Star Trek - Discovery - 3.04: Forget Me Not
- Thread starter ctg
- Start date
ctg
weaver of the unseen
- Joined
- Aug 21, 2007
- Messages
- 9,829
The doctor claimed that Discovery's crew are all overachievers. It must be hard to be in such a group, because they're all competing with each other, with no one really accepting the reality. That they are all alone. What was in the past is shattered and what is in the future is unknown.
It's just you'd think that like the gigantic vessel holding the AI data would have been done by the Federation to conserve the accumulated information from the past. But they haven't. I really doubt that the Discovery got the latest software patches when it visited Earth.
All the knowledge is in Adira's head. The symbiote is the hope instead of doing some major data harvesting and updating their knowledge on the current situation.
I know that it is super boring, because it's hard to transfer the operation into the small screen, but all I'm saying is that not all the hope is in one basket (a symbiote in this case). But seriously you'd also believe that someone on Earth would have the address for the Federation HQ.
The fact that Saru went to tell Mr Stamets "There has been nine hundred thirty two years of technological advancement..." suggests that someone should have the address and answers to problems they have in the ship. It's just the spore drive in unique and the tmycinial network might not be exactly willing on accepting a mechanical or a digital interface.
So what they need is a biomechanical interface that anyone can use. But the only solution is organic. Just like it is with the case of the Trill symbiote. What intrigues me is that for the first time Adira might have not changed as the others were, when the connection was made with the original Trill hosts.
If I remember correctly from DS9 the hosts gave up their personality and everything to be in the connection with the superior being.
I loved that the conservative Trill went bananas. "We need to separate the two..." instead of finding it fascinating that something they had tried for two thousand years had finally happened. What also intrigues me that there's no Vulcan's aboard that could have tried a mind-melt with Adira to find out if they can access the symbiote.
Well, without choices people do what they can and I'm glad Michael doesn't have her moral compass set on the Federation standard protocols. It is as if from the very first moment we saw her she has set an example of being one of those inviduals who are the brightest burning stars in the Federation. Past examples include Cpt Kirk, Spock and the Doctor from Voyager.
They all broke the wall and set their own paths to become icons of the Federation history.
I get that putting Adira in the pool is a risk. Anything can happen and things can go horribly wrong. But in the other hand, if you don't do it, you will never know. And instead of accepting the reality you might end doing something that might end it.
It is kind of strange that Saru didn't had a clue about the R&R even though it has been a standard protocol in the navies since forever. There are numerous episodes in the Next Generation where Picard's crew ended in some paradise to have fun.
Then again, they don't have a holodeck or holograms for that matter, even if the new technology keeps bringing holograms in places, where there are no projectors. They don't even have a bar. Just protocols and their own ways to keep up on their individualism.
Yet, somehow Saru managed to include the history of R&R in his speech. Then it all went down from there and the whole dinner turned out to be a macabre comedy. Empress Georgiou starting by stabbing a piece of meat
Oh man, if all dinners were this funny they wouldn't have a problem on moral. In fact, by the time Georgiou did her thing, Saru should have sighed, sat down and ordered the computer to produce a bottle of vodka.
I mean the evidence is before his eyes. He has a crew that is super diverse. You look at normal submarine crews and they're all mostly like minded people. There isn't a great amount of diversity among them. What they have is by what the individual persons bring in the game.
Saru, in the other hand has the problem of super diversity and to be frank, there's no fixing it. So my suggestion is breaking out the vodka as soon as possible. Let the crew be crew and if there is something that needs to be said it should come out.
The Great Admiral Adama had his booze, and he allowed Ty to build a boxing ring. He allowed crews to vent out their frustrations, even bunch it out occasionally, while he held the last word on the subject matter. It was his rule, only.
But Saru isn't Adama even though he should have some sort of idea about what is what and what he can do since he went through the commanding school in the Academy. To me Saru is at the centre of the crisis and the Empress in his opposite, his XO.
If he would be super smart, he would choose Georgiou to be 'the Hand' and let her to do major of the work on keeping the crew in check. His softness doesn't have room in the ship, if he wants to keep it together. Cpt Kirk would have given a bollocking when needed.
Saru isn't capable of doing such thing.
Did Michael ever do mind melts with her family?
I know we got one instance of her connecting with her father, Sarek and that was in the meditative state. So is it possible that she was the only choice to understand what was happening with Adira and the Symbiote.
The whole scene with the memories were so beautiful. It made me cry. I too have a problem with painful memories. And it's not easy to access them. It's far easier to forget them.
It's just you'd think that like the gigantic vessel holding the AI data would have been done by the Federation to conserve the accumulated information from the past. But they haven't. I really doubt that the Discovery got the latest software patches when it visited Earth.
All the knowledge is in Adira's head. The symbiote is the hope instead of doing some major data harvesting and updating their knowledge on the current situation.
I know that it is super boring, because it's hard to transfer the operation into the small screen, but all I'm saying is that not all the hope is in one basket (a symbiote in this case). But seriously you'd also believe that someone on Earth would have the address for the Federation HQ.
The fact that Saru went to tell Mr Stamets "There has been nine hundred thirty two years of technological advancement..." suggests that someone should have the address and answers to problems they have in the ship. It's just the spore drive in unique and the tmycinial network might not be exactly willing on accepting a mechanical or a digital interface.
So what they need is a biomechanical interface that anyone can use. But the only solution is organic. Just like it is with the case of the Trill symbiote. What intrigues me is that for the first time Adira might have not changed as the others were, when the connection was made with the original Trill hosts.
If I remember correctly from DS9 the hosts gave up their personality and everything to be in the connection with the superior being.
I loved that the conservative Trill went bananas. "We need to separate the two..." instead of finding it fascinating that something they had tried for two thousand years had finally happened. What also intrigues me that there's no Vulcan's aboard that could have tried a mind-melt with Adira to find out if they can access the symbiote.
Well, without choices people do what they can and I'm glad Michael doesn't have her moral compass set on the Federation standard protocols. It is as if from the very first moment we saw her she has set an example of being one of those inviduals who are the brightest burning stars in the Federation. Past examples include Cpt Kirk, Spock and the Doctor from Voyager.
They all broke the wall and set their own paths to become icons of the Federation history.
I get that putting Adira in the pool is a risk. Anything can happen and things can go horribly wrong. But in the other hand, if you don't do it, you will never know. And instead of accepting the reality you might end doing something that might end it.
It is kind of strange that Saru didn't had a clue about the R&R even though it has been a standard protocol in the navies since forever. There are numerous episodes in the Next Generation where Picard's crew ended in some paradise to have fun.
Then again, they don't have a holodeck or holograms for that matter, even if the new technology keeps bringing holograms in places, where there are no projectors. They don't even have a bar. Just protocols and their own ways to keep up on their individualism.
Yet, somehow Saru managed to include the history of R&R in his speech. Then it all went down from there and the whole dinner turned out to be a macabre comedy. Empress Georgiou starting by stabbing a piece of meat
Oh man, if all dinners were this funny they wouldn't have a problem on moral. In fact, by the time Georgiou did her thing, Saru should have sighed, sat down and ordered the computer to produce a bottle of vodka.
I mean the evidence is before his eyes. He has a crew that is super diverse. You look at normal submarine crews and they're all mostly like minded people. There isn't a great amount of diversity among them. What they have is by what the individual persons bring in the game.
Saru, in the other hand has the problem of super diversity and to be frank, there's no fixing it. So my suggestion is breaking out the vodka as soon as possible. Let the crew be crew and if there is something that needs to be said it should come out.
The Great Admiral Adama had his booze, and he allowed Ty to build a boxing ring. He allowed crews to vent out their frustrations, even bunch it out occasionally, while he held the last word on the subject matter. It was his rule, only.
But Saru isn't Adama even though he should have some sort of idea about what is what and what he can do since he went through the commanding school in the Academy. To me Saru is at the centre of the crisis and the Empress in his opposite, his XO.
If he would be super smart, he would choose Georgiou to be 'the Hand' and let her to do major of the work on keeping the crew in check. His softness doesn't have room in the ship, if he wants to keep it together. Cpt Kirk would have given a bollocking when needed.
Saru isn't capable of doing such thing.
Did Michael ever do mind melts with her family?
I know we got one instance of her connecting with her father, Sarek and that was in the meditative state. So is it possible that she was the only choice to understand what was happening with Adira and the Symbiote.
The whole scene with the memories were so beautiful. It made me cry. I too have a problem with painful memories. And it's not easy to access them. It's far easier to forget them.
The writhing tendrils in the Trill mind pool, while visually stunning, went on a little too long for me. I loved the element of the crew bonding together family-style -- warts and all.
I wondered how Michael was so much more knowledgeable about what needed to be done in the mind pool than the person who was actually hosting the symbiont. I think having a symbiont with all-host knowledge on tap will be a big plus for the Discovery crew, well beyond getting the coordinates for Starfleet HQ.
What Discovery discovery will be revealed on arrival, considering that everyone they've encountered thus far has seemed amazed that Starfleet still exists? My guess is that Starfleet will be more in need of Discovery, with its spore drive, than Discovery will benefit from the reunion.
I wondered how Michael was so much more knowledgeable about what needed to be done in the mind pool than the person who was actually hosting the symbiont. I think having a symbiont with all-host knowledge on tap will be a big plus for the Discovery crew, well beyond getting the coordinates for Starfleet HQ.
What Discovery discovery will be revealed on arrival, considering that everyone they've encountered thus far has seemed amazed that Starfleet still exists? My guess is that Starfleet will be more in need of Discovery, with its spore drive, than Discovery will benefit from the reunion.
ctg
weaver of the unseen
- Joined
- Aug 21, 2007
- Messages
- 9,829
Yeah. I agree. Discovery is the last ship.
I found this episode a little slow. it was important to address their PTSD but it doesn't make great TV.
Yes, after a while I thought (looking at my watch) they've only reached the second last host. We could have 2000 years of earlier hosts yet. How long will this take?
You'd think so, but I think the excuse was that the Federation deliberately went into hiding. So, rather than looking for "Federation HQ", they are instead looking for "Alliance Rebel Base on Hoth."
That's a good call. I didn't see that, but it is definiately the way the plot is turning.
Again, a good call.
Probably, but I think you are thinking too much on this. Michael is not Vulcan and we saw no Vulcans or telepaths aboard the Discovery since Spock left.
Often, Saru seems to be well behind the curve on many things. I don't know if they are deliberately writing him as guileless and naïve, but that is the way he comes over.
Alexa
traveller space dreamer
I don't like this history of symbiote and Trill people. It remindes me of Goa'uld and SG-1.
Not sure why adding Adira to the crew will be a benefit for Discovery other than more diversity to deal with for Saru.
Not sure why adding Adira to the crew will be a benefit for Discovery other than more diversity to deal with for Saru.
ctg
weaver of the unseen
- Joined
- Aug 21, 2007
- Messages
- 9,829
Exactly, but I think it's not who she is but what she knows, because the admiral in her is the key to a great deal of knowledge that they would have to get otherwise.
I think this is deliberate.
It takes time to grow into an unanticipated leadership role. Saru has the added burdens of understanding multiple cultures and keeping a handle on Georgiou. In time, I anticipate that he will be depicted as a respectable and inspirational leader.
I reserve the right to change my mind if he suddenly starts wearing a red shirt.
AE35Unit
]==[]===O °
I can't help thinking that there's a story coming centred on Detmer.
I believe, as far as I remember, that they were depicted in a similar way in DS9; very xenophobic, militant, protective. However, that matriarchal Trill figure, to me, looked like an exact copy of the matriarchal Earth Defence leader met last last week; very bellicose to start off, and then very suddenly, all sweetness and nice, and it just seemed odd that everyone they meet has this same attitude towards them. They also didn't explain why the are so few Trill left that there are more symbionts than Trill. That doesn't seem to make any sense.
And for why they need her, their Wikipedia database is 900 years out of date and no one communicates any more or has knowledge of the fate of the Federation except for the symbiont's memories from the Admiral. That has to be useful information.
Gosh, it is a long time coming though, isn't it? Do you think we will find out before the end of this season?
Narkalui
Nerf Herder
I also thought this episode was a bit slow. Apart from a bit of back story and character building for the new character, all we really got was "now we know how to find Star Fleet HQ"
ctg
weaver of the unseen
- Joined
- Aug 21, 2007
- Messages
- 9,829
And that the Sphere Data is alive in the ship and it's acting like an AI. A free, unrestricted general AI.
Narkalui
Nerf Herder
Ooh yeah! That bit was really cool! When the computer display changed while Saru's back was turned it reminded me of The Impossible Planet (Doctor Who) and I was thinking "Saru, don't turn on the auto-pilot!"
Narkalui
Nerf Herder
A few more questions have occurred to me:
Has no one since The Burn thought to experiment with a quantum singularity reactor?
What are the Romulans up to? Have some of them found Logic and unified with the Vulcans? Have they found a new homeworld?
What about the Klingons?
And the Cardassians?
Has no one since The Burn thought to experiment with a quantum singularity reactor?
What are the Romulans up to? Have some of them found Logic and unified with the Vulcans? Have they found a new homeworld?
What about the Klingons?
And the Cardassians?
There were loads of other powers out there; many that we didn't get along with too well (Gorn, Tholian, Tzenkethi) but after 900 years and "The Burn" who knows? It does seem odd that all civilisations fell at the very same time, and that no alternative technological development took place, because that does not happen historically. It isn't as if all Dilithium stopped working everywhere either - there are some rare crystals left for sale - the USS Discovery's supply didn't also go "poof!" when they arrived - so one would have to assume that there would be some distant corner of the galaxy where "The Burn" didn't take place.
AE35Unit
]==[]===O °
What about the Breen? Or the Borg?
All of these unanswered questions are a good thing. The writers have a real bonanza of stories to tell.
Similar threads
-
-
Star Trek - Discovery - 04.01: Kobayashi Maru
- Started by REBerg
- Replies: 1
-
Star Trek - Discovery - 3.13: That Hope Is You, Part 2- Started by Dave
- Replies: 14
-
Star Trek - Discovery - 3.12: There is a Tide...
- Started by Dave
- Replies: 12
-