Scene Building Process Question

[dgackst]

This question is to get an idea of how different authors build a scene just for the sake of curiosity and learning about different or even new techniques.

The main question:
What do different authors find works best for them when building a scene, in terms of building an all encompassing and entertaining scene?

Do you like to have a fully realized scene in the first draft (awkward structure/ wording fixes and the like ignored)?
Or
Do you like to have a lot of 'blank white room' scenes in your first draft and rely on later drafts to build the scenes up?
Or
The opposite? Do you have so much surrounding detail for your scenes in your first draft that you trim as needed in the later drafts?
Or
Is there a different method you've discovered that works wonders for you that you'd like to share?

 

[Biskit]

My first observation is that you're assuming a lot of planning. As a pantser, I just write it and then trim/expand later as appropriate.

I assume that I generally have a good subconscious view of what the scene is about and what it needs to achieve, mostly because sometimes the writing hits a wall which suggests that at that point I have no idea what I'm doing, subconscious or not. That said, it's not uncommon that half way through a scene the narrative will take a sharp ninety-degree turn from where it was going, suggesting that the original subconscious view got overridden.

 

[dgackst]

My first observation is that you're assuming a lot of planning. As a pantser, I just write it and then trim/expand later as appropriate.

I assume that I generally have a good subconscious view of what the scene is about and what it needs to achieve, mostly because sometimes the writing hits a wall which suggests that at that point I have no idea what I'm doing, subconscious or not. That said, it's not uncommon that half way through a scene the narrative will take a sharp ninety-degree turn from where it was going, suggesting that the original subconscious view got overridden.

My main curiosity was about how people arrive at a finished scene, regardless of planning or pantsing techniques. From your response it sounds like your scene may or may not be at a 'fully developed' stage from the first draft depending on if you had a good subconscious view of what the scene is about/ what it needs to achieve (I think). Do you find yourself needing to add tidbits within the scenes here and there during read throughs to make the scenes feel more alive? Or is that dependent on the initial flow of writing?

I suppose my question can be tied back to reading published novels and (most of the time) the scenes feel so alive. I am curious how many tries it takes for people to get to that state to where they feel their scenes are truly alive. As with anything I'm sure there is the 'it depends' answer, but for me I never get it right the first try and need to work at it by adding more detail in with each draft.

 

[THX1138]

Different writers have different approaches to this, so there is no plain and simple answer. Planners will have the scene all worked out and will allow some leeway for their characters to 'be' and interact in the scene. Thus, building the scene. Pantsers will have an idea and tend to just go for it, allowing the characters to develop the scene then cleaning it up during edits and second drafts.

I do both. I'll have the physical location and its flow already in my mind, as well as the main key points I want to address; conversations, events. Then when I start writing, I follow the behavior and emotional outlines for each of the main characters involved as well as the natural events in that location, pantsing little bits here and there to bring life into the physical scene and conversations/behavior of the characters involved. In the end, I would have completed my objective for that scene, and hopefully painted a picture in words that is left for the reader to fill in and bring to life with their own imagination.

 

[Swank]

I would recommend investing in the details right away. Stories are not skeletons with a coat of paint over them. The story is as much how it is told as what is being told - write a scene that is interesting to read from the beginning.

Technique wise, this can be a combination of using those little phrases you might have been storing up for a rainy day. And putting yourself in the scene, in the character. Create the prose that makes reading a book worthwhile by offering all those details of language and sensory elements that will make even a relatively vanilla scene rich.

 

[Pyan]

I do both. I'll have the physical location and its flow already in my mind, as well as the main key points I want to address; conversations, events. Then when I start writing, I follow the behavior and emotional outlines for each of the main characters involved as well as the natural events in that location, pantsing little bits here and there to bring life into the physical scene and conversations/behavior of the characters involved. In the end, I would have completed my objective for that scene, and hopefully painted a picture in words that is left for the reader to fill in and bring to life with their own imagination.

You're a Plantser...

 

[THX1138]

A planning pantser! But a pantser none the less.

 

[Steve Harrison]

It's not something I give any thought to, but I usually know the purpose of an upcoming scene and which characters will be present in it, but I let them sort out the details as to how they complete that purpose. As the novel progresses this becomes easier because the characters become more established and 'know' what they are doing and need to achieve. Most of my editing is going back to the earlier scenes to ensure the characters are consistent from the start based on their later development.

If that sounds a little odd, I agree!

 

[Biskit]

Do you find yourself needing to add tidbits within the scenes here and there during read throughs to make the scenes feel more alive? Or is that dependent on the initial flow of writing?

That's very tricky to answer. In my professional life, I was a scientist and IT developer, which by its nature is methodical and analytical. When I write, it's very intuitive, so whether a scene is right, and what to do about it if it isn't, doesn't get analysed. I suppose I do add small details during editing passes, or trim out stuff that seems superfluous, but that's all as seat-of-the-pants as the rest of my writing process.

I think @Swank makes a good point:

I would recommend investing in the details right away. Stories are not skeletons with a coat of paint over them. The story is as much how it is told as what is being told - write a scene that is interesting to read from the beginning.

I tend to write a lot of 1st person narratives, so I am putting myself in my character's place and telling the reader what's there, which is filtered by "what would my character notice or care about?" I am seriosly not a fan of "I looked in the mirror..." as an excuse for the narrator to describe themself to the reader, and if I did write about the mirror it would probably be my narrator noting the amount of dust and realising that the cleaning service hasn't been paid for a month.

So, I suppose, what I'm really doing (caution, self-analysis ahead) is telling the reader things that my character thinks are interesting, keeping back anything that might spoil any surprises later, but also trying to convey something about my character to the reader in the things that are noticed and the things that are left out. So, for instance, I rarely have my narrators describing themselves, or talking about what they're wearing, except for one particular character who frequently does that because they are obsessed with their clothing.

 

[Laura R Hepworth]

I'm a pantser. I reread over the last couple of chapters to reimerse in the story (and catch anything I might want to tweak, fix, etc.) and then just start writing. Sometimes the scene will be pretty much perfect right out of the gate, other times, when I reread I find places where it needs to be fleshed out a little more in some way. Perhaps it's dialogue heavy, if that's the case, I look for ways to break up the dialogue and interject narrative, description, action, and/or internal thoughts; perhaps I have a fair bit of description, but it's largely visual, if so, I check if there are ways to tie in the other senses; etc. In other words, I look to see if anything is missing to really bring that scene to life and check the 'balance' of the scene as well as the pacing. By the time I finish writing the whole story though, it will be exactly as I need it to be. Also, I don't do multiple drafts. My writing system is writing, editing, and revising all at once so my first draft is also my final draft and, by the time it's finished, is only in need of that last look over by a separate pair of eyes for the final edit/polish which is typically very minimal for me.

 

[THX1138]

You're a Plantser...

I just went back and looked at the link. Yes, I am a full blown Plantser, no doubt!

 

[reiver33]

I’m a 1st person pantser, typically with a visualised scene that I have to ‘sit down and write’ to get it out of my head. If I don’t, if I ruminate and develop the narrative fully, such that ‘all’ I have to do is write it down, it seems to tick a creative box and frequently never gets done.

The most I hope up front for are a few ‘stepping stone’ scenes and the development process is bridging the gaps. Early revision is a case of ‘that doesn’t sit/flow/sound right’, later revision is the proverbial pain in the butt due to niggles. One major reason I resorted to self-publication was to draw a line under a given narrative, or I would never let it be.

I so sometimes plan retrospectively (on paper) in the sense of working out the who, what, where and when taking place ‘off camera’ from the narrator’s perspective - but generally don’t story board ahead of time.

If it works for you then it works.

 

[Christine Wheelwright]

I become engrossed in perfection on the first draft. I often think this is the wrong approach but I just can't help it. Often, when I go back over earlier chapters it is to ensure consistency of a character, as @Steve Harrison describes above.

 

[Biskit]

I so sometimes plan retrospectively (on paper) in the sense of working out the who, what, where and when taking place ‘off camera’ from the narrator’s perspective - but generally don’t story board ahead of time.

I've had to do this for the current WIP. Either it's too complex (which it is) or I'm getting too old to keep all this stuff in my head (also possible). This approach seems dangerously analytical.

Simples!

 

[reiver33]

I ended delving into traffic flow analysis to work out how long it would take characters to get from A to B across London at X time of day.

 

[Swank]

I ended delving into traffic flow analysis to work out how long it would take characters to get from A to B across London at X time of day.

You mean you asked Google maps about trip time?

 

[Biskit]

I ended up googling the largest passenger liners to estimate the mass of an ark-type ship for half a million passengers.

Shipping conventions and "tonnage" do not make life easy for a sci-fi author.

 

[reiver33]

This was about 10 years ago and it was a combination of bus/tube timetables, dead reckoning (piece of string on a streetmap and divide distance by walking pace), and pessimistic guesswork (having commuted into London by car). Then you add on a bit...

 

[sknox]

I've written four novels (five, soon!) and several shorter works. In every one of them I've felt like there's gotta be a better way.

There almost certainly is, but not for me.

That's the sad conclusion I've reached. I have how I work. Despite my best efforts, I still work pretty much the same way I did when I happily admitted I didn't know what I was doing. Experience might be the best teacher, but I've proved to be a lousy student.

I do a fair amount of planning. Most of that takes the form of writing in a journal. On some pages you will find what looks encouragingly like an outline, with points and sub-points. On other pages, there might be a scene list. Still elsewhere, character sketches (descriptive, not illustrated), descriptions of settings or magical items. As the pages go by, there starts to appear fragments of scenes or bits of dialog.

All that is prior to any real writing. At some point that cannot be predicted even by the best astrologers, I decide it's time to start writing. I have a fairly clear idea of the story and characters by then, maybe even the ending, but only the vaguest notion of how to get there.

Once I start writing, the plans go out the window. They're still lying there, out on the lawn. Oddly, the heart of the thing remains. All my novels wound up being about what I meant them to be, the characters were who I dreamed up and they behaved more or less as I intended. Surprises tend to come in the form of secondary characters who influence the plot in ways I had not envisioned at the outset, and most especially as I came to places in the plot where I need to get from here to there and it seemed all so clear in the beginning but now that I'm here it's devilishly difficult and the solution I finally hit on has unplanned consequences.

You may be surprised to learn that, despite all this, I do not give up on outlining and planning. I still do it. I even do it during revisions. I do it at the scene level, too. Planning happens continuously. As does deviating from plans.

The whole shambling, untidy mess is called writing.

 

[dgackst]

I must say it has been cool reading how many different approaches there are to putting together a scene/ story. If anyone wishes to elaborate on how they arrived to their specific method of crafting---maybe how many different approaches they tried until they finally found one that worked for them---that could make for some good information as well.

I know for me I must have spent the better part of five years arriving at a form of scene building process that kind of, sort of works for me. And I'm still subtly tweaking it with each story I write. This scene building process I arrived at wasn't intentionally done but just a result of trying many different techniques along the way and gravitating towards what was most beneficial for me.

If anyone else wishes to share their growth process---or unleash some of the frustrations from years of developing their craft---feel free!