bowler1]

Bowler1 one falls back into his seat with a great big sigh of relief. I don't have to edit my military ranks, good, because there were 000's in the WIP.

This place is a life saver.
Thank you all very much.

Glen, if Mr Tickle is a mean looking Tom Cat, you call him Mister and you use BIG capitals...

 

[Glen]

if Mr Tickle is a mean looking Tom Cat, you call him Mister and you use BIG capitals...

Surely it is impossible to have a mean-looking Tom Cat called Mr Tickle?

 

[Jo Zebedee]

Bowler1 one falls back into his seat with a great big sigh of relief. I don't have to edit my military ranks, good, because there were 000's in the WIP.

This place is a life saver.
Thank you all very much.

Glen, if Mr Tickle is a mean looking Tom Cat, you call him Mister and you use BIG capitals...

So, let's see, 3 wips, all with a military angle, so say about 300000 words, with assorted captains, corporals, majors, colonels, a couple of sergeants and lieutenants.... a work of moments, surely.

 

[Bowler1]

Sorry, Springs.

 

[prizzley]

It's not just miltary ranks ranks that give me the heebie jeebies. I have a load of mistresses. (Not what you're thinking!) I've settled for "Mistress" when addressed or mistress otherwise. Except on the rare occasion when a name is added. It's based on my own rule that no one other than the mistresses cares which is which, because they are all witches.

 

[nubins]

isn't sarge used like a nickname, I thought nicknames were capitalised, shouldn't sarge be? Like in Aliens.. "Hey Sarge, you'll get lip cancer smoking those!" and "Sarge and Dietrich, they ain't dead..." ?

 

[Grinnel]

isn't sarge used like a nickname, I thought nicknames were capitalised, shouldn't sarge be? Like in Aliens.. "Hey Sarge, you'll get lip cancer smoking those!" and "Sarge and Dietrich, they ain't dead..." ?

If Sarge is used as a specific nickname, as you have above, then it is capitalized as if it were a birth name (like Mac the Knife of Jack the Ripper). If it were simply a generice term "Where is your platoon leader, soldier?" "I think the sarge is in the trench." then no capitalization is required.

Springs, you know you were gonna do a re-write on that anyway . Seriously though, this is where the 'find and replace' tab in your word processor will be a lifesaver. Then all you have to do is go over the work and find all the places where the title is generic and not at the beginning of a sentence and de-capitalize them. Simple!

 

[Bowler1]

"Where is your platoon leader, soldier?" - Capital S I'd say, as soldier is a title and it's direct address, as in, your talking to the soldier.

"I think the sarge is in the trench." - Small s, the sarge could be anyone and your talking about the sarge and not talking to the sarge.

William Strunk jr and EB White - The Elements of Style. I highly recommend it, Grinnel and it won't cost you much. It's really old and out of print, but English is still English, well mostly anyway...