Amazon KDP paperback "buckling"

[HareBrain]

I've recently had proof copies of two paperbacks from Amazon. One is approx 5x8 inches and 270 pages, and is fine, but the much larger one, 6x9 inches and 550 pages, won't lie quite flat. The block of pages, along with the cover, has a slight but obvious buckling effect when seen from the end, and gaps want to open up in the block. This looks a bit crap.

I'm wondering if this is a function of the larger trim size, or the page count, or both? Has anyone printed a 550+ page 5x8 which doesn't do this, or a much lower count 6x9 which still does? I've seen similar with large blocks of A4 printer paper, so I think it probably is trim size, but I wanted to check if anyone knew for sure before I start rejigging the book as 5x8.

 

[Robert Zwilling]

I published an amazon printed 8-1/2 by 11 inch size book, three eighths of an inch thick, 40 physical pages, each page has a full page picture on one side and only 2 or 3 lines on back side. It has a subtle deformation problem. The books have a very slight wave to them when viewed from the side. The outer edges touch the flat surface but the center is very slightly raised up.

If they are stacked up, the top of the pile isn't flat and as more are piled on top of each other the shape goes from half a sine wave to one and a half sine waves.

When viewed from the side you can see that the glue goes higher up from the binded edge on the first and last page, they are more securely glued to the covers . On some copies there is a noticeable gap, on others there is just a faint line seen at the first and last page. The ones with the noticeable gap, the page rises up a little bit, then goes flat. The bigger gap happens when the pages next to the last and first pages pick up the disturbance instead of lying flat. The "gap" or thin space that looks one page thick ranges from a quarter inch, up to three quarters of an inch.

I store them with the binded side alternating, which seems to make the top of the stack appear flatter. After a while, a single book doesn't lay exactly flat, the right side edge rises up slightly for distance of one and a half inches, for a height of a sixteenth of an inch. This is from the one and a half sine wave shape. I would imagine the thickness of the book magnifies the internal distortions.

I was thinking of publishing a large text version (larger than 6x9) of my printed book, a 6x9 with 235 pages which does lay flat, but am now wondering how many pages it can be before it has problems not laying perfectly flat.

 

[-K2-]

I don't know... I'm not experienced by any means. But, I do know that most paperbacks I have seen from whatever the era until recently, did not do what you are describing. Over the past decade or so, I'll see books with the exact conditions you describe. From what publishers I couldn't say, but my guess is...

Rushed PoD practices, by a mostly unskilled and uncaring workforce (as opposed to lifelong dedicated bookbinders and publishers), lousy quality control allowing the equipment to run out of adjustment and the product to leave the doors in a 'scrap state,' due to companies that have little interest in the quality of what they sell, just simply, that they sell it.

Welcome to the modern age of worker drones as opposed to craftsman.

But, that's just a guess...

K2

 

[HareBrain]

Thanks for the input.

Because I've seen the same behaviour in stacks of A4 printer paper that have gone through my old Laserjet, I wonder if the paper becomes a bit warped by the rollers, or something else in the printing process.

One is approx 5x8 inches and 270 pages, and is fine,

Actually, on closer inspection even this one is a little bit "sine-wavy".

What's odd, though, is that I have two 5x8, 300-ish page POD books published through Amazon, but a few years old, which are fine, and with no sign of this warping at all.

I also have a 5x8 635-page book printed by Lightning Source which also doesn't (though this uses thinner paper than Amazon -- the 635 pages are the same total thickness as the 550 in my 6x9 example).

 

[Astro Pen]

I just ordered a box of my novel for a book fair in a few weeks.
I hoped that after the recent 'curled right back' cover debacle that I might get normal, as in flat, books this time.
Nope, as @HareBrain says, sine wavy.
I think at this point I am prepared to transfer the whole shebang to Ingram Spark.
Here is a random handful from the box.

 

[HareBrain]

I just ordered a box of my novel for a book fair in a few weeks.
I hoped that after the recent 'curled right back' cover debacle that I might get normal, as in flat, books this time.
Nope, as @HareBrain says, sine wavy.
I think at this point I am prepared to transfer the whole shebang to Ingram Spark.
Here is a random handful from the box.

View attachment 123783

I've noticed since starting this thread that the books do "settle". What happens is that the block of pages kind of expands a little so that (looked at from the end, like in your photo) the spine is the thinnest part of the book by a mm or two. It's almost like the page-block gets air into itself, but it then does lie flat.

I'm not sure if it's just the passing of time that fixes this (if you can call it a fix) or the pages being turned, as all mine have been copies for editing. I would try laying each copy flat by itself (so they're not stacked) and perhaps quickly "fan" the pages once. If it works, it should at least look better for the book fair.

 

[Astro Pen]

Thanks @HareBrain I'll fan them, lay them out and they have three weeks to behave themselves

 

[HareBrain]

Let us know how it goes!

 

[Astro Pen]

Pleased to report that, after a good fanning and separating they are definitely returning to flat. Not there yet but at least halved after 3 days.
So thanks @HareBrain . No embarrassment at the book fair after all.