My seven seconds of other thought having passed, it was time for me to think about sex again.
For a change I combined it with thoughts about the Valar.
No. Not some kinky fantasy, but simply the fact that they could, but we have no evidence to say they did.
Why do I say they could?
Firstly Tolkien spends some considerable time in the beginning of the Silmarillion wobbling on about how they took on forms that defined their gender ”as our raiment defines ours”. And just as our raiment (or that pipe for that matter) isn’t what makes us male or female, their form was only an indication of their gender.
Does this imply they could have sex and more importantly reproduce? Well I suppose no. But it does imply it.
In the famous Ontological proof of the existence of God, of which I’m sure JRRT was aware, we are told that the greater cannot be greater if it can’t do something that the lesser can (or can imagine).
Ergo Valar can reproduce.
OK a bit of a push.
However we have one (or 2 ) examples that prove it more conclusively.
Luthien. Or more specifically Melian.
Melian was a Maia, ie a less powerful Valar, who was able to bear a child with Elwë.
So ok it was a cross pollination and the implication MAY be that it was the Elf gamete that was the deciding factor but basically the plumbing was there, if you like, implying that it was there for the rest of them.
The second example is Shelob. Last child of Ungoliant, who was certainly some sort of Maia (or at least Ainu), if not in the main batch.
Anyway. I would at least suggest that the possibility was there for making babies.
So my question is, are there any other references to Ainurlings in any of the other books, that I haven’t read, or does JRRT discuss this anywhere (Letters/lost tales etc).
And if not (or even if.) would you like to discuss it?
Tom and Goldberry’s kid would be a hoot.
FitzMandos less so perhaps.
For a change I combined it with thoughts about the Valar.
No. Not some kinky fantasy, but simply the fact that they could, but we have no evidence to say they did.
Why do I say they could?
Firstly Tolkien spends some considerable time in the beginning of the Silmarillion wobbling on about how they took on forms that defined their gender ”as our raiment defines ours”. And just as our raiment (or that pipe for that matter) isn’t what makes us male or female, their form was only an indication of their gender.
Does this imply they could have sex and more importantly reproduce? Well I suppose no. But it does imply it.
In the famous Ontological proof of the existence of God, of which I’m sure JRRT was aware, we are told that the greater cannot be greater if it can’t do something that the lesser can (or can imagine).
Ergo Valar can reproduce.
OK a bit of a push.
However we have one (or 2 ) examples that prove it more conclusively.
Luthien. Or more specifically Melian.
Melian was a Maia, ie a less powerful Valar, who was able to bear a child with Elwë.
So ok it was a cross pollination and the implication MAY be that it was the Elf gamete that was the deciding factor but basically the plumbing was there, if you like, implying that it was there for the rest of them.
The second example is Shelob. Last child of Ungoliant, who was certainly some sort of Maia (or at least Ainu), if not in the main batch.
Anyway. I would at least suggest that the possibility was there for making babies.
So my question is, are there any other references to Ainurlings in any of the other books, that I haven’t read, or does JRRT discuss this anywhere (Letters/lost tales etc).
And if not (or even if.) would you like to discuss it?
Tom and Goldberry’s kid would be a hoot.
FitzMandos less so perhaps.
