Inspiration... and how much prodding it needs

BT Jones

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I'm surely not the only one infuriated by my own lack of foresight with respect to character choices am I? I have well established characters that have been around for a while (in my head at least) but I can't seem to organically conceive the right behaviors and development arcs for them the first time round.

Just today, I arrived at the absolute perfect arc for a key character on what is, essentially, my 4th attempt at writing them. It's so bloody obvious in hindsight that this is how I should have written her from the start. There is now far more intrigue, potential for conflict & character interplay, not to mention contrast with some other characters who she might otherwise have been too similar to in terms of personality and outlook.

Does someone have a magic computer programme I can plug myself into that can just magically syringe all this ideas and concepts out of me all at once, so that I'm not constantly writing and re-writing these characters ad infinitum?

He would probably give me a very perverse pleasure right about now to know there are other SFFers in the same boat (or at least were at some point).
 
I run into so many blocks. Usually, they're more like I can't figure out how to move in the direction I want to take it in an entertaining way though.
 
...Just today, I arrived at the absolute perfect arc for a key character...

Just a thought, but might it be possible that: the perfect arc for a character is the one that suits them least.

A character that is prepared to meet X problem, makes for a rather cut and dry story. In contrast, the character that is least equipped to face that problem, yet through trial and error does face and overcome it, using their abilities approach the problem from their own unique angle, makes for a very interesting story.

Anywho, I'm up way past my bedtime, so none of that might make sense, hehe :unsure:

K2
 
If I could get away from promotion and marketing on the 17 books I have out there, I might just have time to start another WIP. Now I'm winning multiple contests and this has distracted me to no end. I'm looking for relief and some down time so I can let my imagination wander instead of strategizing and doing math and filling out endless forms.
 
I'm surely not the only one infuriated by my own lack of foresight with respect to character choices am I? I have well established characters that have been around for a while (in my head at least) but I can't seem to organically conceive the right behaviors and development arcs for them the first time round.

Just today, I arrived at the absolute perfect arc for a key character on what is, essentially, my 4th attempt at writing them. It's so bloody obvious in hindsight that this is how I should have written her from the start. There is now far more intrigue, potential for conflict & character interplay, not to mention contrast with some other characters who she might otherwise have been too similar to in terms of personality and outlook.

Does someone have a magic computer programme I can plug myself into that can just magically syringe all this ideas and concepts out of me all at once, so that I'm not constantly writing and re-writing these characters ad infinitum?

He would probably give me a very perverse pleasure right about now to know there are other SFFers in the same boat (or at least were at some point).

If I knew of such a program, I'd be too busy selling it to hang out here. Or too busy using it. One of the two.

I would add that only letting in secondary characters that have some contrast to the others is a good tip for efficiency though.
 
Just a thought, but might it be possible that: the perfect arc for a character is the one that suits them least.

A character that is prepared to meet X problem, makes for a rather cut and dry story. In contrast, the character that is least equipped to face that problem, yet through trial and error does face and overcome it, using their abilities approach the problem from their own unique angle, makes for a very interesting story.

Anywho, I'm up way past my bedtime, so none of that might make sense, hehe :unsure:

K2

I agree @-K2- and that is essentially the go with this character. She starts of trying very hard to be something she is not and ends up settling on a rather different trajectory.

If I could get away from promotion and marketing on the 17 books I have out there, I might just have time to start another WIP. Now I'm winning multiple contests and this has distracted me to no end. I'm looking for relief and some down time so I can let my imagination wander instead of strategizing and doing math and filling out endless forms.

Gosh, that sounds daunting. Doesn't seem like there's much joy to be had even when one does end up getting one's novels finished and out there!

If I knew of such a program, I'd be too busy selling it to hang out here. Or too busy using it. One of the two.

I would add that only letting in secondary characters that have some contrast to the others is a good tip for efficiency though.

Yes, agreed @The Big Peat. I had three characters in one act that were all quite similar in their outlook and abrasiveness. Whilst that did naturally fit who they were, there are some fairly organic reasons that have arisen for why they perhaps don't start off that way.
 
Yeah, I think your experience is par for the course. For me, many of my ideas start with something I like elsewhere, that I then twist, subvert, alter, and modify repeatedly until it's basically unrecognizable. Unfortunately, it just takes time. Fortunately, it takes time, and can be rather fun if you allow it to be.
 
All part of the process.
I had a main character who I had pretty much figured out, but the story was struggling along. It didn't click until I moved the story way ahead and put the character in a mind boggling position where they had to examine their self to reaffirm what I already knew. That was when things got interesting.
 
Character arcs are one of my weaknesses, and my stories often don't have one in the first draft or two. Even when I think I develop a good character arc, they're probably not implemented very well.

I inserted the main character arc into a story I'd otherwise mostly finished last week. Then realised the character arc seems completely at odds with my story. Half the planet's population (almost inevitably) dies in my final scene, yet this character arc is the PoV finally being able to talk about the death of their mum and dad that happened a couple of years previous to my story's start (and on a different planet, Earth).

I do think leaving a story for some time helps us see things in a different way. I'm in the process of editing every story I've considered submitting for publication, and I think I've made them all better. Some changes I've made seem obvious with hindsight.
 
I have to admit with Alex, above, that it takes me awhile to flesh out a character and it's not done all at once. I'll develop the character over several editing passes, always adding something that dovetails into the plot somehow. Characterization is one of my weak points and I have only recently written what many reviewers are calling character driven pieces. I'd always been plot-driven, to excess in many cases. That left me with cardboard on stage, just walking through their lines.
 
I have to admit with Alex, above, that it takes me awhile to flesh out a character and it's not done all at once. I'll develop the character over several editing passes, always adding something that dovetails into the plot somehow. Characterization is one of my weak points and I have only recently written what many reviewers are calling character driven pieces. I'd always been plot-driven, to excess in many cases. That left me with cardboard on stage, just walking through their lines.
It's reassuring to hear so many other people in the same boat.
 
I don't know who my characters are until I start writing, so for me it's just a case of popping someone into the story and seeing what they do. I edit frequently and go back and perform major edits at each quarter point of a novel, so I sculpture each character into what is required. The aim is end up with a work in which it's impossible to tell which element came first.

For me, writing a novel is a bit like the old joke that asks, how do you make a statue of an elephant? You get a great big lump of stone and chip away all the bits that don't look like an elephant.
 
All. The. Time.

I blame my muse who perpetually, perversely enjoys playing hide and seek with the ideas I need. Some she hides for days, some for years... My way round confusing her, so she reveals what I need, is to write 2 books at the same time, going from one to the other. Or 3, as present case shows. Doesn't always work, but I find writing about character B book B, or character C, book C will often reveal what I want in Character A, book A.
 
I have a lot of characters walking around in my head but the protagonist in my current wip is very much made by the story. I have to agree with @K2- she loses everything she has been working towards so it's an extreme version of the arc she's most suitable to
 
I'm surely not the only one infuriated by my own lack of foresight with respect to character choices am I? I have well established characters that have been around for a while (in my head at least) but I can't seem to organically conceive the right behaviors and development arcs for them the first time round.

Just today, I arrived at the absolute perfect arc for a key character on what is, essentially, my 4th attempt at writing them. It's so bloody obvious in hindsight that this is how I should have written her from the start. There is now far more intrigue, potential for conflict & character interplay, not to mention contrast with some other characters who she might otherwise have been too similar to in terms of personality and outlook.



Hi @BT Jones, let's see how we can help you.
But it is for this same reason that I always say that the very story of a novel or a story is the only element, at least the first, I clarify in passing before I am be shot, on which one should concentrate; not the characters and not the arcs for those characters; to privilege or give more importance to that instead of wondering at all times what kind of story is being told is to misunderstand the whole process. The characters are just vehicles, instruments that you use to tell your story. They are the only element, moreover, by which you can make the reader feel reflected with one of these characters, often with the MC. But they are not the most important thing. Someone who gives more importance to that is actually trying more to sell a product than telling a story; he is thinking more about a YA market, for example, than really worried about what he's counting on. It is very easy to detect, by simply reading, that commercial intention. The winks that are intended to entice the reader are embarrassingly obvious: often the MC is a boy or a girl predestined to accomplish a great feat. Therefore, he is a chosen one, although he does not know it, or he has some gift such as the force, or abilities for magic, since he is the son of magicians, or abilities to pilot combat fighters, because is the daughter of a pilot, or for last she is a good with the bow; therefore she is a hunter, it has an unmistakably aggressive component that predisposes it to adventure. Of course, they are all very smart and handsome (perhaps the only exception is Miles Vorkosigan, whose short stature is presented as a sign of physical deficiency that he must overcome), but at the same time most of them are surrounded by a whole court of evil, foolish and incomprehensible characters whose objective, of course, is none other than to serve as a mere excuse (by the author, of course, always attentive to getting the reader's identification) to highlight the many virtues of the protagonists and leave very clear that they are absolutely great and the rest are heavy and some of the worst that there is. Except their friends, of course.

But look at Borges' stories, for example. There is almost no dialogue. The characters, when they exist, are barely outlined. But instead, there is such an astonishing amount of descriptive details and strange elements that when you finish reading one of his stories you discover that for an hour you moved to another completely different world and that Borges, in effect, led you through a portal, made you cross the mirror and you without ever wondering about the aforementioned characters. I remember reading someone out there who said that it was not necessary to describe a jungle because we are all supposed to know what a jungle is like. One would have to wonder what Borges would answer to that. Because he even turns a log into a narrative element. It is not just any log, of course, as a god leaned on it, pausing on his way to face another god in an epic and terrifying battle. In other words, Borges is always telling you a story; it doesn't give a damn to tell you what a character is like; let's not say that something happens precisely, about the arguments or the arcs. In fact, regarding the descriptions, Borges invented the so-called "lists", and Bolaño later transformed that into the very pulp of his narrative, lists and more lists, endless lists, lists of books and of criticisms of those books, of writers and people, lists of drinks and cities, lists of beers and tequilas and, yes, lists of lies, because they are all lists of false things, all the literature a spell, the trick of a magician. Although it happens, of course, that Borges and Bolaño are excellent liars, they talk to you with a whiskey in hand; well, Bolaño would probably have a mezcal. But with the same smile Bolaño would propose you a contest, to see if you can find a single dialogue in any of his books.
In the same way, his characters are as illusory and vague as his stories. But as soon as you look at him you know that he sold you the whole story and that you believed him absolutely everything. You just start to wish that with that same smile he won't ask you to also lend him money. Because with that tremendous ability to loot and shear the reader, you already know that you could not refuse. So, every writer, at least the good ones, and those two are damned good, has something of a trickster and gypsy, is an artist of the rambling. You know they are lying to you, that they are just giving you a long plane ride, but you have no choice but to listen to them. They surround you with the same magic and charm of that bar old man that hypnotizes you like a snake, and that traps you and offers you no other escape except when you reach the end of the story. Of course, in these there are plot and arc, but in the end you realize that it was the least important, because all the time they only made you enjoy the ride, what they told you about that jungle that from the height of that plane to you were just a green stain, and yet all the details they gave you made you feel like you were a helpless native down there.
Now, in terms of paragraph length or chapter length, parodying the expression, "I don't even tell you": Borges turns the paragraph into magic without respite; Bolaño, in fact, is the king of the long paragraph: pages and pages and more pages in such a way that it simply takes your breath away. But does it matter? Total, you already accepted the deal, you already got on the plane.

So my dear BT, if you want to learn to lie ... sorry, I mean, to tell stories, first of all you must become a complete trickster and con artist. In fact, it's something we should all ask ourselves: how capable are we to tell someone a story in a bar? It's a skill that obviously requires a great deal of improvisation to visualize details and convey them at the speed of light; besides, you have to be convincing and elegant, and even though men naturally approach me for more than obvious reasons, I usually end up wrapping them in my spider web. Besides, as a girl I already had that talent: there was always other girl or a child listening to me absorbed while I was telling their something.
But literature, deep down, is not very far from that. :giggle:
 
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Hi @BT Jones, let's see how we can help you.
But it is for this same reason that I always say that the very story of a novel or a story is the only element, at least the first, I clarify in passing before I am be shot, on which one should concentrate; not the characters and not the arcs for those characters; to privilege or give more importance to that instead of wondering at all times what kind of story is being told is to misunderstand the whole process. The characters are just vehicles, instruments that you use to tell your story. They are the only element, moreover, by which you can make the reader feel reflected with one of these characters, often with the MC. But they are not the most important thing. Someone who gives more importance to that is actually trying more to sell a product than telling a story; he is thinking more about a YA market, for example, than really worried about what he's counting on. It is very easy to detect, by simply reading, that commercial intention. The winks that are intended to entice the reader are embarrassingly obvious: often the MC is a boy or a girl predestined to accomplish a great feat. Therefore, he is a chosen one, although he does not know it, or he has some gift such as the force, or abilities for magic, since he is the son of magicians, or abilities to pilot combat fighters, because is the daughter of a pilot, or for last she is a good with the bow; therefore she is a hunter, it has an unmistakably aggressive component that predisposes it to adventure. Of course, they are all very smart and handsome (perhaps the only exception is Miles Vorkosigan, whose short stature is presented as a sign of physical deficiency that he must overcome), but at the same time most of them are surrounded by a whole court of evil, foolish and incomprehensible characters whose objective, of course, is none other than to serve as a mere excuse (by the author, of course, always attentive to getting the reader's identification) to highlight the many virtues of the protagonists and leave very clear that they are absolutely great and the rest are heavy and some of the worst that there is. Except their friends, of course.

But look at Borges' stories, for example. There is almost no dialogue. The characters, when they exist, are barely outlined. But instead, there is such an astonishing amount of descriptive details and strange elements that when you finish reading one of his stories you discover that for an hour you moved to another completely different world and that Borges, in effect, led you through a portal, made you cross the mirror and you without ever wondering about the aforementioned characters. I remember reading someone out there who said that it was not necessary to describe a jungle because we are all supposed to know what a jungle is like. One would have to wonder what Borges would answer to that. Because he even turns a log into a narrative element. It is not just any log, of course, as a god leaned on it, pausing on his way to face another god in an epic and terrifying battle. In other words, Borges is always telling you a story; it doesn't give a damn to tell you what a character is like; let's not say that something happens precisely, about the arguments or the arcs. In fact, regarding the descriptions, Borges invented the so-called "lists", and Bolaño later transformed that into the very pulp of his narrative, lists and more lists, endless lists, lists of books and of criticisms of those books, of writers and people, lists of drinks and cities, lists of beers and tequilas and, yes, lists of lies, because they are all lists of false things, all the literature a spell, the trick of a magician. Although it happens, of course, that Borges and Bolaño are excellent liars, they talk to you with a whiskey in hand; well, Bolaño would probably have a mezcal. But with the same smile Bolaño would propose you a contest, to see if you can find a single dialogue in any of his books.
In the same way, his characters are as illusory and vague as his stories. But as soon as you look at him you know that he sold you the whole story and that you believed him absolutely everything. You just start to wish that with that same smile he won't ask you to also lend him money. Because with that tremendous ability to loot and shear the reader, you already know that you could not refuse. So, every writer, at least the good ones, and those two are damned good, has something of a trickster and gypsy, is an artist of the rambling. You know they are lying to you, that they are just giving you a long plane ride, but you have no choice but to listen to them. They surround you with the same magic and charm of that bar old man that hypnotizes you like a snake, and that traps you and offers you no other escape except when you reach the end of the story. Of course, in these there are plot and arc, but in the end you realize that it was the least important, because all the time they only made you enjoy the ride, what they told you about that jungle that from the height of that plane to you were just a green stain, and yet all the details they gave you made you feel like you were a helpless native down there.
Now, in terms of paragraph length or chapter length, parodying the expression, "I don't even tell you": Borges turns the paragraph into magic without respite; Bolaño, in fact, is the king of the long paragraph: pages and pages and more pages in such a way that it simply takes your breath away. But does it matter? Total, you already accepted the deal, you already got on the plane.

So my dear BT, if you want to learn to lie ... sorry, I mean, to tell stories, first of all you must become a complete trickster and con artist. In fact, it's something we should all ask ourselves: how capable are we to tell someone a story in a bar? It's a skill that obviously requires a great deal of improvisation to visualize details and convey them at the speed of light; besides, you have to be convincing and elegant, and even though men naturally approach me for more than obvious reasons, I usually end up wrapping them in my spider web. Besides, as a girl I already had that talent: there was always other girl or a child listening to me absorbed while I was telling their something.
But literature, deep down, is not very far from that. :giggle:
Thanks @DLCroix. Somehow I pictured you with a whiskey in hand as well why you were telling me YOUR story! :giggle:

Yes, I guess harnessing the creative process is more than half the battle. I just wish I knew how to extract exactly what I want from myself first before dabbing my pen in the inkwell. On the one hand, it would save me a lot of time with rewrites knowing exactly what I wanted ALL my characters to be from the beginning. On the other hand, if I knew what they were, I might not be able to write them as well as they do when THEY tell me who THEY are.
 
Thanks @DLCroix. Somehow I pictured you with a whiskey in hand as well why you were telling me YOUR story! :giggle:

Yes, I guess harnessing the creative process is more than half the battle. I just wish I knew how to extract exactly what I want from myself first before dabbing my pen in the inkwell. On the one hand, it would save me a lot of time with rewrites knowing exactly what I wanted ALL my characters to be from the beginning. On the other hand, if I knew what they were, I might not be able to write them as well as they do when THEY tell me who THEY are.

Well, I can think of some solutions to that narrative indecision problem.
1. Get out of the loop.
Remember the Cartesian method, from easiest to hardest. This means that, before insisting on that loop that has you trapped, perhaps you should try writing some shorter stories instead of a novel, which will help you let go of your hand. It obviously uses the same characters.

2. Simplify.
A situation, a solution. Forget about the arc because it is clear that you still do not have experience with plots and even less with plot twists, plot surprises, premises or ellipsis. That is why you get confused.

3. Attack the elements separately.
If they are on a space ship, write what you can think of about that ship. If they have an amnesia problem, write down why the amnesia occurred. Sleep pods are also another item to consider. How long were they in suspension? Why? What direction where are they now? Are there more crew on that space ship?

4. Clears up confusion about POVs.
Usually the stories of any kind are, or in first POV, or in Omni POV. There is a third case, 2nd POV, in which the narrator addresses the reader. But yours is omni. Not to mention more. Nothing from a third party near or far or farther or ultra farthest. Either the story is told by the girl from a first POV or you tell it from an omni. Point.
 
@paranoid marvin said:
I think the OP sums up the reason why sometimes when you're stuck, just write; and before you know it inspiration will strike.
There's no substitute for getting some words down. I nearly always find that character details, features, back story, just happen as I write about them. For me, the best way to get to know them is to write their dialogue. As they speak, I begin to imagine how they think, and why, and so on.
 

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