Idiomatic Dialogue in Imaginary Worlds

[Fiberglass Cyborg]

When writing a story set in the real world, you can ground it in reality by giving the characters a turn of phrase that's appropriate for the time and place and who they are. How do you do this for a setting that's completely imaginary, such as another world or the distant future? Do you use modern idioms as a stand-in, make up your own idioms, or use some other strategy?

 

[Stephen Palmer]

In 'Memory Seed' I invented my own. The trick is not to go too ott - admittedly, quite difficult. I got around that by making my future idiom understandable out of context, though in most cases the context was there anyway. If in doubt: speak it to yourself. Listen to it like music, and your ear will detect anything obviously false.

 

[sknox]

Make them up, but take care to create resonance for the reader. Pretty much all SF and fantasy face this. Think of the phrase "taking the black." Martin shows is this in the first chapter of the first book, but really we're more focused on the action of the scene. But he returns to it, time and again. By the time Jon Snow takes the black, it has real meaning. And, more to the point here, characters use the phrase and it has resonance for the reader.

So, do that. <g>

 

[AllanR]

I recently read a short by Heinlein where everyone said 'Hot Rockets' as a sort of good luck or pleasant journey substitute. It was instantly recognizable for what it was to mean. He didn't use other new idioms in the story, just the one.

 

[Fiberglass Cyborg]

I wonder how translators approach this? It must be a regular occurence: you find an idiom in one language and have to choose whether to render it literally (for local colour) or to find an equivalent in the target language (for relatability). One of Haruki Murakami's two regular translators once cast mild shade on the other for his exaggeratedly "hip" tone. Wheras in manga and anime, the fans put a lot of pressure on translators to include more original Japanese honorifics. A couple of ideas brewing in my head have far-future, multispecies settings where presumably no-one would be speaking present-day English.

Some great points above. I agree that an unfamiliar idiom has a bigger artistic effect if it actually has a major place in the culture and the story. One example I love is "A glass poured to air" in Scott Lynch's "Locke Lamora" books- later occurrances of the phrase are genuinely heartbreaking.

 

[CupofJoe]

There was an interview with Anthea Bell, long time co-translator of the Asterix books [and much much more besides]. She said it was important to retain the tone of the original and not slavishly copy word for word. And other have said it had to fit the rhythm of the piece as well.

 

[Astro Pen]

I watched with interest as "There ya go." spread out from the McCloud US TV show to most shop and restaurant interactions in the UK.
Similarly the Incredibly annoying, "How (adjective) is that?" Spread everywhere in the 80s and we are still stuck with it.
A key factor seems to be that these things are very generalizable.
Careful with inadvertent double entendre though, My uncle always used to say "Keep your pecker up."

 

[sknox]

>I wonder how translators approach this?
There's the famous example of translating Jabberwocky. It's a wonderful concept--how does one retain the sense of nonsense? I first ran across it in Hofstadter's brilliant book, Goedel, Escher, Bach. Here's a site that collects translations.
JV: Translations

How do translators approach this? Cautiously, with a long stick. <g> They have to be deeply conversant in both languages *and* in the particular genre in both languages. Witness the innumerable translations of Dante's Inferno, some of which are in rhyme, some in prose. So it can go beyond even the words themselves to the form and format.

 

[Wayne Mack]

I think one needs to straddle the line between using readily understood (by the reader) idioms and using phrases that are unique to the world being created. Make sure that the idiom is serving a purpose in the story and is not there just to be there. If the idiom is revealing something about a character, it is probably best that it is closely derived from current usage. If the idiom is revealing something about the imagined world context, then it is probably best to be derived from that world's unique attributes.

 

[niccol]

This is a really interesting thread. There is a sub-group of idiom that is based on religion too. So, rather than saying 'my god!' for instance, some authors have used phrases like 'my gods' and 'blessed mother' to hint at the social structure of their world. I think this is interesting because it is a a good example of how idiom can be used to convey all kinds of sub-text about the world one is writing about. I am trying to think of other examples but as usual my mind has gone blank! But my point is that if the created idiom adds depth and understanding to the world building then it is great and that would be one of my tests - is using that idiom gratuitous or does it add information and depth.