Dash use

[Juliana]

Am I using the dash correctly here? Have put the entire paragraph in for clarity, but just worried about the dash part.

Adeline frowned in concentration as she worked her blunt dinner knife through the slats of the old, wooden table. Inch by inch the knife pushed through, trickling sawdust on Adeline’s bare foot, until finally – triumph! – it slid clear to the hilt and stuck there, vibrating slightly and warm to the grip.

(It's the opening paragraph to current WIP so trying to get it perfect.)

 

[HareBrain]

The usage looks fine to me, but they're hyphens rather than em-dashes or whatever the term is.

 

[Juliana]

You're right, of coursr. But I always get all the names mixed up!

So it looks fine to you. Good. That's what I wanted to know.

 

[Mouse]

I've used them like that meself.

 

[The Judge]

I can never remember the difference between em and en dashes, so someone more knowledgeable will be needed, but a hyphen is a small one thus - used to link two words ie shop-soiled. I can't get proper dashes to work here unless I copy and paste from my own stuff, so I've copied Teresa and use a double hyphen ie -- here to signal a dash to put a clause into parenthesis as you've done. Which is completely irrelevant but my fingers were typing and kind of ran away with themselves.

Anyhow, the construction you've done is fine, with separating the "triumph!" in that way, but you do have to use a proper dash (em or en, I haven't the foggiest idea) not a hyphen. But from peering at the length of your – compared to the hyphen here - I think you have, so that's fine, too!

 

[HareBrain]

But from peering at the length of your – compared to the hyphen here - I think you have, so that's fine, too!

Oh yes, you're right. Sorry.

More info here. Turns out both em- and en-dashes are fine in that context. And you get to learn where their names come from!

 

[Abernovo]

On Chrons, I get a little lackadaisical with correct dash use but, when writing, I follow the Shunn format, which is still an industry standard.
So, word--word for an em-dash, and word -- word for an en-dash. I don't think I ever use an en-dash!

But, I think people (agents, editors, publishers, and readers) are more concerned about you using the dash correctly as a tool than it being exactly 3.14mm (or whatever) long.

Above all else, keep things consistent. The typographical details can be edited in the final product, in consultation with agents and publishers, and the like.

 

[Ursa major]

In most fonts, em-dashes are longer than en-dashes. The way they're used is one way to distinguish them:

• em dashes are used without a space between them and the previous word and (if it's present) the following word;
• en-dashes always have a space between them and the previous word and (if it's present) the following word.

So in a sentence like this—one that I've just made up for the occasion—the em-dashes are inserted as shown here. And in a sentence like this – also made up for the occasion – they're used as shown in this sentence.

 

[The Judge]

Ah, the knowledgeable people have arrived!

Personally I hate the look of the em-dashes and the way they join the words. I prefer the breathing space the en-dashes give. (And I've just realised how I can recall which is which! An "m" is longer than an "n" so is the longer dash.)

 

[Ray McCarthy]

I've only seen two kinds of dashes (not hyphens) used regularly and tend to be in older books (pre 1950s)
The one as alternate to commas that are alternates also to parenthesis.
The one where speech / dialog is cut off. (10 tonne block falls on speaker, or is surprised and stops talking) "What are you doing with my network cab—"

 

[HareBrain]

em dashes are used without a space between them and the previous word and (if it's present) the following word;

Some style guides do include spaces for em-dashes.

 

[Ursa major]

I'm not sure whether I like that.

However, if the style guide is for a publication to which one is submitting, one should always follow what it says.

 

[Juliana]

Oh dear, mind blown. Poor brain!

But thanks everyone, this is great as I've never really figured out the dash thing before. Now I've actually gone and looked up what all the en/em-dashes are in Portuguese, too, so slightly less confused. (I have big gaps in my knowledge of English grammar from moving over to Portuguese-language schooling when I was 10. The basic stuff is fine; I've picked that up from extensive reading. But the gritty details like dashes got left out.)

 

[Mouse]

Juliana, it doesn't matter. Your editor will change it to whatever is right. Mine did! As long as you're consistent, then nobody's going to throw your MS in the bin just because you've used an en-dash instead of an em-dash.

 

[J Riff]

Right. But they can be very effective, and you've used it well there. For perfect tho, p'raps say "a" blunt knife, and maybe use 'her' instead of her name a second time.

 

[Juliana]

Oh, good point about the second use of name, J Riff. Will fix that. Will also try with 'a' instead of 'her' for knife. Thanks.

 

[Sedgwick]

Hi Juliana,

I like that passage - quite visual in my opinion. Here's a few suggestions. Just my humble opinions to help you:

• Do you really mean inch-by-inch? On your average dinner knife there are only three or so inches to work with. It's just that it's slightly incongruous with the 'trickling of sawdust'. Would 'slowly but surely' or something similar be better?
• You don't need to use Adeline's name in the second sentence as she was the last subject mentioned in the previous one and the only character in this scene: 'on her bare foot' would do.
• Personally, I'd used the exclamation mark to end the sentence and start a new one with, 'It slid...' As you probably know, an exclamation mark can function as either a fullstop / period or comma.
• I don't understand why the knife would be vibrating if someone was holding onto it having just pushed it through the slat. It would only vibrate if the force were lateral to the handle rather than axial. Reinforcing my view is that it is 'warm to the touch,' implying she is still holding it.

All the best,
Sedge

Adeline frowned in concentration as she worked her blunt dinner knife through the slats of the old, wooden table. Inch by inch the knife pushed through, trickling sawdust on Adeline’s bare foot, until finally – triumph! – it slid clear to the hilt and stuck there, vibrating slightly and warm to the grip.

 

[Juliana]

Nice points, Sedgwick, thanks!