Iain M Banks

[Pyan]

I agree with Rane about The Player Of Games, though - I thought it was brilliant.

 

[iansales]

Banks has a new Culture novel coming out next year, Matter. He read an excerpt from it at alt.fiction in Derby.

 

[disrepdog]

He was very entertaining at Derby wasn't he.

I liked his quote that you can have a perfect poem but not a perfect novel.

I think I am one of those rare people who started reading his Culture books first, (the guy has one hell of an imagination ) then read The Crow Road (very good) and haven't read The Wasp Factory yet.

But to answer your original question Brian, the SF books are not tacky at all. Visionary..maybe.
You do have to immerse yourself in them. He does raise social and moral questions in them. He said, IIRC, in Derby when asked about his books being left wing, that he did want to balance out the right wing stuff out there.

 

[iansales]

He said, IIRC, in Derby when asked about his books being left wing, that he did want to balance out the right wing stuff out there.

He's trotted out that quote loads of times. It's even remarked on in The Space Opera Renaissance, edited by David G Hartwell & Kathryn Cramer - and they find it a bit offensive because of course US space opera isn't right wing no not at all...

I'm currently in the middle of Banks's latest mainstream novel, The Steep Approach to Garbadale. Not sure where it's going yet, although it's certainly better than this last few mainstream novels.

 

[gully_foyle]

Are his SF books as dark and disturbing as his Wasp Factory? That's his only book I've read and despite I admired his writing I didn't dare to read another book of his. At the time I was reading it I sort of wondered whether the brilliant author himself a psychopath! I especially hated the parts of torturing little dogs.

Hi Allegra. I read The Wasp Factory nearly 20 years ago and I found it pretty dark and a bit sick in parts. Don't forget this was the decade of American Psycho and the sick factor was a selling point back then. Whilst his SF is violent I haven't found it to be dark or bleak. A book like The Algebraist is just plain fun. I'm still making my way through them, but so far I can highly recommend Excession and The Algebraist.

 

[Allegra]

Thanks for the recommendation, Gully! I was just going to ask someone to recommend me a book of his that wouldn't make me sick because I did like his writing very much. I'll look it up right away.

 

[iansales]

Against A Dark Background, a non-Culture novel, is probably the most fun of his sf books.

 

[Anthony G Williams]

Against A Dark Background, a non-Culture novel, is probably the most fun of his sf books.

Fun? As in, you get to like the heroes and everyone (except one) is killed off in various horrible ways?

Remind me never to accept an invitation from you to go out for a bit of fun

 

[iansales]

Well, it's hardly a serious novel, even if it does have a high bodycount. I mean, the maguffin is called the Lazy Gun.

 

[Anthony G Williams]

Well, it's hardly a serious novel, even if it does have a high bodycount. I mean, the maguffin is called the Lazy Gun.

That rings a bell somewhere - was it a PKDick story about a gun called something like that?

 

[iansales]

Not sure. There's The Zen Gun by Barrington J Bayley, though.

 

[Elethiomel]

I've read pretty much every Iain (M) Banks novel with the exception of the Steep Approach to Garbadale and Matter. While a select few are better than the others, I've enjoyed them all immensely. I personally like his SF better, but Wasp Factory and Crow Road are great. In my opinion, Use of Weapons and Player of Games are the best - at least on my top ten of all time. If you're looking for a starting place, I'd suggest Player of Games - Use of Weapons is somewhat dark and a complicated read, albeit ingenious and not for the faint of heart. Consider Phlebas is also excellent and a good one to read after Player.

 

[gully_foyle]

I just finished Against a Dark Background and have to say it ranks as my least favourite of his SF. The first half just sort of muddled along and while the pace picked up in the second half the tying up of all the loose ends was very unsatisfactory. There also seemed to be alot of random stuff. Apart from providing the title, what was the point of setting the planetary system in extra-galactic space (which I'm not sure is actually possible)? Feel free to PM me if the glaringly obvious answer is a spoiler (like the time I asked about the chair).

 

[iansales]

I think the reason it's set in extra-galactic space is so that the system can have a huge history without actually having expanded out of it - there's nowhere for them to go.

I'll admit Against A Dark Background is actually my favourite of Banks's sf novels. It's a daft quest plot, although Banks subverts the formula by having Sharrow lose every plot coupon just as she gains... only for her to win through in the end. But it's a lot of fun, and doesn't take itself at all seriously.

 

[The Judge]

I've only read The Algebraist and I couldn't recommend it to anyone.

There is great breadth of vision and the central conceit of how a species has achieved speedy inter-galactic travel is clever, and I dare say I missed some of the nuances of the mercantile civilisation by not having read his other books, but ultimately I found it unsatisfying and the characters unsympathetic. There also seemed to be a lot of padding - a sub-plot could have been removed in its entirety and both the prologue and epilogue felt like bits that had been tacked on for no reason. I also found some unpleasant scenes unnecessary - I was quite happy to take the baddie's evil nature on trust without seeing him torture and rape people - it felt a bit like violent porn stuck in for the teenage onanists.

And could someone please explain what relevance the title has to the damn plot!

J

 

[Tillane]

Judge: to follow what Elethiomel said - and that is such a good name, btw - I would suggest starting with The Player of Games, and following it up with either Consider Phlebas or Use of Weapons. All three with give you the best idea of Banks' breadth of vision and characterisation. And if you want to start at the beginning of the Culture stuff, Consider Phlebas is the one to go for. It's the first, and not far from the best.

 

[gully_foyle]

Consider Phlebas is probably my fave culture novel too. I also enjoyed The Player of Games and, putting me in a minority it seems, Look to Windward. Saw your comment Till about AADB being a rewrite of Consider Phlebas, quite possibly, but without the enigmatic environs the Culture universe affords.

 

[bobbo19]

I would always begin and go through the series in chronological order, therefore it is best to start with Consider Phlebas. A great starter novel to the culture series and a thoroughly intoxicating book, a real page turner!

 

[Fried Egg]

I'm reading "The Use of Weapons" at the moment and, only 95 pages in, I'm as confused as I normally am when beginning his SF books. The narrative is split between Sma and Zalakwe and the strand folling Zalakwe is all over the place, completely non-linear.

The thing about most of Bank's SF novels is they seem at first almost designed to confuse the reader. He endeavours to weave a disarray of strands and then draw them all together for the conclusion. While this is undoubtedly awfully clever of him, it leaves the reader in a state of confusion for much of the book. Though the reader may feel satisfied as everything falls into place once they reach the end, the first half is always hard work and not very enjoyable.

I enjoy this kind of writing once in a while but I certainly wouldn't want all my SF to be like this because, quite frankly, I wouldn't enjoy it very much.

 

[bobbo19]

Many writers in SF use strands though. After a certain # of pages one can understand the novel. I'm on an AListair Reynolds novel, Revalation SPace, and there are 3 strands to think off, let alone the 2 you find in Use of Weapons.