The Expanse - 5.05: Down and Out
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ctg
weaver of the unseen
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So, the bomb has exploded and everyone's pointing fingers or feeling guilty in the aftermath of rocks coming down. What surprised me is that "they were dancing and celebrating in the halls of Ceres and Pallas" all while the political cream were making deals behind the curtains.
I get that Drummer had Marco's literally locked in the airlock and that in the hindsight she could have prevented the orbital bombardment. But the hindsight is not same as 20/20. Some other geezer could have risen from the ashes and done the same thing. After all it was all thanks to the Martian greed that Marco's was able to penetrate Earth's defences.
You recently saw this same exact thing happening in the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict. The technology was there and it provided the edge to beat down Azers. But you also have to remember at the same time that in the Expanse universe Earth is not very far behind Mars and it still holds many of the brightest minds. After all it is the cradle of humanity.
What they are doing in the aftermath is also part of the humanity, the celebrations, feeling guilty, anxious, or even boiling at the edge of rage. It's all a sum of what it means to be human. The other two races, the Creators and the Protomolecule People, they are different and to them, the destruction and the toll is norm ... as far as we know it.
There was a very little Drummer could have done but to accept Marco's invitation. We know that she's acting as a pirate queen and that she know there's no trust in her crew. After all they are pirates and the mutiny is always an option.
So, for holding the cards close to her chest there was no other choice. It is just that in her shoes I wouldn't really trust the new love, it smells too much like a honey trap. Oksana is too convinietly placing herself as Drummer's XO, her advisor to be trusted when you cannot trust anyone.
It is also interesting that Drummer has not armed herself. Not visibly, even though in her position the Pirate Queen should be showing force to her crew. They are in a war with the inners thanks to Marco's actions. Therefore, by using that analogue she could use it make her position.
How is she going to find out whose loyal to her ideals and actions?
I am still betting on the Little Amos leading the action. It doesn't make sense for Amos to personally visit Clarissa in the prison and I bet the guards were also expecting him to commit to some level of activity for getting in the cell, unsupervised. All while Mao's daughter was drugged to her eyeballs.
Don't read me wrong. Amos is not kind of man that would use spike to do the deed. He would punish those people, but we are talking about a prison and visitations, especially from the old flames and not the family.
What surprised me was that the guard was carrying a firearm and not a baton. Maybe the times has really changed in the Expanse universe, but normally carrying arms in the prison facility is frowned upon idea. The riot situation is different, but when you really think about it, giving the inmates so easy access is simply a big no.
If an inmate and in their cases the cyborg would have overpowered one, he would have become an immediate threat to everyone. That's why you keep the arms under the lock and key. Now, as they gave him a purpose, he felt useful instead of being locked in his cell. Win - win for everyone, and in the guards shoes I would have put the arms in the level armoury, biometric lock or not.
I loved that they showed that the guns are tools, just like cybernetic implants. I also cannot blame AMZ production team for not being able to make the implants more convincing. We are still in baby shoes with the whole technology, but it wasn't a bad effort either, Konecheck is brilliant and I absolutely loved that Amos named him Tiny.
In fact Tiny clearly understood his position, even the action as all the guards were eventually expandable. There was no need for them. Not as long as they got moving and there was always a plan B.
What I don't get is why there wasn't a guard rail attached to the ladders, when it should been needed for the maintenance action. Attaching to it would have been doable even with what they got and it would have saved lives.
Why did Tiny go mental at the topside?
I really like these shuttle car scenes. They are so SF and they fit the over all scenery so well. Well done AMZ.
It was clear to me that after Fred's death the station has a leadership problem and the only man to replace Mister Johnson was Holden. The man who had faced the Ring, the Creators, the Protomolecule, the Atom bombs, threats from the Inners and the Aliens. The man who had survived all the cataclysmic actions without taking a hit or losing one person in his crew.
Against the Butcher he is the only choice the Tycho station has. In fact, when he said, "I'm going to take Roci out for a hunt," Fred's XO didn't complain about the prices or anything. It was all accepted, approved and no questions asked.
Bobby is getting smarter on reading the game as she connected the arms dealers to the Earth action straight away. And she also denied Alex's request on joining Holden's hunt. The Razorback is the ace-in-the-sleeve and there's not much that can match her speed if the situation gets suddenly hot. She has pure speed running in her veins, pumping through her state-of-the-art fusion reactor.
I loved that they brought up the Hungerian Group. It is an actual item in the Belt catalogue. Alex understands the nature, but he almost always needs someone else input, and in this case, Bobby made the right call by ordering him to take Razorback in the place. If they need to run, they can do it. No need for guns. Shooting is the last thing you want to get involved with when you're hunting the pirates and the arms dealers.
It was not a surprise that Alex and Bobby found the pirate crew, the core of Marco's operations. The fleet responded correctly, by splitting a group and sending out a destroyer, only in their shoes I would have kept launching missiles. Razorback can do more than what one one torp can handle.
What I don't get is how that torpedo was able to accelerate so fast?
In Marco's shoes I would have put the ex in chains and in a cell with no electronics. Nothing but a closet and the essential. In fact in his shoes the best course of action would have been sending Naomi back through the back channels and not keep her in the capital ship. In fact, for knowing her past and even for been her lover, Marco should have a knowledge of what Naomi's capable of doing when she wants to.
The intriguing bit is that the boy has inherited father's brilliance and mother's ingeniousness. Only thing is that he is so easily manipulated with partials, with words and actions that it makes him blind for seeing the bigger picture.
I cannot think anything more frustrating thing than waiting a response after making a major attack. It is nerve wrecking and the boy is not wise. He is just a boy. Not a man despite whatever he has done.
By allowing Naomi to poison to crew with her hatred on Marco's actions isn't the way to go. I trust that she will find a way or several to sabotage the action, the ship and find a way off the ship.
I get that Drummer had Marco's literally locked in the airlock and that in the hindsight she could have prevented the orbital bombardment. But the hindsight is not same as 20/20. Some other geezer could have risen from the ashes and done the same thing. After all it was all thanks to the Martian greed that Marco's was able to penetrate Earth's defences.
You recently saw this same exact thing happening in the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict. The technology was there and it provided the edge to beat down Azers. But you also have to remember at the same time that in the Expanse universe Earth is not very far behind Mars and it still holds many of the brightest minds. After all it is the cradle of humanity.
What they are doing in the aftermath is also part of the humanity, the celebrations, feeling guilty, anxious, or even boiling at the edge of rage. It's all a sum of what it means to be human. The other two races, the Creators and the Protomolecule People, they are different and to them, the destruction and the toll is norm ... as far as we know it.
There was a very little Drummer could have done but to accept Marco's invitation. We know that she's acting as a pirate queen and that she know there's no trust in her crew. After all they are pirates and the mutiny is always an option.
So, for holding the cards close to her chest there was no other choice. It is just that in her shoes I wouldn't really trust the new love, it smells too much like a honey trap. Oksana is too convinietly placing herself as Drummer's XO, her advisor to be trusted when you cannot trust anyone.
It is also interesting that Drummer has not armed herself. Not visibly, even though in her position the Pirate Queen should be showing force to her crew. They are in a war with the inners thanks to Marco's actions. Therefore, by using that analogue she could use it make her position.
How is she going to find out whose loyal to her ideals and actions?
I am still betting on the Little Amos leading the action. It doesn't make sense for Amos to personally visit Clarissa in the prison and I bet the guards were also expecting him to commit to some level of activity for getting in the cell, unsupervised. All while Mao's daughter was drugged to her eyeballs.
Don't read me wrong. Amos is not kind of man that would use spike to do the deed. He would punish those people, but we are talking about a prison and visitations, especially from the old flames and not the family.
What surprised me was that the guard was carrying a firearm and not a baton. Maybe the times has really changed in the Expanse universe, but normally carrying arms in the prison facility is frowned upon idea. The riot situation is different, but when you really think about it, giving the inmates so easy access is simply a big no.
If an inmate and in their cases the cyborg would have overpowered one, he would have become an immediate threat to everyone. That's why you keep the arms under the lock and key. Now, as they gave him a purpose, he felt useful instead of being locked in his cell. Win - win for everyone, and in the guards shoes I would have put the arms in the level armoury, biometric lock or not.
I loved that they showed that the guns are tools, just like cybernetic implants. I also cannot blame AMZ production team for not being able to make the implants more convincing. We are still in baby shoes with the whole technology, but it wasn't a bad effort either, Konecheck is brilliant and I absolutely loved that Amos named him Tiny.
In fact Tiny clearly understood his position, even the action as all the guards were eventually expandable. There was no need for them. Not as long as they got moving and there was always a plan B.
What I don't get is why there wasn't a guard rail attached to the ladders, when it should been needed for the maintenance action. Attaching to it would have been doable even with what they got and it would have saved lives.
Why did Tiny go mental at the topside?
I really like these shuttle car scenes. They are so SF and they fit the over all scenery so well. Well done AMZ.
It was clear to me that after Fred's death the station has a leadership problem and the only man to replace Mister Johnson was Holden. The man who had faced the Ring, the Creators, the Protomolecule, the Atom bombs, threats from the Inners and the Aliens. The man who had survived all the cataclysmic actions without taking a hit or losing one person in his crew.
Against the Butcher he is the only choice the Tycho station has. In fact, when he said, "I'm going to take Roci out for a hunt," Fred's XO didn't complain about the prices or anything. It was all accepted, approved and no questions asked.
Bobby is getting smarter on reading the game as she connected the arms dealers to the Earth action straight away. And she also denied Alex's request on joining Holden's hunt. The Razorback is the ace-in-the-sleeve and there's not much that can match her speed if the situation gets suddenly hot. She has pure speed running in her veins, pumping through her state-of-the-art fusion reactor.
I loved that they brought up the Hungerian Group. It is an actual item in the Belt catalogue. Alex understands the nature, but he almost always needs someone else input, and in this case, Bobby made the right call by ordering him to take Razorback in the place. If they need to run, they can do it. No need for guns. Shooting is the last thing you want to get involved with when you're hunting the pirates and the arms dealers.
It was not a surprise that Alex and Bobby found the pirate crew, the core of Marco's operations. The fleet responded correctly, by splitting a group and sending out a destroyer, only in their shoes I would have kept launching missiles. Razorback can do more than what one one torp can handle.
What I don't get is how that torpedo was able to accelerate so fast?
In Marco's shoes I would have put the ex in chains and in a cell with no electronics. Nothing but a closet and the essential. In fact in his shoes the best course of action would have been sending Naomi back through the back channels and not keep her in the capital ship. In fact, for knowing her past and even for been her lover, Marco should have a knowledge of what Naomi's capable of doing when she wants to.
The intriguing bit is that the boy has inherited father's brilliance and mother's ingeniousness. Only thing is that he is so easily manipulated with partials, with words and actions that it makes him blind for seeing the bigger picture.
I cannot think anything more frustrating thing than waiting a response after making a major attack. It is nerve wrecking and the boy is not wise. He is just a boy. Not a man despite whatever he has done.
By allowing Naomi to poison to crew with her hatred on Marco's actions isn't the way to go. I trust that she will find a way or several to sabotage the action, the ship and find a way off the ship.
Susan Boulton
The storyteller
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- Mar 15, 2006
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"It doesn't make sense for Amos to personally visit Clarissa in the prison." Yes it does if you have read the books. The series is very condensed and characters have been merged, but the main thrust of the story is the same. Clarissa is a major character in book 6-7. Same with Marcos and Naomi. here the story has changed somewhat, it is all about control, revenge and ego.
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- Jun 28, 2007
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Marcos's ego is very much to the forefront in the show. He is everything a good leader should not be. He is a fanatic and a narcissist.
Drummer is my favourite character in the series and she deserves more screen time.
Earth is in trouble if Marco get's those Mars destroyers.
Drummer is my favourite character in the series and she deserves more screen time.
Earth is in trouble if Marco get's those Mars destroyers.
ctg
weaver of the unseen
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What does the book say about their relationship and Amos reason?
Susan Boulton
The storyteller
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- Mar 15, 2006
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In the books it details the length of time it takes for ships to travel between places. Events that look like they happen within days really happen over months and years. The events of the first 6 books happen over a 10-12 year period. Books 7 jumps 30 years into the future, 8 and 9 a few years after that. The Rossi took Clarissa back to earth for trial, during that time, due to her actions on the Behemoth in helping Holden and the crew, she was not "locked away", but worked alongside Amos as an Engineer caring for and looking after the Rossi systems. (That is something that is glossed over in the series, a ship needs constant maintence.) They develop a close friendship, not a sexual relationship, but a type of marriage/family one. Both are what you call "damaged" by their life experiences so have a connection. Same can be said for the relationship between Bobbie and Alex.
He speaks to her via messages now and then, as he is her single choice of outside contact, and being on earth he decides to see her as at that time he does not think he will be coming back.
I honestly think you should read the books, they are superb, and knowing the story hasn't affected my enjoyment of the series, as the merging of characters, slimming down of events etc has been well done and does not alter the main story at all.
ctg
weaver of the unseen
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I know. I stopped on that Ring, because I couldn't comprehend it. Not in the text form. But I guess it would make sense to carry on from 6 and 7.
Damn! I was really disappointed when Konechek met his untimely end at the bottom of the elevator shaft.
As an Amos on steroids "Tiny" would have made a great addition to the crew.
As an Amos on steroids "Tiny" would have made a great addition to the crew.
They made a point of saying that as Martians they could withstand a greater acceleration than the Belters, but he was aware that the Belters would know that too. I assumed that the ship is capable of greater acceleration, except that they would black-out. A missile, having no human component and being lighter in mass, has no such limits.
It's interesting how things that they missed out from earlier books suddenly become important to understanding reasons for actions much later. The same thing happened in Game of Thrones.
Likewise. A terrific character.
The Belters are fascinating. They remind me very much of the Revellers in my Memory Seed. They have that tribal, limited, fierce nature that comes from limited vision in difficult circumstance. I think they're a great creation. My only quibble is the accent, which, though a great part of the culture, is a little too like a particular Earth accent for comfort. But that's just personal opinion. Overall, the Belters are really interesting. Lots of stories there.
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