Info-Dumping 'Lecture' Scene [801 words]

[MatterSack]

NOTE: This is a kind of 'prototype' scene, one that involves deliberate (and fairly blatant) info-dumping disguised as a lecture.

I posted this up as requested by another forum-member. It wasn't finished to start with, and I've since revamped the entire scene from a futuristic setting to a quasi-contemporary one before posting (which involved lots of renaming, cutting, tweaking, etc). This is not the final scene; it's really just basic proof-of-concept, and the purpose of this post is merely to figure out whether this form of exposition is viable.



The few things I'm currently seeking feedback on:

• General phrasing, grammar, punctuation and flow.
  
  
• Engagement-factor. Do the initial paragraphs instantly bore the **** out of you?
  
  
• Comprehension. Did you actually understand (or care about) what the Lieutenant was saying?

--Lieutenant Wyatt pointed at the diagram onscreen.

--“The overall BAF command structure is as such: the three corps, Army, Navy and Air Force, with each corps possessing a Reserve and Active branch. Within the Army you have the rule of 'threes and A-B-Cs'. Each regiment consists of three battalions, in which there are three companies, then three platoons, three sections of twelve men, and finally, three teams per section. From battalion to section level you also have a HQ element present. We'll be starting with the infantry section as a whole."

--He waved his hand to usher in the next slide: an overly-detailed schematic of a section and its individual members.

--"An infantry section is the Army's fundamental fighting force. Twelve men, led by a section commander and divided into three separate teams that all operate towards the same goal using cohesive fire and movement. The section commander heads one team, as do the section second-in-command and third-in-command respectively. Three teams working in tandem enable a single section to cover a considerable area, and allow for advanced manoeuvres like double envelopments. You'll learn more about all that later."

--The next slide was more interesting; video of an infantry section in combat. Wyatt chuckled as the recruits straightened up.

--"Now a bit of history. Live footage from the War, recorded during the initial invasion."

--They simply sat there, rapt, scrutinising the soldiers onscreen, taking in every detail. They'd all seen footage of the war before of course. Played games set during the conflict. Watched whatever censored videos had been entrusted to civilian news agencies. But nothing like this.

--Real combat.

--The camera was circling far above the battlefield, enabling them to witness the entire situation as it unfolded on the ground below. A section of British infantrymen in speckled green and tan uniforms, fighting their way down a city street alongside a squad of U.S. soldiers. Both were converging on a squat, grey structure two hundred metres ahead.

--Several disfigured corpses lay strewn upon the asphalt underfoot, more than one in a pool of blood. Some were no longer fully intact.

--Afghan militants.

--"You can see the different fire-teams moving separately. In two thousand and seven when this footage was taken, sections were nine men divided into two fire-teams. You can see them leapfrogging here."

--He zoomed in on the British to clarify. One half of the section would stop to fire and the other would simultaneously begin sprinting further up their side of the street.

--"This is an example of fire and movement. One team sets up a 'base of fire' — seen back here — and suppresses the enemy up ahead." He pointed at the garrisoned structure down the street. Occasional muzzle flashes were visible at the windows.

--"That fire-team covers the other as they move. Each fire-team has a light machine gunner for this exact purpose, to keep the enemy subdued and unable to mount a proper response. The more bullets downrange, the better; a primitive concept, but it works."

--He pointed at the second four-man team as they reached an intersection. "Watch as the other team 'advances'. Now that they've done so, they'll set up their own base of fire in the forward position." The soldiers onscreen dived into cover behind a sandbag wall and crawled forwards until they could brace their weapons upon it. "And there it is; an established base of fire. Now the first fire-team will advance past them, and so on."

--The Lieutenant remained silent for the next few minutes, simply allowing the situation onscreen to resolve itself without interruption. He cut to the helmet camera of a British soldier behind the sandbags, to give the recruits a clearer view of the building ahead from a perspective on the ground.

--It was raw, visceral, untainted by the glamourisation of commercial media. Through a panoramic lens they saw the soldier scoping out the target structure, loosing aimed shots at the windows, shouting to those around him. The machine gunner to his left was contributing his own thunderous barrage of automatic fire, punching small holes in the concrete walls and generating puffs of grey dust wherever his rounds impacted.

--At such a distance the enemy militiamen were only fleetingly visible. Momentary flickers. Any recruits anticipating further death or gore were left disappointed.

--Eventually a second squad of US soldiers was seen flanking the building and storming inside, covered all the while by their brethren and the British on the street.

--The Lieutenant ended the footage. A collective sigh arose from the seated recruits.

--"Alright, calm down." He frowned at them. "Shut up, pay attention, don't be so bloody insubordinate and it might be you in the vids one day."

--The next slide was labelled 'Non-Commissioned Rank Hierarchy'.

--Another sigh.​

 

[SciFrac]

MatterSack, regarding your questions:

1) Your grammar, vocabulary, etc work well. The scene sounded pretty close to something in real life. That's the problem.

2) Yes, and that problem stems from question 1. There's no tension here. It's only confusing because you're trying to describe a physical image by telling us about it. We'd rather know how the POV character feels. (Btw, who was that again?)

3) No. See question 2.

Sorry, this doesn't engage me. This is the kind of thing you need to know as the author, but need to describe through the voice of a character, and much faster. Ask yourself, what is the problem for your character in this scene? What's their objective? As a reader, I have no clue.

Personally, I'd prefer something like this:

"The lieutenant dragged them through a firestorm of slides and videos of the latest ambush. Soldiers onscreen ripped through town in teams of three, leapfrogging each other, straight into the gates of Hell. And they won. The room couldn't take notes fast enough. They learned more in those ten minutes than their entire three months of basic, combined. Days like this felt damn good."

(Longer, of course, but you get the idea.)

 

[Jo Zebedee]

Good on you for putting it up. On the worry note of someone taking your ideas - it's highly unlikely. Most of us are too busy with our own ideas.

Okay, here goes. I'm a picky one.

--Lieutenant Wyatt pointed at the diagram onscreen.

--“The overall BAF command structure is as such: the three corps, Army, Navy and Air Force, with each corps possessing a Reserve and Active branch. Within the Army you have the rule of 'threes and A-B-Cs'. Each regiment consists of three battalions, in which there are three companies, then three platoons, three sections of twelve men, and finally, three teams per section. From battalion to section level you also have a HQ element present. We'll be starting with the infantry section as a whole."

For me - and I don't mind the odd bit of military in my sci fi - my eyes glazed over. Firstly - most armies have an army, naval and air force, so you're not telling me anything which increases my understanding of what an army is, so I immediately suspect I'm going to be given info for infos sake.


[

COLOR="LemonChiffon"]--[/COLOR]"An infantry section is the Army's fundamental fighting force. Twelve men, led by a section commander and divided into three separate teams that all operate towards the same goal using cohesive fire and movement. The section commander heads one team, as do the section second-in-command and third-in-command respectively. Three teams working in tandem enable a single section to cover a considerable area, and allow for advanced manoeuvres like double envelopments. You'll learn more about all that later."

Again, I know the importance of infantry. I know the concept that working teams in tandem gives more coverage. I'm totally feeling lectured to at this point.

--

The next slide was more interesting; video of an infantry section in combat. Wyatt chuckled as the recruits straightened up.

Goody, I think. I'm also desperate to know something - anything - about yout pov character's thoughts and feelings. So far, he's like a robot doing actions with no viewpoint.

--They simply sat there, rapt, scrutinising the soldiers onscreen, taking in every detail. They'd all seen footage of the war before of course. Played games set during the conflict. Watched whatever censored videos had been entrusted to civilian news agencies. But nothing like this.

Aw! But you're not showing me any of the action. You're telling me what the soldiers watching are doing but none of the action that might be an interesting show.

At this point, if not before, the book would be on the shelf. Sorry.

[

--"You can see the different fire-teams moving separately. In two thousand and seven when this footage was taken, sections were nine men divided into two fire-teams. You can see them leapfrogging here."

No, I can see you telling me about them leapfrogging here. Where's the noise? The action? The swearing troopers? The one green and sick?

I read to the end, and my feelings remained the same, that the scene was mostly telling (and there could have been some lovely show) and lacked anything to draw me in. So no, I wasn't engaged, and I learned next to nothing about your pov character or the situation or the conflict.

Just a suggestion - maybe search for Reiver33's old crits. He writes fantastic military sci fi and see how he approaches this sort of thing in Cairo Station.​

 

[Brian G Turner]

IMO you're going to need to have a focus on a character and their reactions and struggles through such lectures to make them engaging.

It didn't even feel like world-building, as much as being told how squads work in a game of Call of Duty.

If you look at stories such as Ender's Game or the Harry Potter series, scenes with lessons in are always very character-focused. We learn only what is important to the plot, and we learn the character reactions in context with their existing struggles.

IMO this is the route you would need to take.

I could be wrong - it might work in context with your writing. However, be aware that if you start looking for editors/agents, they will be looking for the story to capture their interest, and maintain it. Or else push the MS back.

Have you read much Robert Heinlein? That might be another author worth looking at, especially stories such as Starship Troopers.

 

[alchemist]

Yes, I'm afraid the first paragraphs do bore the **** out of me. I could handle a mission briefing -- it's germane to the plot; you get to learn the stakes etc -- but a lecture on structure is likely to make me give up. In fact, I have given up on a couple of modern military thrillers because of the amount of early info-dumping, such as a couple of pages on the history of a fighter jet when I should be seeing the jet in action.

I don't see anything there you can't easily drop in when the story gets going. The tactics can be described when the recruits have their first battle, or even in training if you want it in sooner. Then we get their experience, and we'll actually care what happens to them.

Ditto for the military structure. As springs says, some of it is unnecessary. The rest, you could do as the soldiers are shipping out. I presume we'll know the other three members of the MC's team well, the two other teams will have codenames and will interact with the MC's team, we'll see the section leader who will be named etc. The quality of the writing's fine; it just needs to come alive.

 

[MatterSack]

Thanks for all the replies! I'll definitely be reworking (i.e., removing) most of it as per your advice. One possibility I'll look into is including an appendix instead.

After I've made some changes I'll post up the reworked version.


I will say two things though:

1. I think I shot myself in the foot before posting; I removed every character except Wyatt, as their names are placeholders and I thought they'd clutter the scene.
   
   
2. This scene was really underdeveloped to begin with, and within the context of the story was actually supposed to be an ordeal for the recruits (prior to this scene, they'd been awoken at 3am and subjected to relentless PE).

 

[Toby Frost]

Firstly, I think your writing is really good. The scene flows well and the description is clear while brief enough to give a sense of movement. The words are fine. (You also deserve considerable credit for writing military SF without mentioning Spartans or Nazis, with which the sub-genre seems to be somewhat fixated).

But I don’t see the point of this scene. I’m no expert on military matters, but it seems to boil down to “Squad A pins the enemy down, Squad B moves up and attacks”, which feels like a pretty basic tactic, to be honest. If you were discussing tactics to deal with some weird new threat – teleporters, psychic attack, burrowing torpedoes or whatever – then it would seem justified. Right now “Cover us, lads!” would seem to suffice.

There are no characters in the fighting – or in the passage beyond Wyatt, who in this scene is just an expository device – so there’s not really any hook for the reader to be involved in the scene. At the moment, it’s just some guys and some other guys. I don’t have anything invested in them. If I actually knew the soldiers, and was worried that characters I liked were actually afraid and might be about to die, it would be much more effective.

I hope this doesn’t sound too negative, since the writing is there – it’s just what to write about and how to present it that’s the problem.

(EDIT - we cross-posted. I think I'm covering a lot of ground discussed by other people already, so sorry if I'm just re-hashing what's already been said.)

 

[MatterSack]

Here's a reworked version; the exposition has been cut down, the recruit characters have been reinserted, the conflict redeveloped, etc. Generally just more characterisation. It's still a little cut-down, and because I rewrote it just then it won't be very polished. But I'd still appreciate some more useful feedback.

PS: Like I said before the character names (aside from 'Helena') are basically placeholders. I realise just how Anglo-centric they currently sound.

EDIT: If someone could move this to the opening post, that'd be great.

--Helena shifted gingerly within her chair, to the unanimous protest of what seemed like every muscle fascicle within her body.

--It was all she could do to stifle a wince.

--Easing into a less uncomfortable position, she watched Neil yawn beside her and spatter the desk in front of him with saliva. Matt sat slumped over to her left, sketching something irrelevant within his notepad, and further along was Jeremiah... who through some miraculous triumph of willpower was still sitting up attentively.

--“Before we cover overall organisation any further, we'll start off with the basic infantry section." Lieutenant Wyatt waved his hand to usher in the next slide: an overly-detailed schematic of a section and its individual members.

--She closed her eyes.

--Just for a second Helena.

--"An infantry section is the Army's fundamental fighting force. Ten men, divided into three separate teams that all operate towards the same goal using cohesive fire and movement. Three teams working in tandem enable a single section to cover a considerable area, and allow for advanced manoeuvres like double envelopments."

--Helena's head drooped, and once again she awoke with a jolt to find herself still within the lecture hall, still enduring the Lieutenant's monotonous voice, still wishing she was dead.

--F*ck you Burke. F*ck you Wyatt. F*ck everyone who's ever lived.

--Perhaps the Lieutenant was feeling merciful given the intensity of the day's training; the next slide was far more interesting. Interactive video of an infantry section in combat. Wyatt chuckled as his students straightened up.

--"Now a bit of history. Live footage from the Korean Reunification War, recorded in P’yŏngyang during the initial invasion."

--Exhaustion postponed, the recruits simply sat there, rapt, scrutinising the soldiers onscreen and taking in every detail. They'd all seen 'family-friendly' footage of the war before of course. Played titles set during the conflict. Explored it through countless virtual simulations and via whatever censored videos had been entrusted to civilian news agencies. But nothing like this.

--Real combat.

--The camera — evidently belonging to a drone of some kind — was circling far above the battlefield, enabling them to witness the entire situation as it unfolded below. A section of Australian infantrymen in speckled green and tan fatigues, fighting their way down a city street alongside a squad of South Korean soldiers. Both were converging on a squat, grey structure a hundred metres ahead.

--Several disfigured corpses lay strewn upon the asphalt underfoot, more than one in a pool of blood. Some were no longer fully intact.

--North Korean militia.

--"You can see the different fire-teams moving separately. Note that in two thousand and thirty-two when this footage was taken, sections were divided into two fire-teams, not three as they are now."

--He zoomed in on the Australians to clarify. One half of the section would stop to fire, and as they did so the other would simultaneously begin moving further up the street.

--"This is an example of 'fire and movement'. One team sets up a 'base of fire' and covers the other team as they advance. At the time, each fire-team had a light machine gunner for this exact purpose; to keep the enemy subdued and unable to mount a proper response. The more bullets downrange, the better. A primitive, inefficient concept, but it worked. Of course now we have concussive rounds."

--The Lieutenant remained silent for the next few minutes, simply allowing the situation onscreen to resolve itself without interruption. After some time he cut to the helmet camera of an Australian soldier on the ground. Helena searched the soldier's superimposed display for a name and found it in the top right corner: 'CPL. Wilkins'.

--They watched on as Wilkins and his team leapfrogged down the street, approached the intersection ahead at a full sprint, dived into cover behind a sandbag wall and then crawled forwards until they could brace their archaic weapons upon it.

--The footage was raw, visceral, untainted by the glamourisation of commercial media titles. Staccato voices drowned out by gunfire. Dust and smoke everywhere. Through Wilkins' panoramic lens they saw him scoping out the target structure, loosing aimed shots at the windows, shouting out frantically to those around him and relaying targets to the marksman beside him. The machine gunner to Wilkins' left contributed his own thunderous barrage of automatic fire, eliciting puffs of grey from the building's concrete exterior with every round that impacted.

--Despite the gigapixel resolution, at such a distance the enemy combatants were only fleetingly visible. Momentary silhouettes. Any onlooking recruits anticipating further death or gore were left disappointed.

--Eventually a second squad of South Koreans was seen flanking the building and storming inside, covered all the while by their brethren and the Australians on the street.

--The Lieutenant closed his fist and ended the footage. A collective sigh arose from around the hall.

--"Alright, calm down." He frowned at them. "Shut up, pay attention, don't be so bloody insubordinate and it might be you in the vids one day."

--The next slide was labelled 'Non-Commissioned Rank Hierarchy'.

--"Oh for f*ck's sake," groaned Neil.

--Helena felt inclined to agree, but simply couldn't muster the effort to verbalise her thoughts. She laid low in her chair and closed her eyes one more time.

--Just for a second.​

 

[Brian G Turner]

Something I always warn people about is to be wary of showing their characters being bored - because this can easily encourage the reader to feel the same.

After all, if the characters cannot be bothered with this section, why should the reader?

Even if this was a film, the soldiers would be misbehaving - some other important matter would be whispered between them. The lecture itself would fade into the background.

I'm sorry to bring Harry Potter up again, but JK Rowling does a really good job of keeping a character focus in Hogswart lessons: conflict between Harry and Draco Malfoy; conflict between Harry, Ron, and Hermine; tension about how to resolve a particular mystery.

The reader never learns much about wizarding - lessons are always filtered through the character perceptions. It's an approach that is proven to work.

You don't have to take it, but it would help with accessibility to give the read a reason to care about this scene. And that's where a character POV can really work.

As above, you are good with words, but you need to focus more on structure to make this stronger.

Also, if there is fighting in this story, surely you can drop mention of their tactics into this, while they are trying to follow them?

 

[Jo Zebedee]

I think it's lots better but I'm still switching off (but I don't have military sci fi as my genre of choice). The english is tidy, but there's little to engage me. Nothing is happening other than the lieutenant droning on, some bloke being disgusting with his spit. I can't, really, see what the scene is achieving for you?

 

[SciFrac]

Much much better! There's voice. But I also agree with Springs, still not accomplishing much other than a boring lecture. Are we expected to remember how the drama plays out on screen? Because I won't, it's still too long, but I do enjoy the humor. I'd say nail down three main ideas you need the audience to take from this info and highlight them through character experience. Cut more, maybe half, for my tastes.

Descriptions of bullets flying doesn't spark much interest. It exists, but we already know that about war. Maybe the lieutenant should remind them their lives could be saved by paying attention. Maybe the trainees are whispering rumors of tomorrow night's keg party. You're making great progress. Keep going.

 

[Fishbowl Helmet]

That's mildly better with the perspective character, but you make a subtle mistake. You have that character pass out. You're planting the idea that this is boring in the reader's head. But yeah, still dull.

If you think you *have* to impart this information (which you don't), at least put it in a proper scene. Like the first time this recruit goes in a real fight and remembers snippets of the lecture (a line or two per few paragraphs or pages).

There's also something I think you're overlooking here: audience. The readers who typically go for military SF are already going to know the basics of squad structure, tactics, military history, on and on. It would be like writing a mystery novel and explaining what a detective is. The reader already knows.

 

[MatterSack]

I'll dismantle this scene then and reintegrate the important parts into others. Thanks for all the advice.

PS: They weren't supposed to be bored, but exhausted after a 3am wake-up and hours of PE.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

Actually, from FB's comment - why do you think you need to explain so much to your reader? Would you need this sort of thing explained to you if you were reading a military sci fi book, or would you be happy you could follow a scene without being told it in advance? Just wondering.

 

[MatterSack]

When I first developed an interest in military SF (during my early teens) I had no idea about any of this (and never learned it from MSF books). I assumed potential readers might be the same.

 

[TheDustyZebra]

When I first developed an interest in military SF (during my early teens) I had no idea about any of this (and never learned it from MSF books). I assumed potential readers might be the same.

But, err...you figured it out, just the same.

My concern with including all of the "army is divided into battalions, divided into companies, etc." bits is not that the reader already knows this (though they generally have an idea, or will figure it out), but that the troops really ought to know this already. I remember it from day one (or maybe two or three) of basic training, and by the time they've been exhausted in the field and are learning about tactical maneuvers, the division of labor is well-in-brain.


Aside from that, do you read David Weber's Honor Harrington books? The beginning scene in the prologue of Field of Dishonor might be something of what you're looking for. You can actually see it in the "look inside" on Amazon.

 

[MatterSack]

Funny you should say that Zebra; it was actually supposed to be their second day lecture. I guess it was the tactical maneuvers part I mistimed.

I removed the hierarchy stuff from the rewrite in post #8 anyway due to the way it bogged down the scene intro.

PS: I'm absolutely fine with avoiding this form of exposition entirely if people think it's overbearing (which they do, and was something I was half-expecting as I posted it). My main purposes for writing it were to provide some insight into what the recruits were enduring, and to explain some fundamentals in a diegetic way. But if it isn't working, it isn't working, and there's no point keeping it.

 

[Jo Zebedee]

I think it's very hard. I ended up with a military commander as one of my mcs which was challenging because I know nothing about military manouvures. Tywin kindly helped me out (and he knows lots about the military) and I found a half-way house between telling nothing and having a modicum of military planning included. But, really, all you need is enough in there to convince people the scene is doing what you plan it to, and they'll go along with the rest. I genuinely believe most military sci fi readers need very little of the basics but will thoroughly love any of the cool new tech etc you come up with.

 

[TheDustyZebra]

Yes, and while I send you off to look at David Weber, keep in mind that there are a LOT of people (of whom I am one) who skip a great deal of his more overbearing info-dumps. When he starts telling me all about how they built the ship and how every button works, my eyes glaze over.

But the scene I mentioned was not one of those.

 

[JoanDrake]

I liked it, a lot. It's not often you get an actual exposition which tells you in detail what is going on. I found the insight into basic infantry tactics fascinating.

Now if you had just had the protagonist actually doing what you're describing, with maybe flashbacks of the classroom over his feelings, it would have been a near to perfect action scene.