Sentences too long? (202 words)

[AnyaKimlin]

I have received a comment that my sentences are too long, specifically in this bit. Could use an extra opinion or two. Except for action or tense scenes my writing does favour longer sentences. Bit of context. Ian is wandering through the park with his two great-grandsons and is in the middle of a dull conversation with his sons' former headmaster.


Ian spent the next few minutes umming and ahhing in what he hoped were the right places, while he let his rusty detective’s eye scan the park for the source of his current unease. Before he picked up the boys, Ian drank one of his son, Pete’s, herbal teas; it eased the flu symptoms but the low level fear continued to grumble away in his stomach. He pushed the pram back and forth, hoping Tyke wouldn’t wake up from his post lunch nap.

“Rosie!” a frantic yell came from behind Ian.

It was quickly followed by a deeper shout, “Goliath.”

Ian sort out the source of the commotion. A grin threatened to invade his politely interested face as a Rottweiler ran past with a Chihuahua yipping at his heels; both were being chased by two unfit men in business suits. The owners panted louder than their pets.

“Rosie, don’t be such an effing wimp!” The man with the heavy chain lead shouted through his huffing and puffing.

"Goliath, good god dog you're gonna get eaten!" From the hands of the second owner dangled a pink diamante lead that matched the collar worn by the Chihuahua.

“… come to dinner on Sunday, Chief Constable will be there…” Bob's words registered as Ian studied a man dressed in black.

The local broadsheet obscured the man's face. Ian dragged himself away from looking for the bogey monster before he found himself invited to a dreary meal. “Very sorry, but no. Wilf and I are going away for the weekend.”

 

[tinkerdan]

Hi AnyaKimlin,

I have no aversion to long sentences. And most assuredly one can create them by stringing several sentences together and inserting the right punctuation and make them work as long as its not some conscious effort to make longer sentences out of two complete sentences. Generally I like to see them paced somewhat with shorter sentences so that my brain doesn't get winded and in this instance I didn't feel winded. But I did have some problems.

In the instance below unless it is absolutely necessary to mention Pete I would try to remove that to remove extra commas.

Before he picked up the boys, Ian drank one of his son, Pete’s, herbal teas;

Before he picked up the boys, Ian drank one of his Son's herbal teas;

As far as the rest goes I have to confess to being baffled somewhat and it might be that this is pulled out of context.

Some of my confusion is that I don't know where the dialogue "Rosie" and "Goliath"
come from except to guess maybe the two owners of dogs and maybe but not sure if Rosie is the rottweiler and Goliath the Chihuahua.

They might complete the setting but they confuse the short piece here because then it is difficult to tell where the next came from and belongs.

“… come to dinner on Sunday, Chief Constable will be there…”

Until I remove everything from "Rosie" to the word puffing. then I think I catch on that Ian might be conversing with Bob who has nothing to do with "Rosie" and Goliath" and the man who is huffing and puffing.

Because this confused me(I'm so easily confused) the long sentences seemed the least of the problems.

I hope you can sort out why I was confused.

 

[Glisterspeck]

Ian spent the next few minutes umming and ahhing in what he hoped were the right places, while he let his rusty detective’s eye scan the park for the source of his current unease.

I like this sentence outside of how "while" is being used. When you use while with a comma like this, it changes the meaning from roughly "at the same time" to "whereas." Drop the comma, and it reads great.

Before he picked up the boys, Ian drank one of his son, Pete’s, herbal teas; it eased the flu symptoms but the low level fear continued to grumble away in his stomach.

I'd recast this in past perfect. "Before he had picked up the boys, Ian had drunk... and I'd break up the sentences. It is, of course, a matter of style, but for me to use a semi or a colon I feel it 1) must be amazingly important that the relationship/contextual connection between the two sentences be understood as I have intended it to be understood and 2) I have no simpler way to reinforce the relationship. It's kind of the same rule for me as using exclamation marks. So, for a reader like myself, if I read a sentence like this, if it doesn't hit that purpose threshold, instead of getting a small delight, I end up wondering why the semi was used. In this case, a full stop is just as strong and doesn't cause any jarring.

I'd also drop the easing of the symptoms into past perfect or put some time context around it like, "before they had reached the park the tea had eased...", though, for me, I think the easing needs to happen AT the park unless the dark hunch in his gut has been following him around and isn't just at the park. Otherwise, the easing of the symptoms wouldn't have left the dark feeling underneath: it'd have been two different instances. Make sense?

He pushed the pram back and forth, hoping Tyke wouldn’t wake up from his post lunch nap.

Length is fine.

A grin threatened to invade Ian’s politely interested face as a Rottweiler ran past with a Chihuahua yipping at his heels; both were being chased by two unfit owners in business suits.

I'd break this up. I'd go cause/reaction instead of reaction/cause, so something like: "A Rottweiler ran past, a Chihuahua yipping at his heels, and a grin threatened to... ...The owners, who chased after, panted louder than their pets." (I'd drop the semi.)

Many of your longer sentences follow the same pattern: Something happens forms one clause at the same time that something else happens in the other clause. You're doing this using "while" and "as" and a couple participial phrases, but it all results in the same pattern. You might do better to break up the pattern a bit than to be too concerned about overall sentence length.

Bob's words registered as Ian studied a man dressed in black.

The local broadsheet obscured the man's face.

Ian dragged himself away from looking for the bogey monster before he found himself invited to a dreary meal.

With these sentences, the length works well for me. I'd change the first to show the change of focus from the dog owner to the man in black. Something like: "Rosie's owner ran in front of a bench where a man in black studied the local broadsheet. The paper, which obscured the man's face, didn't flinch, despite the commotion. Why hadn't the man moved? Ian dragged himself..."

Nowhere near right either, but what I'm trying to do is show some action that caused Ian's spidey sense to kick in with that man, outside of his black clothes.

So anyway, that's more than you asked for. I don't think the length is nearly as much an issue as the pattern of "this happened while this happened."

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Thanks, Tinkerdan, I've made some changes to the intro and the scene - does it help?

I'll keep the Pete for now but may take it out. I find it awkward as well but Ian has five sons, one step-son, several grandsons, one grandaughter and two great-grandsons. I find it easier to mention which one is responsible for what. It's kind of important the reader knows who is making the tea because they later discover it has certain magical properties.

Thanks, Glitterspeck - that's taking more thought. The dark feeling has been following him since the baker's earlier in the day. It has no discernible cause -- yet. This is from earlier in the day.

An unexplained fear dogged Ian Black like Gandalf, his chocolate lab, following a bitch on heat. Standing in the baker’s queue, trying not to discuss Mrs Arbuthnot’s daughter’s hysterectomy, Ian sneezed twice, coughed thrice and shivered as ice-cold crept up his spine. Despite the warm summer day he wrapped himself up in his comfy old cardigan. On the way home Ian checked behind every lamp-post, pillar box and planter for Nessie, The Gruffalo and Smaug. Nothing calmed him, not even the smell of the freshly baked crusty bloomer and two well-filled custard slices in his string shopping bag.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

I have no probs with the sentence length but

!" the man with the dog shouted - ! Is a comma here.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Ahh I wobbled with that one I wrote that after Tinkerdan's comments. That will be corrected. Thanks.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Taking on board the comments and hoping I'm not too tired to be doing this - is this better?:

Ian spent the next few minutes umming and ahhing in what he hoped were the right places while he let his rusty detective’s eye scan the park for the source of his current unease. Before he picked up the boys, Ian had drunk one of his son, Pete’s, herbal teas. The tea had eased the flu-like symptoms but the low level fear continued to grumble away in his stomach. He pushed the pram back and forth. Tyke continued to sleep and showed no sign of waking up.

“Rosie!” a frantic yell came from behind Ian.

It was quickly followed by a deeper shout, “Goliath!”

Ian sought out the source of the commotion. A grin threatened to invade his politely interested face as a Rottweiler ran past with a Chihuahua yipping at his heels; both were being chased by two unfit men in business suits. The owners panted louder than their pets.

“Rosie, don’t be such an effing wimp,” the man with the heavy chain lead shouted through his huffing and puffing.

"Goliath, good god dog you're gonna get eaten!" From the hands of the second owner dangled a pink diamante lead that matched the collar worn by the Chihuahua.

After a brief nod and terse grin at Bob’s diatribe, Ian’s focus shifted to a man dressed in black, sat on the grass and reading the local broadsheet.

“… come to dinner on Sunday, Chief Constable will be there…”

The words disturbed Ian’s contemplation of the man. Ian dragged himself back into world's most boring conversation, smiled a little and shook his head. “Very sorry, but no. Wilf and I are going away for the weekend.” Over on the grass the newspaper reader folded up his paper, revealing a man of the cloth.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

Sorry, Anya, it's still ," the man - shouted is a dialogue tag not an action.

 

[Glisterspeck]

Taking on board the comments and hoping I'm not too tired to be doing this - is this better?:

Ian spent the next few minutes umming and ahhing in what he hoped were the right places while he let his rusty detective’s eye scan the park for the source of his current unease. Before he picked up the boys, Ian had drunk one of his son, Pete’s, herbal teas. The tea had eased the flu-like symptomsComma here to avoid run-onbut the low level fear continued to grumble away in his stomach. He pushed the pram back and forth. Tyke continued to sleep and showed no sign of waking up.

“Rosie!” a frantic yell came from behind Ian.

It was quickly followed by a deeper shout, “Goliath.” I'd go exclamation mark here.

Ian sought out the source of the commotion. A grin threatened to invade his politely interested face as a Rottweiler ran past with a Chihuahua yipping at his heels; both were being chased by two unfit Before, when you used unfit, I thought you meant unfit to be dog owners. This makes it clearer that you mean out of shape men in business suits. The owners panted louder than their pets.

“Rosie, don’t be such an effing wimp,” The man with the heavy chain lead shouted through his huffing and puffing.

"Goliath, good god dog, you're gonna get eaten!" From the hands of the second owner dangled a pink diamante lead that matched the collar worn by the Chihuahua.

After a brief nod and terse grin at Bob’s diatribe, Ian’s focus shifted to a man dressed in black, either "who sat" or "sitting"sat on the grass and if you use "who sat" you can delete this "and" and sub a commareading the local broadsheet.

“… come to dinner on Sunday, Chief Constable will be there…”

The words disturbed Ian’s contemplation of the man. Ian dragged himself back into world's most boring conversation, smiled a little and shook his head. “Very sorry, but no. Wilf and I are going away for the weekend.” Over on the grass the newspaper reader folded up his paper, revealing a man of the cloth.

To my ear, much better! The last paragraph isn't as effortless as the rest, but I came across few bumps on my way there. Noice.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Sorry, Anya, it's still ," the man - shouted is a dialogue tag not an action.

Can I blame the really good rum laden mince pie instead of slapping my head lol? I fixed it.

To my ear, much better! The last paragraph isn't as effortless as the rest, but I came across few bumps on my way there. Noice.

Thanks - one day I will get the hang of sat/sitting, stood/standing. The big struggle is it still sounds wrong when I write it correctly.

I thought a conjunction carried a comma when an independent clause was joined to a dependent one, but not when two independent clauses were joined together by the conjunction?

 

[Glisterspeck]

You have the rule down, just in reverse. ;-)

The simplest way to test is to replace the conjunction and/or comma with a period. If you have two complete sentences on either side, you need the comma and conjunction.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Ahh! I hate commas

 

[tinkerdan]

This is easier to follow.

On a side note: I know of at least one editor who would just as easily turn that dialog tag this way, which might not be what you had in mind.

“Rosie, don’t be such an effing wimp.” The man with the heavy chain lead shouted through his huffing and puffing.

 

[Cosmic Geoff]

The original post scores an average sentence length of 16.4 in Prowritingaid, with three long sentences (30+ words).

The second has an average sentence length of 15.8 and two long sentences.

I tried some of my texts and they get a similar score.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Thanks Geoff and Tinkerdan.

That looks like a useful resource Geoff.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

This is easier to follow.

On a side note: I know of at least one editor who would just as easily turn that dialog tag this way, which might not be what you had in mind.

“Rosie, don’t be such an effing wimp.” The man with the heavy chain lead shouted through his huffing and puffing.

I'd be on the fence on that one - it indicates his shouting through the huffing and puffing is not the line of dialogue shown, which is possible but a little ungainly especially if we don't get told what he shouted, and which, I feel, is misleading when linked to a line of dialogue. The difficulty is that shouted is a dialogue tag; as such, if Anya means he shouts the dialogue, it needs to be a comma or ! With a ," the man shouted. Sorry, I'll step into the pedant corner and stand beside Chrispy.

 

[ctg]

Ian spent the next few minutes umming and ahhing in what he hoped were the right places, while he let his rusty detective’s eye scan the park for the source of his current unease. The fear was still there; even after one of those herbal drinks he'd got from Pete's. It'd almost worked. The tea had eased the flu-like symptoms but done nothing to the grumbling in his stomach.

If only... He pushed the pram back and forth. Tyke continued to sleep and showed no sign of waking up.

“Rosie!” a frantic yell came from behind Ian.

It was quickly followed by a deeper voice, “Goliath!”

Ian turned his head and saw a Rottweiler galloping past him the best speed it could get out from her hind legs and he grinned. It was one of those moments when you realised everything wasn't as you thought, when he spotted the Chihuahua yipping at his heels and then saw the owners.
They were class of their own. Both wearing a business suit that were stretching at the breaking point over their stomachs.

"Rosie," a man with the heavy chain lead shouted. “Don’t be such an effing wimp!”

"Goliath! Good god! Stop that! You're gonna get eaten!" From the hands of the second owner dangled a pink diamante lead that matched the collar worn by the Chihuahua.

After a brief nod and terse grin at Bob’s diatribe, Ian’s focus shifted to a man dressed in black, sat on the grass and reading the local broadsheet.

“… come to dinner on Sunday, Chief Constable will be there…”

The words disturbed Ian’s contemplation of the man. Ian dragged himself back into world's most boring conversation, smiled a little and shook his head. “Very sorry, but no. Wilf and I are going away for the weekend.”

Over on the grass the newspaper reader folded up his paper, revealing a man of the cloth.
​

Blue = My edits and rewrites
Red = Consider removing.