33.12: The Crimson Horror

[Lenny]

Something ghastly is afoot in Victorian Yorkshire, as bodies are found with their skin a waxy, glowing red.

 

[HoopyFrood]

This one's hilarious

I love Madame Vastra and Jenny and Strax, silly Strax. Saw the Thomas Thomas joke coming a mile away though (though I thought it was going to be Sat Nav or something similar )

Didn't even mind that he got better so quickly...

ARGH, clingy red thing!

Lol, the wrong hands. She's sassy.

Haha, chair beats screwdriver.

Everyone seems rather flippant about the violence in this episode today! Mothers beaten with sticks and people falling to their deaths and little red things getting pulverised, and barely an eyebrow raised!

Haha, the fainting guy.

They were some very convenient photos

Bit of an odd assortment of things in that episode, but enjoyable.

 

[Lenny]

Can't believe I missed the "Thomas Thomas" joke...

An all-round daft episode, that was done surprisingly well. There was something Pythonesque about the whole thing.

On guest star watch: the wonderful Diana Rigg (with a brilliant accent!).

Talking about accents, it's almost criminal that we didn't get to hear more of the Doctor and Clara's Yorkshire accents.

Favourite joke: Why do we need all the weapons? "Remember, we are going to the North".

---

My only complaint was the very ending, with the two kids and the photos. I get the feeling they are going to really get on my wick next week.

 

[thaddeus6th]

I missed this, and so thought of a game. It's called Doctorn Bingo, where someone who misses an episode has to try and guess certain elements contained within it. I haven't read any posts in this thread to date. Here's my guess list:

Deus ex machina.
The screwdriver being either over-used or used in a completely over the top/strange way.
The Doctor makes a self-absorbed speech, possibly citing/ripping off other famous speeches.
Emotion is used to kill the bad guy in a way that is never close to being properly explained (I suppose this may overlap with deus ex machina but they're not mutually inclusive).
There is at least one enormous plot hole (like the Ice Warrior leaving his armour, which is great dishonour, to escape the chains when his armour could just break them).

How did I do?

 

[HoopyFrood]

No big speech that I can recall.

It was fairly obvious that emotion wasn't going to kill this week's 'big bad'. In fact, mainly guns and heights!

The screwdriver actually got beaten by a chair this week.

And can't think of anything massive, but I'm in the Doctor Who camp who just watches and enjoys rather than try to work things out any more. Though I couldn't quite tell you why the Bad was doing what she was doing (but that may have been lazy viewing on my part).

 

[thaddeus6th]

Guns! Super.

On the other hand, it looks like my guesses were about as accurate as a North Korea news report.

 

[Dave]

It was a lot of fun. I'm not sure that the narrative could be followed by a child, it did jump around a little without a lot of explanation.

Did the parasite originally live upon Reptiles then? Was it intelligent back then too? I'm a bit confused by that.

 

[TheDustyZebra]

I like it! But Hoopy already said everything I might have wanted to say, so I'll wait till I've seen it again and determine if anything else comes up.

 

[Foxbat]

I enjoyed this episode. Dave's comment on Carry On Screaming in the previous thread wasn't far off the mark

 

[PTeppic]

Did the parasite originally live upon Reptiles then? Was it intelligent back then too? I'm a bit confused by that.

I think it was more blood-born. In a single line it was mentioned it had grown huge in the polluted waters of industrial Britain.

But, I agree with everyone else, a great big daft episode. And the sonic was trumped, twice (by the chair and earlier by Jenny).

 

[Perpetual Man]

I really enjoyed the episode and have to agree with everyone else a lot of daft fun that was fully entertaining for the time it was on. I also like and agree with Hoops' philosophy of just watching iut and enjoying it, not trying to work everything out.

My only complaint was the very ending, with the two kids and the photos. I get the feeling they are going to really get on my wick next week.

I'd hope we might be saved that with an episode being written by Neil Gaiman...

 

[TheEndIsNigh]

There are a couple of things...



It really annoys me that the producers seem to lack any 'actual' knowledge of science. I think they owe it to the target audience (toddlers and under seven's etc.) to at least get the things we do know, right. If you think of the impact these programs will have on the younger viewers this episode will give them the impression :-

That being submerged in molten wax will not hurt you. (they could just have easily been sprayed)

That you can survive in a glass bell jar/fridge freezer/sealed container. So climb inside. (they could just as easily have been stored in large warehouse with suitable filters to keep the red out) - But that wouldn't have given the producers a chance to advertise their new line in Victorian mini statues/dolls: no doubt they will available in time for the Christmas rush.

That satellite map technology was invented by the Victorians and that the inventor is still alive today.

That rockets were also a product of the Victorian age (not the far, far grimmer reality)
and all you have to do is hold up your coat to shield you from the horrendous blast furnace that is the back end of a Saturn five rocket.

***

Personally, I think the joke about the Northerner's crossed the line. It's bad enough that that is actually what southern jesses think: especially those that make television programs. But to broadcast it to the rest of the world, I think is unforgivable, unless of course the makers of the program will be sticking to their guns the next time an episode is set say - in Alabama. (Yes that would be outrageous wouldn't it)

I only hope PC Plod is looking into the issue with a view to prosecution.

"Get real," I hear you all say, but why us? Can you think of another Who storyline where Who suddenly changed his persona and started taking the p*ss out of the locals by imitating the local accent. No! In fact, the "magic" of the TARDIS is usually given for the reason the locals (be they Scots Americans, two headed monsters or Splogwander's) can understand Who and his companions. Sticking stereotypical prejudices it into the minds of young viewers in this way is just going to perpetuate the divide.

Next week seems to be introducing something new(ish). However, it looked more like an episode of Grange Hill, rather than an attempt to make SF. Presumably the cut backs at the BBC have forced the producers to 'contract out' the script writers. Which, it has to be said, would explain a lot.

However, this episode only adds to my other theory :-

http://www.sffchronicles.co.uk/forum/540824-33-11-journey-to-the-centre-of-the-2.html#post1715466

 

[Dave]

Next week seems to be introducing something new(ish). However, it looked more like an episode of Grange Hill, rather than an attempt to make SF. Presumably the cut backs at the BBC have forced the producers to 'contract out' the script writers. Which, it has to be said, would explain a lot.

Actually, it looks more like an episode of the Sarah Jane Adventures . You may not have ever caught any of those, but they weren't really awful.

As for bringing in established SF & F writers I'm all for it. It is what made Star Trek so good (that's the original series - To quote Scotty: "NCC one seven O one. No bloody A, B, C, or D") It also was what made Outer Limits and The Twilight Zone. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to work as well here

 

[Lenny]

"Get real," I hear you all say, but why us? Can you think of another Who storyline where Who suddenly changed his persona and started taking the p*ss out of the locals by imitating the local accent. No! In fact, the "magic" of the TARDIS is usually given for the reason the locals (be they Scots Americans, two headed monsters or Splogwander's) can understand Who and his companions. Sticking stereotypical prejudices it into the minds of young viewers in this way is just going to perpetuate the divide.

Did David Tennant not drop into Scottish in the Tooth and Claw episode (before Rose belted out the usual "Och aye me noo" type of Scottish)?

 

[steve12553]

I'm suddenly having a hard time with all the criticisms of the program. Why all the lofty expectations? I started watching the original program in the early eighties when they began importing episodes to the PBS network over here and a very close friend of mine turned me on to it. He said that it was a little odd but it grew on you after a while. The science was weak and the effects were sometimes laughable but the show grew on you. And it was fun. It did not take itself too serious. I've had no higher expectations since. The episodes that I didn't like were the ones where they took themselves too seriously and failed to make an enjoyable program. The Science isn't always going to be right but it at least should be clever. I enjoyed this episode because it was a little over the top and silly. Real Science Fiction has had very little real success on television. Not really much in films. Doctor Who has generally recognized this and been something of it's own entity.

 

[Perpetual Man]

I'm suddenly having a hard time with all the criticisms of the program. Why all the lofty expectations? I started watching the original program in the early eighties when they began importing episodes to the PBS network over here and a very close friend of mine turned me on to it. He said that it was a little odd but it grew on you after a while. The science was weak and the effects were sometimes laughable but the show grew on you. And it was fun. It did not take itself too serious. I've had no higher expectations since. The episodes that I didn't like were the ones where they took themselves too seriously and failed to make an enjoyable program. The Science isn't always going to be right but it at least should be clever. I enjoyed this episode because it was a little over the top and silly. Real Science Fiction has had very little real success on television. Not really much in films. Doctor Who has generally recognized this and been something of it's own entity.

I could not have said it better myself, thanks Steve

 

[Ursa major]

On guest star watch: the wonderful Diana Rigg (with a brilliant accent!).

You missed that Rachel Stirling (who played Rigg's character's daughter) is Diana Rigg's daughter.

I'm not sure that the narrative could be followed by a child, it did jump around a little without a lot of explanation.

I had trouble with the locations, amongst many other things.

For instance, we saw the journalist (I think) who had infiltrated the "factory" entering the area where the dipping took place, but were shown, twice**, that he had seen The Doctor. And yet to get to the doctor's cell required the man to have gone up the spiral staircase (the entrance to which was on the same corridor as the door to the dipping room), go through a locked door, without the aid of a key, and drop dead on seeing a person who was supposedly only there because the blinded daughter had hidden him there. How had he escaped? Were the "factory" workers also blind? At some point before the programme was shot (but only winged), did the plot make any sense at all?



** - Twice, because The Doctor's image was "chemically" captured in the man's eyes, and we were shown a flashback to him seeing the doctor. Or perhaps I'm getting different characters confused. But the man who died had seen the doctor about the time he died (almost by definition) so I think I'm right here. Either way, the programme was confusing, perhaps to cover the plot holes, of which there were many.

 

[PTeppic]

Next week seems to be introducing something new(ish). However, it looked more like an episode of Grange Hill, rather than an attempt to make SF. Presumably the cut backs at the BBC have forced the producers to 'contract out' the script writers. Which, it has to be said, would explain a lot.

I believe it's a complete novice by the name of Neil Gaiman...

 

[tangaloomababe]

Easily the best episode since the return of the doctor after Christmas. It had humour from the support cast, great to see Jenny kick butt. I actually felt sad for the daughter which is about the most I have felt for quite a few episodes. I have actually felt disconnected from the last four episodes so it was nice to care about how it all turned out .

Agree with other that the use of the chair was brilliant.


Looking forward to next week the cybermen are a bit of a favourite of mind.

Steve whilst I agree with what you are saying, My issue is not with the science good or bad, nor with the effects, however you still need to have a good story and be able to change it up so the storyline does not become repetitive. The storyline on the last few episodes has been lacking, particularly the one with the singing. The storyline was thin. However the last two episodes now have seen improvement.

 

[TheEndIsNigh]

Did David Tennant not drop into Scottish in the Tooth and Claw episode (before Rose belted out the usual "Och aye me noo" type of Scottish)?

I don't recall the incident, but Tennant dropping in a Scottish accent isn't quite the same what with him actually being a Scot.

As for Rose belting it out...