Basing fantasy civilisation on unofficial GW Warhammer books?

[Templarorder123]

So I'm looking at the unofficial books - Cathay, Nippon and Ind. If I based my fantasy races on these books, would it be worth it? Or am I copying it?

Thanks!

 

[Ihe]

Is it for free-to-read fan fiction? If that's the case, I don't see the problem. If you're looking to publish, I would be on the lookout for legal trouble. How much are you basing your story on these races? Are we talking the garbs and warrior types, or their political interactions and the history of their kingdoms as well? Will you be using the same names? What kind of fantasy will you be writing? If you want to integrate any history from the world of Warhammer itself with publishing in mind, I would recommend against it.

And beyond that, think if you really need those races for your plot. If the races are interchangeable with any other, it means it's not really that important, and well, you might as well make up your own. Specially because those races you speak of are obvious imitations of the real old kingdoms of China, Japan, India or Persia/Saudi Arabia. Is there any reason you want to copy those races in particular? You could simply copy the real-life kingdoms and avoid any copyright headache. I'd understand worrying about copying truly fantastic races because of their uniqueness, but these human races you speak of seem to be quite mundane and blatant imitations of real world cultures. I don't understand why you would feel the need to copy them when you can draw inspiration from the real source directly. You'd do better creating your own from scratch, IMO (it's much more fun!). Then again, if it's fan fiction, go for it.

 

[Brian G Turner]

I don't understand why you would feel the need to copy them when you can draw inspiration from the real source directly.

Underlining this.

 

[millymollymo]

Unofficial GW products are still someone's Intellectual Property, it'll still come under copyright. Everything I've seen it marketed with is GW branding, so there is some agreement between creators in place.


Fan fiction isn't a bad thing, but you will hit walls if you try to profit from it. Like with Minecraft based products you have to be sure what your creating doesn't break the terms of use. And expect pull downs/court action when those terms are broken.

 

[Overread]

Most Warhammer Races are pretty generic to fantasy in their core concepts - heck the elf, the orc, the dwarf etc.. are all super generic creatures in fantasy to the point where those creatures are not copyright - however the Games workshop High Elf IS copyright and IP - and GW will protect it. Legally companies are bound to protect their Trademarks/IP in order to keep hold of them; if they fail to protect them they can lose those rights.

I would say by all means read about the factions, read about many fantasy races and factions and then take a good look at history and mythology. You can often find many of the fantasy races are sourced from those references in the world. As a result you can easily take a few steps back to those influences and then create your own races, factions, world and lore unto yourself.

 

[HareBrain]

heck the elf

If I were writing trad fantasy, I've have him as a character. Too angry not to swear, but too elf-posh to swear properly.

 

[Biskit]

heck the elf

This gets my vote as well. Do we have a volunteer to write the Heck Chronicles?

 

[Templarorder123]

Is it for free-to-read fan fiction? If that's the case, I don't see the problem. If you're looking to publish, I would be on the lookout for legal trouble. How much are you basing your story on these races? Are we talking the garbs and warrior types, or their political interactions and the history of their kingdoms as well? Will you be using the same names? What kind of fantasy will you be writing? If you want to integrate any history from the world of Warhammer itself with publishing in mind, I would recommend against it.

And beyond that, think if you really need those races for your plot. If the races are interchangeable with any other, it means it's not really that important, and well, you might as well make up your own. Specially because those races you speak of are obvious imitations of the real old kingdoms of China, Japan, India or Persia/Saudi Arabia. Is there any reason you want to copy those races in particular? You could simply copy the real-life kingdoms and avoid any copyright headache. I'd understand worrying about copying truly fantastic races because of their uniqueness, but these human races you speak of seem to be quite mundane and blatant imitations of real world cultures. I don't understand why you would feel the need to copy them when you can draw inspiration from the real source directly. You'd do better creating your own from scratch, IMO (it's much more fun!). Then again, if it's fan fiction, go for it.

Hi,

The reason for this is because they have unofficial lore that never made it into the GW warhammer fantasy books. I mean the book of Ind and Cathay and Nippon have established lords and Gods which makes it's easier to adapt it from.

I'd just take the cities and Gods, but to be honest I'm not sure what the legal implications are for this.

However as you say, it's not worth it.

 

[Templarorder123]

Unofficial GW products are still someone's Intellectual Property, it'll still come under copyright. Everything I've seen it marketed with is GW branding, so there is some agreement between creators in place.


Fan fiction isn't a bad thing, but you will hit walls if you try to profit from it. Like with Minecraft based products you have to be sure what your creating doesn't break the terms of use. And expect pull downs/court action when those terms are broken.

All the more to avoid it then.

Really makes me annoyed why GW didn't adopt these three exotic factions and add them into their lore. Now we have to wait for the Total war series to even get those three factions and that's extremly unlikely by the looks of it!

 

[Templarorder123]

Most Warhammer Races are pretty generic to fantasy in their core concepts - heck the elf, the orc, the dwarf etc.. are all super generic creatures in fantasy to the point where those creatures are not copyright - however the Games workshop High Elf IS copyright and IP - and GW will protect it. Legally companies are bound to protect their Trademarks/IP in order to keep hold of them; if they fail to protect them they can lose those rights.

I would say by all means read about the factions, read about many fantasy races and factions and then take a good look at history and mythology. You can often find many of the fantasy races are sourced from those references in the world. As a result you can easily take a few steps back to those influences and then create your own races, factions, world and lore unto yourself.

Thank you Overread!!

 

[Overread]

Templar - why take any of it? Chances are if you look into history and mythology you'll find many of the sources of those idea of those nations. Also piggybacking off an existing franchise and series of lore books is messy. If GW has produced any of it then their legal side will shut you down; if its open-source it might work and it might not and you might get sued by every geek with a lawyer in the process.

In short its a messy approach to writing. Instead its far better to write your own. You can make it what you want; craft and twist and adjust it; plus if you get it out there to the public you don't have to worry about legal challenge.










I hearby claim all royalties for Heck the Elf!

 

[Templarorder123]

Templar - why take any of it? Chances are if you look into history and mythology you'll find many of the sources of those idea of those nations. Also piggybacking off an existing franchise and series of lore books is messy. If GW has produced any of it then their legal side will shut you down; if its open-source it might work and it might not and you might get sued by every geek with a lawyer in the process.

In short its a messy approach to writing. Instead its far better to write your own. You can make it what you want; craft and twist and adjust it; plus if you get it out there to the public you don't have to worry about legal challenge.


I hearby claim all royalties for Heck the Elf!

GW didn't produce any army minature models for them I believe. But I might be wrong.

I'll be strictly avoiding it.

In that case, let me start a new thread on how to compile races. I've been doing some research and want to know how to compile it all together I suppose.

 

[Overread]

Aye though even if GW didn't produce any models and even though they have now abandoned (for the most part) that old lore its still theirs and they will still protect it

As for how to compile races you'd do well to study the works of Tolkien as that's just what he did - if anything he went a bit too far for most books requirements; but certainly he established a deep groundwork off which you can use as structure to help craft your own.

 

[Templarorder123]

Aye though even if GW didn't produce any models and even though they have now abandoned (for the most part) that old lore its still theirs and they will still protect it

As for how to compile races you'd do well to study the works of Tolkien as that's just what he did - if anything he went a bit too far for most books requirements; but certainly he established a deep groundwork off which you can use as structure to help craft your own.

Indeed.

I still am annoyed at the fact they ended a great universe. Totally not cool.

Though I'm not creating a typical save the world fantasy - something more akin to adventure and fantasy. Bit like Jack Sparrow embarking on new adventures etc.

 

[Overread]

I honestly feel that at present the market is lacking some good adventure fantasy. Everyone has gone for epic sweeping dramas and whilst I do love epic fantasy - sometimes - one wants something like Conan. Simpler, less saving the world and more living through the world itself. An adventure as opposed to a saga.

 

[Templarorder123]

I honestly feel that at present the market is lacking some good adventure fantasy. Everyone has gone for epic sweeping dramas and whilst I do love epic fantasy - sometimes - one wants something like Conan. Simpler, less saving the world and more living through the world itself. An adventure as opposed to a saga.

Overread, my MC is Asian in this universe, or primarily more than he's Hindu inspired. He's a very powerful holy saint in terms of European equivalent of sorcerer and wizard. I won't say much else except he's immortal and he's been going on adventure quests. Small ones. Nothing big, episodic short stories compiled together. Like Gotrex and Felix.

I think the problem with saving the world(I was writing one.) is that it's been done and done over again. Then there's GOT and Vikings but betraying each other has been going on and will become stale.

When you watch Pirates of the Carribean, I love the series you may or not. I loved the 5th one despite its inherent flaws. Most likely, I just loved that whenever Jack went around the Carribean, he was always plotting and going on some new adventure. His wit, his intelligence ironically made him a hero in the end. Adventure novels allow you to see clear villains and clear heroes without having to waste too much time on it.

 

[The Big Peat]

Ihe is right when he says why look at imitations when you can look at the real thing.

I'd also add that GW is notorious for protecting their intellectual property with all the tenacity and intellect of a hungry rottweiler. Of all the places to borrow names from, the Warhammer world is emphatically not one I'd choose.

 

[Vladd67]

Ihe is right when he says why look at imitations when you can look at the real thing.

I'd also add that GW is notorious for protecting their intellectual property with all the tenacity and intellect of a hungry rottweiler. Of all the places to borrow names from, the Warhammer world is emphatically not one I'd choose.

I don’t think it’s GW he is thinking of copying from I suspect it is this guy.
Warhammer Armies Project
Some of the best looking fake books I have seen.

 

[Cli-Fi]

Similarly Star Trek and Star Wars both have official books and unofficial books as part of Canon or not, I always wondered how that worked. It seems these things are mostly from insiders in the franchises though so not sure how a unknown author could get in on the action.

 

[Toby Frost]

I would suspect that anyone making an unofficial add-on to a Warhammer game will be mentioning copyright places, characters etc in their background text, and would be creating rules that would work with the existing rules of Warhammer and hence would make use of GW's intellectual property. Basically, if GW creates Marneus Calgar, and I create Bob son of Marneus, I'm riffing off GW property. If then someone else then creates Fido, Bob's dog, they are still traceable back to GW's intellectual property, namely Marneus Calgar and the setting in which he exists. Of course, real history isn't copyrightable.