Avuncular and Materteral

[ColGray]

Recently needed to describe a character as being aunt-like and thought, wait, i know the term for being like an uncle -- avuncular. There must be a term for being like an aunt. It was much harder to track down than i expected, but the correct term is 'materteral' and it is a Latinate, deriving from 'matertera', which means, maternal aunt.

Just thought i'd share a cool word!

 

[Snicklefritz]

Recently needed to describe a character as being aunt-like and thought, wait, i know the term for being like an uncle -- avuncular. There must be a term for being like an aunt. It was much harder to track down than i expected, but the correct term is 'materteral' and it is a Latinate, deriving from 'matertera', which means, maternal aunt.

Just thought i'd share a cool word!

I miss reading the dictionary....

 

[Swank]

Have you ever noticed that the word "auspicious" seems to exist only to describe Asian cultural concepts?

 

[tinkerdan]

Have you ever noticed that the word "auspicious" seems to exist only to describe Asian cultural concepts?

Not particularly.
The whole idea sounds 'suspicious'.

Origin

late 16th century: from auspice + -ous.

 

[Montero]

I think I'd probably go with "auntly" myself, which I just made up but might or might not really exist. (I haven't been to look, so this is a Schrodinger's Cat moment.) Fascinated to learn about materteral it is just so aside from avuncular and "aunt" that not sure I'd follow it in a text. Or need to set up its first use careful, very much in the context of and sentence with "aunt" so that the reader is hinted into it. I do also enjoy learning new words as I read so would be intrigued by matertertal - providing there isn't a new one every page.

 

[farntfar]

Is there a word for a paternal aunt?
Paterteral for instance?

I found Matertera, meaning maternal aunt in my Collins Gem Latin-English dictionary, left over from school, but not Patertera.
Ah wait. A paternal aunt is Amita (*) in latin. So maybe there's a word Amital.
However, neither Amital, nor Materteral are found in my Concise Oxford.

* Obviously a far more important position, as it gets a special word.

Ooh. And more.
Avunculus in Latin is only a maternal uncle. Patruus is a paternal uncle.
Have we all been using the word Avuncular wrongly all these years?

How scandalous. (From the latin verb Scando, meaning to climb. But possibly only on the eastern side of the mountain.)

 

[Rufus Coppertop]

Have you ever noticed that the word "auspicious" seems to exist only to describe Asian cultural concepts?

No.

 

[Brian G Turner]

Recently needed to describe a character as being aunt-like

"He/she was just like their aunt."

 

[ColGray]

"He/she was just like their aunt."

Lol, yes, except the character is a pedantic AI who consistently uses long-but-highly-precise names and relational strings to refer to people -- e.g. speaking to someone and referring to them (to their face) as, Maeve's Aunt Sue, vs, Sue.

Similar to how a child might call their friend's father, Mr. <friend's name> Dad

 

[ColGray]

Is there a word for a paternal aunt?
Paterteral for instance?

I found Matertera, meaning maternal aunt in my Collins Gem Latin-English dictionary, left over from school, but not Patertera.
Ah wait. A paternal aunt is Amita (*) in latin. So maybe there's a word Amital.
However, neither Amital, nor Materteral are found in my Concise Oxford.

* Obviously a far more important position, as it gets a special word.

Ooh. And more.
Avunculus in Latin is only a maternal uncle. Patruus is a paternal uncle.
Have we all been using the word Avuncular wrongly all these years?

How scandalous. (From the latin verb Scando, meaning to climb. But possibly only on the eastern side of the mountain.)

I think it might be the root of the word, but the meaning may have grown beyond the Latin? I've never understood avuncular to only mean maternal uncles (though, i also don't have any maternal uncles, so that might be observation bias?). Latin, and many early languages, were very specific about the relationship between individuals as it informed decisions regarding marriageability -- e.g. cousins could marry if it was a paternal cousin but not a maternal cousin, therefore, they needed a word to capture that relationship.

 

[farntfar]

I agree entirely, @ColGray. And I wasn't being entirely serious. I very rarely am.

The derivation of words is fraught with mistakes and misenterpretations, (Not to mention misspellings), especially when other languages are involved.

 

[Snicklefritz]

Have you ever noticed that the word "auspicious" seems to exist only to describe Asian cultural concepts?

Maybe not "only" but often. In a listing of 54 english language quotations using "auspicious" just over half are by Asian authors using it mostly to convey philosophical "luck."

Top 54 Quotes About Auspicious: Famous Quotes & Sayings About Auspicious

Quotes about Auspicious. Jonathan D. Spence: Seek joyfulness when you can, for seeking joy leads to an auspicious atmosphere.

quotestats.com

 

[Swank]

Not particularly.
The whole idea sounds 'suspicious'.

Origin

late 16th century: from auspice + -ous.

I am aware of the etymology. I was commenting on the usage.

 

[Brian G Turner]

Lol, yes, except the character is a pedantic AI who consistently uses long-but-highly-precise names and relational strings to refer to people -- e.g. speaking to someone and referring to them (to their face) as, Maeve's Aunt Sue, vs, Sue.

That sounds like you're purposefully making the story hard to read, which begs the question of whether that's a direction worth pursuing. I've read some very enjoyable stories about AI, and in none of them did the author force the reader to deal with difficult text. Are you sure it's the AI that's being pedantic?

 

[Montero]

I'd also comment that "avuncular" to me is a certain sort of western hemisphere uncle behaviour - hearty, old fashioned, approving, here have a fiver my boy I'm sure that a young chap like you can make good use of it.
With a different person, or in a different culture, avuncular may not be applicable.
Aunts have different vibes from the disapproving dowager like Lady Bracknell, to the giddy young thing who is probably the younger sister of your father or mother.

 

[Hex]

There are languages where many adults that you're not related to are described as "aunt" or "uncle" (I'm thinking of Turkish, but I'm sure there are others). That's a bit of a tangent. It is a very cool word, but I would need to look it up which might make me twitch. Do you have footnotes (or similar) explaining the long words?

 

[Montero]

There are languages where many adults that you're not related to are described as "aunt" or "uncle" (I'm thinking of Turkish, but I'm sure there are others). That's a bit of a tangent. It is a very cool word, but I would need to look it up which might make me twitch. Do you have footnotes (or similar) explaining the long words?

I've known people in the UK who added Aunt or Uncle to the names of all their friends when introducing them to their children - which I vetoed. Just use my name.

 

[farntfar]

When I was a boy, there where several of my parents' close friends that we were encouraged to call Auntie Gladys and Uncle Bill etc.
And this in no way implied that Mum or Dad was sleeping with Bill or Gladys.
At least I was never aware of it, if the were.

 

[ColGray]

That sounds like you're purposefully making the story hard to read, which begs the question of whether that's a direction worth pursuing. I've read some very enjoyable stories about AI, and in none of them did the author force the reader to deal with difficult text. Are you sure it's the AI that's being pedantic?

Ha! Totally fair question but based on beta reader feedback, I'm not worried about it. They're not so much hard to read as childlike + specific in defining human relationships.

The two legit pedantic words I've used are materteral (being like an aunt) and sororal (the technical term for twin girls), which are specific and relevant to the main triangle relationship in the story (Mother, Aunt, Daughter). Two pedantic words, with context clues, across 125k words feels okay

 

[ColGray]

There are languages where many adults that you're not related to are described as "aunt" or "uncle" (I'm thinking of Turkish, but I'm sure there are others). That's a bit of a tangent. It is a very cool word, but I would need to look it up which might make me twitch. Do you have footnotes (or similar) explaining the long words?

Absolutely agree on the usage to denote a close friend.

No footnotes, but there's strong context clues--e.g. appearing directly next to avuncular.

I DID have footnotes for one character (his POV chapters were project notebook entries) but it was strangled, completely killed pacing and feedback from beta readers was that they skipped the notes because they're a PITA in an ebook.

TLDR, footnotes went away about 4 drafts ago!