Iron Fist - Netflix most abhorred series by the critics

[Stable]

I can't really pin it down, but when I compare to daredevil for eg. they just aren't that exciting... there's exceptions (I thought Danny vs the axe-wielding triad mobsters in the hallway was pretty tight), but in general the hits don't seem as solid and the choreography is less interesting. It's still better than Captain Kirk battling Klingons. One of my friends has complained that for the ultimate kung fu guy he certainly gets beaten up a lot, which I can kind of see.

But hey, if you think otherwise more power to you!

 

[ctg]

One of my friends has complained that for the ultimate kung fu guy he certainly gets beaten up a lot, which I can kind of see.

If he wouldn't receive any wounds or battle marks then it would be unbelievable. And no master can take down everyone. DD couldn't save Elektra for all his skills and abilities. Stick is still one man and head of Sitra, but even he wouldn't directly confront the Hand. So, would it have been more believable if he'd been able to deflect all strikes, kicks and slashes without getting nicked?

 

[E.Maree]

See, I have heard that complaint a lot. I guess I'm missing why the fight scenes are so poorly done? Is it missing amazing super fastness? Or such? Danny comes across as making it look effortless and I guess I never saw an issue with that?

But, keep in mind, I am no fighting scene expert here!

A solid criticism that I agreed with was that the scenes had too many cuts, creating a choppy viewing experience. Daredevil was well known for minimal cuts, particularly in the iconic hallway fight scene. But Iron Fist has scenes like this one, with 56 cuts in 38 seconds.

Do most viewers count the cuts? Not a chance.
Do most viewers still notice that a scene is hard to follow and oddly uncomfortable to watch? Hell yes.

I didn't get as far as this scene, but in the first few episodes, I noticed that the fight scenes lacked *weight*. The way they shot the punches meant their impact didn't feel real or impactful -- it was showy and dance-y, without the fierceness and force of a martial arts movie.

 

[Cli-Fi]

I'm at the end of second episode and I'm all ready hooked into it. The mystery behind the Iron Fist is that he is supposed to be enemy for the Hand. Luke Cage never saw them, Jessica Jones might have got something from the connection to Murdock&Nelson. But the real thing is the hole in the middle of the hell kitchen and the Hand Daredevil has been dealing with since the season one.

If you're first time viewer, Iron Fist isn't a bad choice because it will lead you to other Netflix stories as it explains along the way how it all happened. Even without the connections I was hooked by mental hospital scene and how well the story plays out as it's as unpredictable as the other Netflix Marvel productions.

I am slowly watching this when I have absolutely nothing left to watch. Just finished the second episode and I have to agree with you. I think it's odd that so far in the Marvel verse Danny's situation hasn't happened yet. Our hero gets lost. Check. or goes on a quest Check and comes back claiming to be the same guy, Check and he automatically gets taken away into a mental health facility. Only has happened to Danny. This didn't happen to either Tony Stark, Bruce Banner, or even Dr. Strange. They tried to do it to Thor, although that proved difficult.

Speaking of Dr. Strange, I see similarities between the two. Danny's love of meditation and his training with the monks. His lower ability to transcend to another dimension. He's like a mini-Dr. Strange. Since I don't read comics I don't know if they ever met in canon.

Another element of surprise for me was the riff-raf between Harold Meachum and his assistant. I think something will definitely come of that and every time he yells at the poor kid I half expect him to rape him. Are we to assume Harold and possibly Ward too, are gay?

 

[Cli-Fi]

Just watched up to Episode five. About to start six. Yup I'm taking my time with this one, as it's not as bingeable as DareDevil or Luke Cage. I think I finished Luke Cage all in one sitting. Iron Fist is probably the closest Marvel Netflix Show to the movies. It has a good blend of comedy and less serious parts like the movies do. It's a bit more grounded too. It's a pretty good standalone kung fu show if you take away the Marvel aspect and the hipstery look. It's a good soap opera too. I enjoy the family fighting. I've seen much worse shows and I could find this show having a home on AMC (Into the Badlands) or any of the broadcast channels too ABC etc... It's not quite Netflix and more traditional Hollywood.

In Defenders I'm guessing the main reason Danny Rand is there is so that he can bank roll the Heroes for Hire. Because honestly, his powers are pretty weak compared to the other Defenders and all the Avengers. I wonder how much he is worth?? I can't find any literature on the topic. He says he's a Billionaire now. He's not Tony Stark rich, but he's got some influence there.

 

[Cli-Fi]

I finished Iron Fist a month or two ago, and had some time to think about the show and where it fits in. I think Netflix did something really sneaky here with Danny Rand. Finn Jones was recently quoted saying that you aren't supposed to like Danny and it's TRUE!!!! No one likes Iron Fist and maybe it was designed that way. Maybe it was designed to be frustrating and unlikable. No one is going around saying they want to be Iron Fist like we did with Spiderman or Iron Man. Now you really aren't supposed to want to be Daredevil, Luke Cage, or Jessica Jones either, but those all handle their power relatively well and you can place yourself in their shoes if you had the same background.

Danny is completely different from all that. He is one of the most complex characters in the entire MCU. He's a reluctant billionaire, reluctant monk, reluctant hero. It isn't until the end of the series when he really starts to understand what being the Iron Fist means, even though there are still questions about its origins and the conspiracy theory that Colleen mentioned. That only makes things more intriguing because it means that unlike the others, his world isn't so black and white. Danny Rand might be one of the most grounded heroes in all the MCU. Despite his billionaire status, he has lived both lifestyles and is a generally all around conflicted person.

Going back to the similarities Iron Fist and Dr. Strange. I'd have to admit that Iron Fist is a lot better than that movie was. TBH. It's going to be interesting seeing Danny Rand butt heads with Matt Murdock. I don't see much they would agree with politically speaking.

 

[Cli-Fi]

@ctg I know at least one person on this forum who is going to be happy with this news:
‘Iron Fist’ Renewed for Season 2 at Netflix

 

[The Bluestocking]

@ctg I know at least one person on this forum who is going to be happy with this news:
‘Iron Fist’ Renewed for Season 2 at Netflix

Maybe Finn Jones should spend 6 months in martial arts training and body sculpting this time in order to at least get the physicality and fighting abilities of the character.

His fight scenes in season 1 were... let's just say that as an ethnic Chinese woman who grew up on Wuxia movies, I was embarrassed for him.

 

[Cli-Fi]

Maybe Finn Jones should spend 6 months in martial arts training and body sculpting this time in order to at least get the physicality and fighting abilities of the character.

His fight scenes in season 1 were... let's just say that as an ethnic Chinese woman who grew up on Wuxia movies, I was embarrassed for him.

A lot of people were hate watching this like I was. That's the only thing that makes sense on Netflix's part to renew it. I found some stuff that I liked about the series, that always happens to me when I go into a show or a movie and I don't expect anything from it. I heard about how bad Iron Fist was, but I found things I liked. Agree Finn needs to bulk up. He's got plenty of time too, and if he looks bigger in season 2 they can really play with that and have fun with it. Show him training etc...

But then, maybe his form of martial arts is all about Chi and precision rather than brute force, which is why they have Luke Cage on the team.

 

[The Bluestocking]

But then, maybe his form of martial arts is all about Chi and precision rather than brute force, which is why they have Luke Cage on the team.

Dude, no. Chinese martial arts (on which Iron Fist's style is most certainly based) is not just about being precise. It's about being FAST, brutal, and precise. Chi is supposed to be there to help provide stamina and - in the tradition of wuxia movies - extra power/strength.

Finn's fight scenes as Iron Fist? OMG! Some of them scenes were so slow and you could see him trying to remember his moves LOL!!! No, just no.

 

[Amelia Faulkner]

So far I'm only three episodes into Iron Fist, and there is so much WTF going on that it's making my eyes bleed. I'm with @The Bluestocking on the fight scenes. If you're going to sell me a series with a martial arts main character, he better be good at martial arts, you know? Danny doesn't even have the temperament of a martial artist, losing his rag every other scene then behaving like he's actually been the reasonable one. I also super did not appreciate his border/consent issues. If Luke Cage had been harassing a small Asian woman to get what he wanted, refusing to take no for an answer, people would be up in arms, but because Danny is a handsome white dude it's okay for him to use the "nice guy who just refuses to give up" harassment. And by god it went on. It wasn't like:
"Can I stay here?"
"No."
"Pls."
"Fine."

No, it went on uncomfortably long until he basically browbeat the only person who had helped him into doing what he wanted, and even then he was a total dick come the next morning by suddenly playing his music really loud despite always using an ipod before then.

He doesn't behave like a man trained as a martial artist for fifteen years. He behaves like an entitled little sh*tbag.

I'm not impressed with their handling of Unnamed Martial Art Sensei Colleen Wing, who uses some form of "I have a sword" style. She too does not behave like a martial artist. Any form of kenjutsu should be teaching respect and calm, but her idea of a "safe space" for her kids is to let them fart around and joke, whereas anyone who has actually taught martial arts to disadvantaged and troubled teens will tell you that the respectful behaviour it instils is what helps those teens. Also absolutely no sensei is going to organise "randomly attack me in the street where cops might mistake this for a real fight and shoot us" training sessions, and then belittle her students for doing it poorly instead of teaching them what they did wrong.

They both seem pretty keen on interrupting each other's kata/forms, too. Like, dude, no. Who would do that? "Hey I see you're working through your morning practice, how about I just stop that for no good reason?"

It's mind-bogglingly bad, especially when even the most cursory research could have fixed all this and still given them a strong plot, great characters, and complex motivations. There's literally no need whatsoever for the abysmal lack of understanding of any kind of actual martial arts.

 

[Amelia Faulkner]

One of my friends has complained that for the ultimate kung fu guy he certainly gets beaten up a lot, which I can kind of see.

In defence of what so far to me seems to be quite a bad show, at least it's explained within the first 1 or 2 episodes that Danny derives power from being hit. So when he's just getting started, he is going to take a lot of punches, because he gets better in a fight the more punishment he takes.

Feels like a flimsy excuse for the old "gets beaten up a lot then turns it around and wins" trope.

 

[ctg]

So far I'm only three episodes into Iron Fist, and there is so much WTF going on that it's making my eyes bleed.

ROFL. I expected quite a lot after Luke Cage came out.

Feels like a flimsy excuse for the old "gets beaten up a lot then turns it around and wins" trope.

They used this same thing with DD and it worked. They repeated it with Luke Cage and the Punisher. The hero must suffer before they claim the title. When Iron Fist came out, he already claimed to be hero while to our eyes, Dany hadn't even proved himself. Most of the audience didn't even know there's a such thing as Iron Fist as he hasn't been introduced in the major comic books. They cannot take the 'immortal' Iron Fist as someone equivalent to the superman even though that's what he really is. He isn't even in the same level with womanizing, arrogant Iron Man. If he'd been a humble Ip Man then maybe we wouldn't see him in such bad light.

If I'm totally frank I would have loved seeing them making a series around Doctor Strange even though he has nothing to do with the Hand. That pyjama party doesn't even get registered by the Supreme Mage even though the whole show is going around the corner.

 

[Mouse]

I watched this, but it ended up more background noise than me actually paying attention. Didn't care much for Danny Rand. The only interesting characters were Ward, Colleen, and Lewis Tan's drunken martial artist character who I can't remember the name of and was only in one ep.

I did get very excited at hearing Hoon Lee though but that's because I'm a nerd.

 

[Amelia Faulkner]

If I'm totally frank I would have loved seeing them making a series around Doctor Strange even though he has nothing to do with the Hand. That pyjama party doesn't even get registered by the Supreme Mage even though the whole show is going around the corner.

I would kill for a Doctor Strange series

 

[The Bluestocking]

I also super did not appreciate his border/consent issues. If Luke Cage had been harassing a small Asian woman to get what he wanted, refusing to take no for an answer, people would be up in arms, but because Danny is a handsome white dude it's okay for him to use the "nice guy who just refuses to give up" harassment. And by god it went on. It wasn't like:
"Can I stay here?"
"No."
"Pls."
"Fine."

^^ This. So much this.

 

[Amelia Faulkner]

Okay so I finished Iron Fist. By far and away my favourite character has to be Ward. I still don't like Danny and his variable boundaries. "The hand killed my parents" seems to be his catchphrase, which is a bit out of kilter for the rest of the Defenders' catchphrases:

Matt: "Objection!"
Jessica: "Screw you!"
Luke: "Sweet Christmas!"
Danny: "THE HAND KILLED MY PARENTS!"

 

[ctg]

"The hand killed my parents" seems to be his catchphrase, which is a bit out of kilter for the rest of the Defenders' catchphrases

I don't think the Hand had direct responsibility on killing Danny's parents. But I strongly believe it was Madame Gao as a dragon, who tore that plane roof away. We might never know the whole truth as I hope this particular storyline is put in the bed and the producers think hard what they want to see in the next season.

 

[Amelia Faulkner]

I don't think the Hand had direct responsibility on killing Danny's parents.

In effect they did, as they had already decided the Rands needed to die, but it was Harold's insistence he do it that led to such a flashy and un-hand-like death. He procured poison from Madame Gao and poisoned the Rands' pilots. This is all basically just blurted out around episode 12/13. It's why the corpses of the pilots showed the black veins like those Colleen displays when she succumbs to the poisoned blade which cut her.

Had Harold not gone the poison route, the hand were going to kill the Rands anyway.

 

[ctg]

This is all basically just blurted out around episode 12/13. It's why the corpses of the pilots showed the black veins like those Colleen displays when she succumbs to the poisoned blade which cut her.

I might have missed all that for some reason. LOL. But that doesn't explain why the hole was ripped on the plane and his mum sucked away. Poisoned pilots would mean the same thing as what happened to that unfortunate incident at the Italy, when the pilot decided to commit a suicide and slam on the mountainside. And with poisoned pilots you still have a chance for a miracle.