Needing to break bad habits

[Fogged_Creation]

I've been having lots of cool ideas, albeit fleeting. There's one where i have a really cool story idea in my head but i can't seem to figure out how i should get started!

I believe that it might be too big for being a first time story making but it's something that I've been world building bit by bit for years now but i can't figure out how i should avoid the factors of (Procrastination, boredom, distractions, sudden loss of interest, bad habits, etc...)

It's a real big problem on not just trying to make a story but in most things in my personal life as well.
I post this thread hoping there might be others out there that might be or have had felt the same way and follow this thread, either to ask the same question as i am or to give answers to whatever problem i might be having, whether the help be minimal or detailed, i appreciate every little bit of advise you can give me, even if that might be a small thing like for example on how i should be writing mini stories instead, or if i should instead rely on writing by hand for a better real interpretation or something.

Thank you for your time, i patiently await your responses
-Aspiring Author

 

[Jo Zebedee]

I started with a trilogy of a quarter of a million words. Go for what enthuses you

 

[Teresa Edgerton]

Moved to Writing Discussion since this appears to be about writing habits and writing problems and solutions. (Book Discussion is where we discuss the books we've read.)

I also agree with Jo. Write a story you feel enthusiastic about. Don't worry about how long it might be. If you are excited by the idea you're more likely to stick with it, whether it's a short story or a multi-volume epic.

And don't worry where to start. Write what comes into your head. You can then add new chapters to the beginning or to the end, mix things around, take things out. That's what early drafts are all about, just writing the story as it comes to. You can worry later about all the other stuff.

 

[Fogged_Creation]

Moved to Writing Discussion since this appears to be about writing habits and writing problems and solutions. (Book Discussion is where we discuss the books we've read.)

I also agree with Jo. Write a story you feel enthusiastic about. Don't worry about how long it might be. If you are excited by the idea you're more likely to stick with it, whether it's a short story or a multi-volume epic.

And don't worry where to start. Write what comes into your head. You can then add new chapters to the beginning or to the end, mix things around, take things out. That's what early drafts are all about, just writing the story as it comes to. You can worry later about all the other stuff.

Oh my bad! I did not notice that there was a forum about this sort of thing.

And you are right that if you are enthusiastic about your story, the more you will want to eternalize it into a book.
As much as i can understand, i do want to write down my ideas and draft it and all.

The problem with me though, is i can't seem to keep up that momentum that makes a story shine. I seem to give up when i see that I've scrapped it at least 4 times, even knowing that with every re-design i put over it i am aware that i am making good improvements. Something in my head tells me "What if I'm getting a bad habit that I'm not aware of?" and "I may be improving with practice, but now I'm bored"
Boredom or whatever seems to also destroy my mood for writing, when i am even starting to feel slightly bored on something that I'm doing and it isn't obligatory i instantly turn my nose away and just look at social media waiting hours while watching other peoples success, and going into discord every 10 seconds to see if anybody's given me any interesting messages (Which has almost never happened)

Overall i might already have a reallllyyy bad habit that's negatively affecting my skill progression on anything. I'm also wondering, on how i can encourage myself to push myself into doing these sorts of things, not too much though. A balance between the two would be nice I'd say.
Usually friends are a really good way of pushing me to do things that i like doing in the end. But i can't always rely on them for help, so how would i be able to help myself in this case?

Though... Sorry that this is quite an unreasonable request. I'm kinda lost on where to go. And I'm not even sure if plenty of other people have faced similar conflicts such as these, but even then I've gotten enough motivation to write this thread, so that i may have a chance to push myself enough to do the things i love.

No pressure ofcourse. Anything that could help guide my case by even a small margin is highly appreciated

 

[Jo Zebedee]

What about a writing group? They make you write...

 

[Teresa Edgerton]

Yes, a writing group might help. But also keep in mind that many published books went through a lot more than four rewrites before the author felt they were ready to send out to the publishers.

Going by my own experience with the first book I ever completed and sent out (I stopped counting rewrites at seven) it sometimes took me several rewrites to finally accept that something I liked for itself wasn't really working and had to be changed or discarded. For a while I was repeating bad habits, but by the very repetition I finally had my fill of whatever it was I was clinging to and found the gumption to make the necessary changes.

I didn't belong to a writers group at that time, and doing so many rewrites may be doing things the hard way, but sometimes, for some of us, the hard way is the only way we can really learn, at least at a particular stage in our lives or our development as writers. Later, when I had sold the book to the second publisher who saw it, I had more confidence in myself and my writing and could face criticism from a writer's group, and I was ready to learn what other writers and aspiring writers could teach me, and they were an enormous help to me. Others are ready for a writing group a lot earlier than I was, and it proves to be a good path for them.

What I am saying is, what seem like bad habits now may be a necessary part of your development. Or your growing dissatisfaction with that process may be a sign that you are indeed ready for a new approach, which may include joining a good local writing group if you can find one. If you are writing science fiction or fantasy, a group of other speculative fiction writers would be the best choice but maybe not available where you live, but there are, I hear, some good online writing groups.

But if you do join a group, whether a face-to-face or online group, make sure it contains several writers who understand and respect whatever genre you are writing in.

 

[Margaret Note Spelling]

I can empathize with the boredom--I recently went through a period of complete and utter malaise about the entire story and world and cast of characters, at about the fourth attempt at a rewrite. Nowadays, I'm pretty sure that was a signal that my tastes and goals for my writing had improved drastically since I'd last tried to work on it. The characters were stupid, the world was ridiculously simple, and the plot just dragged. I literally scrapped everything at that point. I went back to the world and plot itself, and asked myself, "What do I keep? What kind of story do I most want to write, at this moment?" and tried to work from there. Parts of the old story bled back into the new as I re-identified what I wanted to write about. If I was bored, then I think it was because at some level I considered that the story I was currently writing wasn't worth my time or effort. As long as I thought it was, though, it became something I wanted to do more than anything else. Boredom didn't enter into it anymore.

I guess my primary thought is that bad habits are ultimately up to yourself to break. The philosophy I'm personally going by right now is that if my story isn't actively in the process of being written, then there's something standing in the way (plot holes, character problems) making me feel either unable or unwilling to write it just yet, and my first step towards finishing that story is identifying whatever it is in the way and dealing it a swift, hard blow to the back of the metaphorical head. Or something more subtle.

It's certainly not easy. It took a good lot of analysis and fairly deep figuring for me to identify exactly what was preventing me from writing--but I think that might just be me, because all my life it's taken me a hefty truckload of convoluted thought to get to where other people simply go by instinct. On the bright side, now I've actually begun again, and I'm much more sure now that writing this story is really what I want to do with my time.

I don't know how much this helps you. It's just my own experience, which is all I can really offer. Anything else I could say would probably sound weirdly like life advice, which I'm kinda squeamish about dishing out to other people online!

Something in my head tells me "What if I'm getting a bad habit that I'm not aware of?" and "I may be improving with practice, but now I'm bored"

(One more thought--bad habits of writing are always fixable. They have to be; it's pretty much the default state. Not writing is, after all, the worst writing habit, ne c'est pas?)

 

[Kharn]

I understand where you're coming from. I had an idea once, a mix of epic fantasy and my past D&D adventures that would be both entertaining and action packed. I went into an almost manic state, writing 100,000 words in three weeks. When I finished it, I sat back and actually read what I wrote.

God, it was horrible.

It was so bad that i almost threw it out. My wife had gone to see her mother and taken our son with her. I had to work and couldn't go. No big deal. The night prior to starting night shifts, I stay up all night to get my body clock turned around. That night I sat down with a bottle of my favorite bourbon and edited my work. When I was done, I saved and closed it, putting it away for about five months.

I worked on some other projects here and there but left my fantasy story alone. I left it alone for so long, I forgot what I wrote. When I went back over it I still thought it needed work, needed a better villain and more depth to the characters, more conflict between party members, etc. Maybe I'm too hard on myself but I still haven't made changes to it, and that was over a year ago.

The point is, we all get discouraged with our own works. Some of us will be our own worst enemy, but we won't know until we put words on paper. Write when you're motivated and let it sit when you aren't. A writing group would be a big help, I think. Sometimes what we need is accountability, sometimes it inspiration or motivation. When you figure it out, hold onto that knowledge and do what you can to get back to that place when you lose your way.

On a more personal note, I do believe you have a bad habit. Social media. While I don't personally use it, I do understand its effectiveness in certain areas. Unfortunately, too many people sit on facebook, Twitter and Instagram wasting their lives away. That is a personal choice you have to make and a habit to break, should you chose to.

 

[-K2-]

I can't advise you, but I can state what I do in many cases (know, I'm unskilled and unpublished). With a general idea for a story in my mind, typically a few scenes I'd like to see, I'll come up with an end--a punchline. Think about it. Really that's what a story is past entertainment. It is some point that you're wanting to make and all the rest are the reasons and steps to get you there.

So, I come up with an ending, I know a few scenes I want, then I devise how I get this thing started. All I'm wanting to do with that start is introduce a character, through a situation, and get them moving. Past that, I just let things play out naturally. If my character needs to go left, i don't take them right. Naturally, I need a reason to make them go left...and so it goes. IOW, I just write and use each scene to get me to the next, sometimes that means a few steps back, I ensure failures, successes, realizations, and eventually I get near what I first thought would be the end. That may change, but if it does it is because I've thought up something better as the people and world develops.

Enjoy the trip. Otherwise, you might as well just write: "In the beginning...the end."

Unfortunately, for me, that method turns intended novelettes into 200k word novels, but so it goes.

K2

 

[sknox]

I get bored sometimes. Discouraged, excited, lost, eager, and so on. What I've learned is that my emotional state is irrelevant. My job is to get the story told. As with any job, there are times when one is discouraged, excited, lost, eager, bored, etc. The job still needs doing. If I had to wait to be enthused, I would never have finished even the first novel. I'm working on my fourth.

I call it a job, but it's way better than a job because it's voluntary. Maybe call it the task. The old saying is, I hate writing but I love having written. That says it as well as anything. I also sort of side with Hemingway, who said (more or less) if a person can stop, they should. He was of the opinion that the only people who should write are the ones who are unable to stay away from it. It's hard work, even for the very gifted.

 

[Toby Frost]

"What do I keep? What kind of story do I most want to write, at this moment?"

I think these are important questions. Personally, I find that it’s not enough to have a grand concept of a story (“It’s about the fall of an ancient kingdom”) – I need to have a character or set of characters who I can zoom in on. Almost every story that I’ve completed went through a process where I knew roughly what I wanted to do but didn’t quite know how to do it. I’ve found that just leaving it and turning it over in my mind helps a lot. It’s like a sieve: the weaker ideas eventually fall away, or I lose interest in them or incorporate them in another form. I’ve grow wary of thinking “This sounds cool, I’ll write about it!” and getting tired of the idea before it’s done.

In terms of plotting, I do need a rough structure beyond a start and an ending. I’ve never really gone in for the plotter/pantser metaphor: for me, writing is like moving across a number of islands, each representing an important point in the story that I want to tell. Once I’ve worked out what those islands are, the question is how I get from one to the next. Each “plot island” is an important moment in the writing, and it stops me feeling that I have a vast, grey wilderness to cross before I get to the end.

The other thing I’d say as a general point (and I don’t know if this is the case with the OP) is to be wary of attempting something too big too early. I’m currently writing a four-person fantasy story, and there’s no way I could have made a decent job of it prior to writing some shorter, simpler novels.

 

[Dragonlady]

I am trying to write a first draft, with a lot more life than when I previously managed it, not a lot of confidence and little time. Tips:

set a writing target you can meet.

you don't have to write linearly. I am writing disconnected scenes that will eventually join up.


think about your story when you're not writing it.

 

[Toby Frost]

Just a thought - a while back a writer called George Mann recommended something called a Neo Alphasmart to me. I can't vouch for it, but apparently it's a battery-powered word processor with no internet capabilities, designed for schoolkids in the US. I gather they're out of production but can be acquired second hand. If you really can't avoid social media, it might be an idea!

AlphaSmart - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Steve Harrison]

Just a thought - a while back a writer called George Mann recommended something called a Neo Alphasmart to me. I can't vouch for it, but apparently it's a battery-powered word processor with no internet capabilities, designed for schoolkids in the US. I gather they're out of production but can be acquired second hand. If you really can't avoid social media, it might be an idea!

AlphaSmart - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

That reminds me of my first word processor in the early 1990s, which was a lot bigger than this one, and you could see three lines of type on the screen. It was a birthday present and I shook my head in wonder and said, "whatever will they come up with next?"

 

[Venusian Broon]

I am trying to write a first draft, with a lot more life than when I previously managed it, not a lot of confidence and little time. Tips:

set a writing target you can meet.

you don't have to write linearly. I am writing disconnected scenes that will eventually join up.


think about your story when you're not writing it.

Or not

I must write linearly. Wouldn't be able to write otherwise!

Just like going to the gym, writing targets need to be doable as you say, but I found, just like exercise, some days are light, some days heavy. Some days are great, some days are awful. And some days you have to miss (and even some days you can be naughty and just not do it!). So I don't worry too much about it, nor try and focus on targets too much. I just make sure it's regular. Both gym going and writing time!

But really my point is if you find that your habits are bad, find out why they are inhibiting you. Experiment with processes or timings (I actually love writing early in the morning. Originally when I started time was an issue, so I would wake up an hour earlier than I used to, to ensure an hour of me writing-time. It now has stuck - the morning writing, not the very early waking up!)

Are you a die-hard pantser that always seems to 'run out of juice' and never ending? Try plotting a little and see where that goes. Are you a plotter that finds you are spending years researching the littlest thing and just not actually writing the story? Just get a blank sheet out and start typing. You might enjoy it and find something substantial form.

Writing is about organising yourself and your time mostly. Thankfully it does not usually cost cash to experiment to find what works for you. There is loads of advice out there on how to do it. Find the advice that speaks to you most, and always try and find enjoyment and excitement in what you do.

@Fogged_Creation , purely a personal anecdote....but I spent years (decades!) trying to write. And I just couldn't even scratch the surface of actually starting. Then I discovered a correspondence course in creative writing that forced me to write ~2k word essays and short stories. Now I'm not saying you have to sign up to something like that, but I found that as soon as I tasked myself to do something manageable, like a 2000 word short story the flood gates broke. It turned out I needed to write a beginning, middle and end and also to experience the delicious joy of actually finishing something and having a complete and whole story in my hands. Then I pushed out loads of short stories. (They were c*ap, but never mind, it was experience But what you will discover is that you writing will get faster and better.)

It was a small step, but then, and I know this sounds daft, I realised a novel is just a load of these small steps linked together. And I knew I could do small steps. You can't run a marathon in three steps. You will take thousands and it will take a long time. And again, as above, for the longer projects, such as novel-length stories always try to maximise the excitement and joy of the process and journey. It can be a hard slog!

 

[-K2-]

Regarding @Venusian Broon 's anecdote... 'How do you get to Carnegie Hall?'

K2

 

[AlexH]

How about writing 200 words a day or every other day? That's a start, and who knows where it'll lead.

 

[The Big Peat]

So I notice that you said this is something of a life problem as well as a writing problem and if that is the case, I think you probably need to address it from that angle as much as any writing angle. I'm horrible for finishing things myself; I'm currently deciding what to do about the recent realisation that I've probably got ADD and what that might explain about some of my past life things. I've also had a lot of depressive episodes that did absolutely nothing to help. Maybe something in that rings some bells for you. Maybe not. If it does, talk to people who can get you support. It'll improve things. Even if there isn't anything big, it's likely that learning to finish things and not put off starting things is something that'll go better for being holistic. I have no big tips there, simply a belief that seeking tips there will pay off.

As for writing...

First off, I'm with Skip and Hemingway. Anyone who can walk away from this game should. It is awesome fun but also a big drain. I'm guessing from the fact that you're here asking its not really something you want to do, so lets roll with it.

Second... this boils down to starting things and finishing things and not accepting excuses from yourself. The more you do this, the more the habit builds. I know that's over-simplistic and doesn't help with the how, but I think it helps to state the problem in bald terms so you remember why you're doing it.

So... start writing something that excites you. If you discover you need to adjust its place in the book, you can. Part of writing is finding out how to do it as you go, same for all of us. You can't be afraid of that. If you have any short story or even microfiction ideas that excite you - even better! Do them. Get used to the satisfaction of seeing a complete product of yours. Start learning what you need to do to complete a story so that when you get to that hump, you know you can. If you don't have that, c'est la vie. If you can find a regular writing time, that'd be great too. If you can't, work around it. If you have a regular writing time and miss it - even if you miss it for three days, three weeks - don't beat yourself up about it, just get back on it when you can.

You've been given a lot of good advice here but ultimately this will all come from you and whether you're prepared to learn to keep working when it gets gruelling and less fun. There are processes here that will help you but it will be an effort to establish them and you've got to be prepared to see that through.

 

[Finch]

I'm not exactly sure what your question is, but I am sure whatever it is, there will not be a single answer .
Here are some of my thoughts on trying to write .
There is not enough time in life to do everything.
Writing is largely spending a lot of time alone .
I don't know how to write well , but I do know you must write every day .
Writing every day is more important than thinking about ideas .
When not writing , send your time reading .
If you can't find time to write or If you can think of reasons why you can't write , than you probable never will write.

 

[sknox]

>starting things and finishing things
One of the difficulties I found as a first-time writer was recognizing what "finished" looks like. IMO, that's one factor in why would-be writers start projects but don't finish them. I worked on my first novel for years until I got lucky and interrupted myself.

Another story came to me and it was so small in concept, it felt like something I could finish. Many new writers undertake grand-scale stories. I did too. But then this other story came along and it felt like I could write it. It was just a kid hitchhiking across a desert and gets a ride in a Buick Roadmaster driven by a wizard. That was it. I wrote the story and sent it to some magazines.

Whether it got published or not (it did) wasn't the crucial step. Sending it was. At that moment I recognized what finished looked like. It's when I click Publish (or send query letters, if going traditional). Because at that point, I can no longer mess with the story. (true, in theory I could, but let's not get ourselves distracted by reality)

As I returned to the novel, I knew there was a feeling of "this is done." Not perfect, just done. I'd had the feeling, and I'd know when I felt it again. That served to get me through the novel, through a novella, and through subsequent work. Knowing what finished looks like, feels like.

Until you have that, you're always going to feel lost. That's how I felt anyway. Since then, I can feel discouraged, stuck, frustrated, but I don't feel lost because I know where I'm headed--toward done.