Very interesting blog by an author who actually tested how much her eBook was being pirated.
Contents of Maggie Stiefvater's Brain
Contents of Maggie Stiefvater's Brain
Impact of eBook piracy on sales
- Thread starter Montero
- Start date
Read this a couple of days ago. Brilliant, and a rare example of someone involved in publishing (in this case an author) doing some real research into what's actually going on.
Boneman
Well-Known Member
See, that internet is an evil, evil place...
Yes. And a very clever way of doing the research.
I'm stunned by this. I really, really thought that people who "stole" (I'm not going to use "pirated" because somehow people don't see that is a crime) a book would never have bought the book anyway. This appears to have proved the opposite in this research. The only problem is that a single example of this sort could be seen as an aberration.
Personally, I've often not bought a book because I felt it was too expensive. (And to be honest my view of what's too expensive has changed to a lower scale in recent years.) But I've never knowingly took a book that wasn't paid for and was in print and read it. --- I like to think that most people who read books for pleasure are a lot like me in that regard. ---- I suppose I'm a gullible Parson. (Sigh!)
Personally, I've often not bought a book because I felt it was too expensive. (And to be honest my view of what's too expensive has changed to a lower scale in recent years.) But I've never knowingly took a book that wasn't paid for and was in print and read it. --- I like to think that most people who read books for pleasure are a lot like me in that regard. ---- I suppose I'm a gullible Parson. (Sigh!)
Be interesting to do on stand alone books and first in series. Higher probability with last book in series that you are looking at dedicated series readers who wanted it for free. So they would have bought it anyway, but if they don't have to pay, they won't.
I thought an important part of the article was the point that if the author and especially the publisher don't get enough money, there is a big likelihood of no more books from that author, or in that series.
Kate Elliott has several unfinished series, that she talks about on her website - sales weren't high enough, she needs more income, there are more books planned for those series, she'd like to finish, but not economic.
I thought an important part of the article was the point that if the author and especially the publisher don't get enough money, there is a big likelihood of no more books from that author, or in that series.
Kate Elliott has several unfinished series, that she talks about on her website - sales weren't high enough, she needs more income, there are more books planned for those series, she'd like to finish, but not economic.
DelActivisto
WARG!
I'm curious - how do people get a hold of these PDF documents to distribute? If the publishers are selling eBooks in PDF form, it might be a good idea to stop. Kindle books are nearly impossible to convert to PDF, it seems.
And it looks like an interesting method of counter piracy is to use plants in various pirate forums to release fake versions of the book PDF. That at least keeps them at bay for a while, perhaps.
And it looks like an interesting method of counter piracy is to use plants in various pirate forums to release fake versions of the book PDF. That at least keeps them at bay for a while, perhaps.
In her case, it seems the publishers were distributing them as ARCs.
I've known friends (none on this website!) that would quite happily pirate more music than they can ever listen too, all TV/film content that they can possibly get their hands on and (I assume) be able to get virtually any e-book.
Oddly the person I'm thinking about primarily, has quite strong 'morals'. Except apparently when it comes to stealing.
And yes he'd take stuff that he was interested in and, in another universe, would have paid for one way or another.
It actually makes me a tough furious just thinking about it.
As for the remedy, I think flooding pirate market with shoddy or incomplete versions must be feasible in some manner. Surely the big publishers/film companies could employ just a few knowledgeable people to pollute the waters of the pirate cove with vast quantities of nonsense?
E books are incredibly easy to convert formats of. It's why most of us now go DRM free - because it protected nothing.
Interesting article. Keep the day job, peeps.
Interesting article. Keep the day job, peeps.
tinkerdan
∞<Q-Satis
My first novel's e-book was pirated and I don't wonder or care how they did it; I asked the website, which was a legit website that trades free book, to remove it and they did. I'm not sure what they might have done with the user who posted it.
However I did locate a twitter feed by the same user who was actually looking for the book(free) prior to pirating it and I was at first thinking it was the Smashwords book(which I did offer free), but when I took a membership at the site and viewed it it was the Xlibris copy; so it was from the mobi that was distributed widely throughout several on line book store sites.
Later Smashwords made some sort of arraignment with the site in question and I allowed my e-book to be put up with compensation to me based on reads.
I've read that entire Raven series and loved them all. I purchased them in hard bound editions and they were well worth the price.
However I did locate a twitter feed by the same user who was actually looking for the book(free) prior to pirating it and I was at first thinking it was the Smashwords book(which I did offer free), but when I took a membership at the site and viewed it it was the Xlibris copy; so it was from the mobi that was distributed widely throughout several on line book store sites.
Later Smashwords made some sort of arraignment with the site in question and I allowed my e-book to be put up with compensation to me based on reads.
I've read that entire Raven series and loved them all. I purchased them in hard bound editions and they were well worth the price.
DelActivisto
WARG!
E books are incredibly easy to convert formats of. It's why most of us now go DRM free - because it protected nothing.
Interesting article. Keep the day job, peeps.
So what, just don't sell e-books!? Why are people such jerks!? *jumps up and down in agitated fury*
Paperbacks I know and hard covers I assume also find themselves in the pirated category, though likely not in the kind of numbers that ebooks could generate.
I had a serious discussion with our music people some years ago. Said I "If you left $.35 on the copy machine on Monday it would still be there on Sunday because people would feel like taking the money would be stealing. How then do we justify copying sheet music and taking the royalties away from the song writers." --- It hasn't been done to my knowledge for over 20 years.
Therefore I think that people have to realize that making and using pirated books, music, etc. is just the same as reaching into someone's pocket and taking their change.
DelActivisto
WARG!
No, I don't think people realize that. They think: It's anonymous and it's really easy to just think that it's just a book, just a song, and that you're not going to pay for it anyway, so you might as well. It's not like you're actively hurting anyone, after all.
Serendipity
A Traditional Eccentric!
In what was ancient Greece (now southern Italy), there was a city, Sybaris. The inhabitants liked their food and were always on the look out for a new taste experience. The eateries would invent new recipes to encourage customers to be patrons of their establishment.
Only one snag... as soon as one chef invented a recipe, the other eateries would copy that recipe. As it took time, effort and resources to come up with new recipes, the inevitable happened. Chefs stopped inventing recipes.
Of course the citizens were far from happy about this because they liked their food. So a law was passed. A chef who invented a new recipe would have exclusive rights to producing that recipe for the space of one year. The chefs went back to inventing recipes because it had once again become profitable and worth their while.
This all happened around 500BC!
This is to point out that taking someone else's 'copyright' material is far from a new problem. The ancients solved theirs by stopping their creativity until they could get a acceptable return on their investment, i.e. getting the 'culinary patent law' in place.
Word is already getting out that it is not profitable to be an author, unless you are very talented and work long hours to keep producing more work for publication. For all but a very few it's turned into sweatshop business or a hobby. The quantity of new fiction will inevitably reduce as the laws of economics dictate. Which means the copyright stealers will have less and less. There will come a point when it becomes unprofitable for them to continue in their thieving ways.
Unfortunately, I suspect by that time, the talented authors will have gone elsewhere - well those that are able to.
Unless of course a way can be found to make writing into a reasonable living. Any ideas anyone?
Only one snag... as soon as one chef invented a recipe, the other eateries would copy that recipe. As it took time, effort and resources to come up with new recipes, the inevitable happened. Chefs stopped inventing recipes.
Of course the citizens were far from happy about this because they liked their food. So a law was passed. A chef who invented a new recipe would have exclusive rights to producing that recipe for the space of one year. The chefs went back to inventing recipes because it had once again become profitable and worth their while.
This all happened around 500BC!
This is to point out that taking someone else's 'copyright' material is far from a new problem. The ancients solved theirs by stopping their creativity until they could get a acceptable return on their investment, i.e. getting the 'culinary patent law' in place.
Word is already getting out that it is not profitable to be an author, unless you are very talented and work long hours to keep producing more work for publication. For all but a very few it's turned into sweatshop business or a hobby. The quantity of new fiction will inevitably reduce as the laws of economics dictate. Which means the copyright stealers will have less and less. There will come a point when it becomes unprofitable for them to continue in their thieving ways.
Unfortunately, I suspect by that time, the talented authors will have gone elsewhere - well those that are able to.
Unless of course a way can be found to make writing into a reasonable living. Any ideas anyone?
Boneman
Well-Known Member
How do we hire Maggie's brother?
The Big Peat
Darth Buddha
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2016
- Messages
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Its a mixed bag.
Some people download stuff they've already brought to have it in electronic format too.
Some people download stuff then buy it if they really like it.
Some people download stuff they'd probably never buy because they're curious enough to try it at a price of free. Sometimes that becomes a sale as with above. Sometimes they never even try it as with VB's example.
Some people do download things that they'd have a hundred per cent paid for if that was the only way of access. Although sometimes they'd never have known they wanted to buy it without piracy.
And some people do all of the above to varying degrees.
But yes, there's plenty of the last one. I wouldn't be surprised if they're the majority. When you come down to it, vast numbers of people will avoid paying money for something if its easy to do so, even if its illegal. People might be a bit slower to do so with a product they love but not that much slower.
*hand-wavey gesture*
To an extent. It then becomes a game of finding pirates you can trust rather than just hopping on and dl'ing the first thing. At first, such a barrier would be highly effective. But as Stiefvater shows, it breaks down pretty quick.
But even just getting it off the first page of google would help. Not that long ago, I did read substantial chunks of John Gwynne's Malice online as a pdf, simply because I was searching for the book, google autocorrect took me to John Gwynne Malice pdf, and the first hit showed me the book. It was easier to look inside the book than download an Amazon kindle sample. Curiousity got the better of me (and my vow never to read the book based on the kindle sample).
Ease of access alone never beats piracy single handedly, but it does help not to make it easier to find via piracy than not via piracy.
The last two books I looked at in this manner were The Dark Tower and Gardens of the Moon. In both cases, I simply wanted a peek at the first 20 pages or so for the purposes of an internet argument. If doing so reliably legally had been a fast option, I would have. It wasn't so I didn't. I'm not sure YouTube is a fantastic thing for the music industry, but it beats the alternative, and Apple made plenty out of being the first people to offer music legally at the same convenience.
Shame that the publishers aren't really in a position to launch their own e-book lending service at a reasonable subscription fee (or are they?).
...which those seeking to have these copies removed can also play. In theory, this reduces the number of sites about which some sort of action (from asking cooperative sites to take the material down to whatever can be done about the uncooperative sites) might be taken.
And it also makes the process harder for those wanting a proper version that's free to them.
I have a different mind-set. Hence you must be younger than me
I think it is because my formative years of access to content was the 70's/80's where things were not able to be instantly copied perfectly and access required careful consideration and a spending a bit of cash. Now, if I am looking for a book, and I'm online, I go directly to amazon and peruse there. Then I'd think about buying it, sticking it on a wish list, or at the very least, think about getting library access if I was desperate and had no cash (very rare that happens!). I ignore practically anything else on any google list of hits.
I do admit that I am lucky that I can more-or-less afford anything that comes up. And I don't really like e-format - perhaps one day I'll get a kindle, but reading at a PC is not my idea of great fun.
But at the end of the day, stealing is stealing. No matter how you dress it. For me at least even, 'I'm downloading this pirated copy to see what it's like, then I might buy it' is a cop out and excuse. On this tiny matter of morals my conscience is crystal clear. Hell, even if I've beta'd someone's novel and they've published it, I feel obligated to buy a copy because I've read it.
Also the thought of downloading something from a dodgy pirate website (I know that if you use it often it may turn out to be relatively safe) makes the computer side of me gnash my teeth. I spent ages trying to find a program that could play DVD's on my PC a few weeks ago...and then spent ages*2 getting rid of the hidden extension something had installed in my PC because of bad website choice!
Having said all the above, everyone's free to do what they want and it's up to them, I ain't no nanny. However, taking a Fallout 4 mechanic, if I know that someone is pirating deliberately in some manner then VB dislikes that so -1 on that person's character!
I suspect that demographics may have a lot to do with it - that the wider an authors appeal, the more likely they'll hit a lower common denominator who otherwise show little interest in buying. However, she specifically mentions Tumblr, which is a site I associate as mainly used by younger people - which would invite the argument of a generation who feel entitled to getting digital content for free online. I've seen both suggested before, but it would be interesting to see whether either are valid. For the most part, I wouldn't expect piracy to be a big issue for most authors simply because they are not enough in demand to warrant the supply. 2c.
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