Where do you draw the line for deux ex machina?

[Darth Angelus]

I think most of you will know what a dues ex machina is. It is basically when an unsolvable problem gets suddenly and unexpectedly solved, generally by some entity or story mechanic that has not previously been established.

However, I can see that there could be cases where it may not be clear cut whether the solution has been sufficiently established beforehand. Let me mention an example...

Jesus Christ and vampires.

First of all, to any Christians who might read this, please do not get offended! This is not intended as some sort twisted, blasphemous reference to The Son. I am not a religious person, but it is not like I am the person who brought Christianity into vampire stories to begin with. This is just about what does. This does not prevent me from accepting it as a story element in fiction (if I am to acceot vampires anyway, why should I not?), but I have no plan to truly write this particular story. I feel I need to declare this, because it could be touchy, and I apologize in advance for any offense, which I hope and think will not happen!

Anyway, here goes...

A vampire story takes place during the time of Jesus Christ, before the Crucifixion. A particular vampire comes in touch with Christ, deciding to feed on him. As soon as the vampire sips the first drop of Jesus Christ's blood, however, he is gets a shocked, pained expression on his face, before falling down and turning into dust.

Can a writer make a leap like this? I mean, vampires are hurt by crosses and by holy water. It seems that holiness (as the Christian religion sees it) hurts vampires, bad. But the holiness of the cross comes from Jesus Christ, yes? Even though I can't say that I have studied Christianity deeply, the idea that the blood of Christ may be toxic to vampires is not all that far-fetched, is it? Actually, the idea that a vampire could get hurt just by touching Christ (just like touching a cross), does not seem so far-fetched to me.
Would you buy the storyline that a vampire feeding on Christ would be destroyed, from a fictional perspective, or is it a deus ex machina?

In short, can you make the leap...

Symbols of religion R are harmful to monster type M ->
Characters of religion R are harmful to monster type M ?

Again, this is not meant as blasphemy. It is just an example made to discuss where the line to deus ex machina is drawn.

Thanks!

 

[MstrTal]

An interesting thought. However a counter argument could be that Christs blood could be said to be a source of immense power and therefore even more desirable. There is also the modern concept, in fiction, that Vampires in some way spring from Jesus.

A few examples are:
World of Darkness novels, particularly their VTM, VDA and VTR books. Though in them Vampires spring from Cain and one Vampire in particular was present at the Last Supper were he was gifted a sip of Christs Blood which allowed him to walk under the sun among other new powers.

Faith Hunter: In the Jane Yellowrock series vampires spring from the use of the Golgotha Crosses in their creation. So this is why, in these books, only christian symbols effect them as opposed to other faiths. They are either the result of blood magic and the wood from Christ, the Murderer or the Thieves cross. Also explains why wooden stakes kill them.

There are a few more but it is early and I can not think of them off the top of my head. I guess my point is that unless one were to spell it out that "Holy Blood" was tainted to a vampire and thus lethal and why it may come across as forced (?) or confusing. Depending on how it is written of course.

 

[Darth Angelus]

An interesting thought. However a counter argument could be that Christs blood could be said to be a source of immense power and therefore even more desirable. There is also the modern concept, in fiction, that Vampires in some way spring from Jesus.

Yeah, true, I guess that counter argument could be made. I guess it really depends on the nature of this immense power. Possessing immense power does not necessarily mean vampires could safely harvest it. I guess that in fiction, divine, mysterious or supernatural powers could be put on a light-dark scale. Neutral power would just enhance anyone getting it, but light or dark could have other side effects when used. Dark power would be like the One Ring in LotR or dark side of the Force in Star Wars, twisting the user towards evil. Some holy power could be downright light, however. The question is whether this immense power in Christ's blood would be neutral in its nature, or just light enough that is would do more harm than good to a vampire? It is up to the world-building, I guess.

A few examples are:
World of Darkness novels, particularly their VTM, VDA and VTR books. Though in them Vampires spring from Cain and one Vampire in particular was present at the Last Supper were he was gifted a sip of Christs Blood which allowed him to walk under the sun among other new powers.

Faith Hunter: In the Jane Yellowrock series vampires spring from the use of the Golgotha Crosses in their creation. So this is why, in these books, only christian symbols effect them as opposed to other faiths. They are either the result of blood magic and the wood from Christ, the Murderer or the Thieves cross. Also explains why wooden stakes kill them.

I have to admit I am not familiar with these stories, but I these are specifics to those stories, and not that they are generally established as vampire myths. Still, I think I see your point. It could go either way, so you better establish how it might work in your story.

There are a few more but it is early and I can not think of them off the top of my head. I guess my point is that unless one were to spell it out that "Holy Blood" was tainted to a vampire and thus lethal and why it may come across as forced (?) or confusing. Depending on how it is written of course.

Yeah, perhaps you are right. It is just that sometimes it becomes more powerful when it has not been spelled out beforehand, but it is somehow linked to what has been established. That is, when it is possible to do that, which I am not sure about, in this case.

But personally, I would lean towards Christ's blood being toxic, rather than nourishing, to vampires, but that is just me.

Thanks, anyway!

 

[Warren_Paul]

I can't see how anyone would be offended by this idea, DA, especially when it could make a lot of sense considering the purpose behind Christ's blood.

In the old testament, blood was used as an offering to God for the forgiveness of sins. Jesus died on the cross for the forgiveness of sins, which is why blood sacrifice is no longer needed -- because he took its place for the rest of time. His blood is the main component in Christians' salvation, so for it to have such an effect on vampires makes complete sense -- it is holy. That's why baptism is done in remembrance of his sacrifice, and why the lord's supper is taken in remembrance of his blood.


If the reason makes sense, then I think it doesn't come in as a dues ex machina, as long as there is some foreshadowing. In this case it could simply be mentioning Jesus earlier in the story and makes hints at him being something more than human or that he has the ability to save people.

 

[Darth Angelus]

Thanks for the reply, Warren_Paul!

I can't see how anyone would be offended by this idea, either, but my knowledge of Christianity is limited (I have not even been baptised), so I could not be absolutely positive.
Besides, I have learned to be careful against religious people, because they seem easily offended, to me. Let me just tell you that I once used the word "saviour" on a forum, and some Christian, slightly offended, explained to me that only Christ could be. The fact that this word can mean someone who saves someone (as in, for instance, saving someone's life) in addition to the Christian meaning of bringing salvation to someone (my Oxford English dictionary includes BOTH meanings, so it is not English being my second language here). It was contextually rather obvious that it wasn't the salvation meaning.
I hope experiences like that makes it clear why I walk on my toes. I never know what might offend such people.

But your explanation about the blood of Christ was great. You clearly know significantly more than I do about the story of Christ and its meanings, and hearing you declare that my idea makes complete sense is a relief, because it is another indication that I have not been far off.
My reasoning went something along the lines of the following, I guess:
The cross is holy, as a symbol, in Christianity. Clearly, this symbol is a reference to the crucifixion of Christ. Therefore, the holiness of the cross can be traced back to that, and to Christ, who was crucified there. So, the holiness of the cross would not be independent of Christ. Furthermore, if the cross is holy, then the person who (in a sense) made it holy, its holiness source, would be holy, as well, and probably even more so.

I thought above reasoning fit well into other stories about Christ, such as the virgin birth. There is no doubt whatsoever that the Christian message is that Christ was holy. And yes, along the lines of that, I was fairly convinced that Christ's blood would be as holy as any substance.

No, I didn't think this would be blasphemous. If anything, the story of vampires having come from Christ's blood would be more blasphemous than that his blood would be toxic to these creatures of the night.


The more general point I was trying to make, I guess, would be that it is sometimes hard to decide how much you should spell out in a story beforehand. If you established directly that the blood of Christ would be toxic to vampires, it could come off as stating the obvious to some readers. If you did not, I believe some readers - who are less familiar with the story behind it or the whole genre - might not follow the reasoning and feel it is sudden and unexpected, even when it is not all that much so.

Where should you aim in your story development and explanations prior to a scene like this? I find this somewhat difficult.

 

[Tecdavid]

This example wouldn't really be Deux Ex Machina, Darth Angelus, because it's already an established idea in folklore that things of a holy nature harm vampires. If Christ's blood were to kill one, a reader would immediately make the connection.
Deux Ex Machina is when something utterly unexpected comes along to solve a predicament. Like say, the hero is tied up and about to be killed by the villain. If a character we've never even heard of before comes along and kills the villain and saves the hero, before quickly leaving again, then that would be Deux Ex Machina.

If this savior of a character has been mentioned or seen before (especially if they've been seen to be good at fighting/killing/rescuing people) then their convenient appearance is an example of Chekhov's Gun. This means that the possibility of such a convenient resolution has been established, and so the event seems far more planned or structured, which is generally what you want to aim for.

If you're going to have some character kill vampires with his blood, establish some foreshadowing. Have a wiser vampire fear to be in his presence, or have a knife rust on coming into contact with his blood. Something to establish a plot point before it can become Deux Ex Machina.

Edit: Actually... Chekhov's Gun is a term better suited to things which appear earlier in the story but in a more insignificant manner. Foreshadowing is the term for when things are more obviously alluded to.

 

[Warren_Paul]

The more general point I was trying to make, I guess, would be that it is sometimes hard to decide how much you should spell out in a story beforehand. If you established directly that the blood of Christ would be toxic to vampires, it could come off as stating the obvious to some readers. If you did not, I believe some readers - who are less familiar with the story behind it or the whole genre - might not follow the reasoning and feel it is sudden and unexpected, even when it is not all that much so.

Where should you aim in your story development and explanations prior to a scene like this? I find this somewhat difficult.

Foreshadowing sounds harder than it is. All you need is the vampire to overhear somebody talking about Christ and maybe the miracles He performed, and have them mention the religious nature of Christ. Or you could have the vampire witness a miracle from a distance, or meet Christ and listen in to something He says. It could happen anywhere in the story -- although probably sooner rather than later; leaving it to the last moment will sound like you just threw it in there to explain the solution moments before actually having it happen and will lose credibility -- and most people will think it setting the era for the book, when really it would be a Checkov's Gun.

If this is a story you are writing, then feel free to PM me any questions you have with the Christian aspect of the story and I'll be happy to help and critique to ensure it's plausible.

 

[Darth Angelus]

Tecdavid, agreed. I didn't really believe this particular example to be a true deus ex machina, because those who are not completely oblivious to either the story of Christ or the folklore around vampires would probably connect the dots and see what this was about, like you say. I just wasn't entirely sure about this.
As for the rest of your post, that is good info on Chekov's Gun and forshadowing. Thanks! Gives me stuff to read up on.

Warren_Paul, nah, I am not really writing this, as I said in my initial post. At least not in the near future. It is possible that I will have something sort of similar in my own Fantasy world, but not equivalent, as I don't really have a character serving the role of Christ.
Many thanks for this generous offer, anyway!