History's Greatest Phonies

[BAYLOR]

Historical figures that were lionized in their time for great deeds and and achievements. But upon reflecting and revisionism didn't and really didn't deserve the accolades given to them or didn't do the things credited to them. The Charlatans and frauds of history.

 

[Droflet]

Hmm, Winston Churchill, John Kennedy, any number of religious zealots?

 

[BAYLOR]

Winston Churchill was a for real , he had quite a an interesting and adventurous life. His 5 years as prime minter 1940 to 45 helped save the world from Hitler and the Axis powers. I have no illusion about his flaws and he made some errors of judgement Gallopoli comes to mind. i can't help but like Winston Churchill. He was for real and a great man.

 

[AnyaKimlin]

Most of those history records as great were great at what they are recorded at being great at they just sucked at other things.

Marie Stopes and Emmeline Pankhurst are classic examples. They were needed and I benefit greatly from them but as human beings they were at best unpleasant with some awful ideas.

Millicent Fawcett on the other hand is a lady who does not get anywhere near the amount of credit she should.

 

[althea]

Even heroes and heroines of history had human failings (don't we all),but that doesn't nullify their achievements.
I think Mother Theresa was a great person.To keep on, day after day, struggling in a hopeless situation -that is greatness to me.

 

[Gramm838]

All religions.

 

[JunkMonkey]

Historical figures that were lionized in their time for great deeds and and achievements. But upon reflecting and revisionism didn't and really didn't deserve the accolades given to them or didn't do the things credited to them. The Charlatans and frauds of history.

Thomas Alva Edison - who did a great job of syphoning off other people's work into his own self-aggrandisement.

 

[BAYLOR]

Thomas Alva Edison - who did a great job of syphoning off other people's work into his own self-aggrandisement.

Edison was a master at self promotion

He didn't really invent the elect light .

 

[JunkMonkey]

or the movie camera

 

[althea]

Alexander Graham Bell didn't really invent the telephone,but he was the first to patent it.

 

[BAYLOR]

Alexander Graham Bell didn't really invent the telephone,but he was the first to patent it.

If only Elisha Gray he'd gotten to the patent office a few hours earlier.

 

[JunkMonkey]

Oh Bum! I now have OMD going round in my head - why should I suffer alone!

Elisha Gay, you should have stayed at home yesterday
Aha words can't describe the feeling and the way you lied
These games you play, they're gonna end it more than tears someday
Aha Elisha Gay, it shouldn't ever have to end this way
It's 8:15, and that's the time that it's always been
We got your message on the radio, conditions normal and you're coming home
Elisha Gay, is mother proud of little boy today
Aha this kiss you give, it's never ever gonna fade away....

 

[juelz4sure]

Christopher Columbus, how do you discover someplace where people already lived? That's like walking into my neighbor's apartment and claiming it the new world and taking ownership. Not to mention all of the historical evidence that shows other far more ancient civilizations had also come to this continent.

 

[JunkMonkey]

Oh come on. Columbus wasn't a fraud. He (and his crews) really did sail across the Atlantic and create what he thought was a shorter (less dangerous) route to the spice islands of the Far East. He didn't claim to have found anything that wasn't there before just an easier way to get to it.

He was wrong not a fraud - though he did lie to his crew a lot about their progress.

 

[Brian G Turner]

Elisha Gay

Enola Gay!

 

[JunkMonkey]

Enola Gay!

I know. I was making a joke.

 

[Brian G Turner]

I know. I was making a joke.

I couldn't tell - I was an Ultravox fan.

 

[Khuratokh]

Oh come on. Columbus wasn't a fraud. He (and his crews) really did sail across the Atlantic and create what he thought was a shorter (less dangerous) route to the spice islands of the Far East. He didn't claim to have found anything that wasn't there before just an easier way to get to it.

He was wrong not a fraud - though he did lie to his crew a lot about their progress.

While not a fraud he does tend to get lauded too much for his accomplishments. The more you learn about him the more you despise the man. Yet the USA dedicated a holiday to him.

 

[Caledfwlch]

While not a fraud he does tend to get lauded too much for his accomplishments. The more you learn about him the more you despise the man. Yet the USA dedicated a holiday to him.

There appears to be a certain type of American who seem to be very attached to ideas that Columbus was the first white, European to find the continent, and that Native Americans (in the Continental US, not "natives" further south) were basically barbarians with a lack of both skills and permanent presences in things like mining. Yet the Vikings from signs being dug up in Newfoundland discovered the place long before Columbus, not to mention the Basques were fishing the Grand Banks as long as 2000 years ago, not to mention the Piris Reis map showing "something" being out that way, and the name Brazil comes from the old legends of Hy-Brasil, a land mass to the West, and Cocaine found to have been used by ancient Egyptian Mummies, well, before they became mummies one assumes . I suspect a lot of "discoveries" from the past were simply rediscoveries, especially since as mentioned, clearly people got there thousands, or hundreds of thousands of years ago.

If the Welsh Legends of Prince Madog are, simply that, myths, then the Native American tribe supposed to be the one his people intermixed with were a very permanent tribe, unlike the others, and again under the idea some (I assume Bigots) hold that the Natives were barbarians with no permanence, these people defy it having lived in stone villages built around a central square. And evidence has been found of ancient mines being excavated by Native Americans a couple of thousand years ago.

I was chatting about this with Baylor, the OP the other day - we suspect that for example the Destruction of the Library of Alexandria may well have lost to us, incredible revelations about what was really known and discovered about the world in ancient history. It would equally not surprise me if the Vatican held in its Archives copies of or information on some - not intentionally suppressing it - they simply don't know they have it, having been run by centuries worth of by avid collectors and preservers of knowledge, and of course donations, I imagine the filing system is a little "anarchic" at best!

In a way it's sort of good, in that it means there are still things to explore, to theorise about, and to stir the imagination.

 

[Allegra]

Certainly not the greatest, but at the time of the music recording business it is astonishing, more so, it was so easy! Though with nowadays technology to do this sort of thing would be like easy game and hard to detect.