Philip K. Dick - the novels

[Fried Egg]

D Davis, this is probably not the place to discuss it but, are you not a fan of fantasy then?

 

[woodsman]

What do you want: more traditional, or more experimental narratives?

Something more experimental I think, broaden the horizons.

Surely if there was a forum more people would post about minor/smaller queries/thoughts. Oh well. I mean Rowling gets one???

 

[D_Davis]

D Davis, this is probably not the place to discuss it but, are you not a fan of fantasy then?

Oh no, I like some. Not a lot, very little actually, but the stuff I do like I really, really like. The Elric saga, for instance, is among my most cherished series of novels. And of course there is the more weird stuff like Smith and Lovecraft - not really "fantasy," but not SF either.

I don't read much fantasy any more, simply because I don't get anything out of it. Fantasy rarely makes me stop and think about stuff, which is why I love good SF like Dick, Bester, Ballard, Sturgeon, and so on. I read a lot of fantasy in high school, but I feel like I've kind of out grown it.

But of course there is stuff like Last Dragon, which totally blew me away and really set a new standard for fantasy.

My main problem with fantasy is the length of the books and how they seem to always be part of a series. Just hit me with a solid, smart, and thought provoking, single volume narrative. If I am going to devote my time to something, I want it to be something that I get some mental stimulation out of, and more often than not I find these qualities in SF, not F.

But I don't disparage (much!) the fantasy, it just seems like the climate of this board is, in general, more in tune with authors like Jordan and Martin, and not so much with authors like Dick and Ballard. Which makes sense - the climate here is more in tune with the general climate of the SFF sections at most book stores.

Just an observation, not a judgment call.

 

[D_Davis]

I mean Rowling gets one???

Yeah - don't remind me. Having a sub-forum is not a measure of greatness, just of popularity here. It makes sense.

If you are looking for something more experimental, or at least more mind-altering, I suggest any of these as a good starting point (in general, you want to read more post 1964 stuff):

The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch
A Scanner Darkly
Martian Time Slip
The Divine Invasion
VALIS

 

[woodsman]

Thanks a lot. Will look into those.

At least (IMHO) Le Guin has a sub-forum, although it's under-populated. in fact I became interested in Dick because several people said he was similar to Le Guin who has produced some amazing work.

 

[D_Davis]

Thanks a lot. Will look into those.

At least (IMHO) Le Guin has a sub-forum, although it's under-populated. in fact I became interested in Dick because several people said he was similar to Le Guin who has produced some amazing work.

If you like The Lathe of Heaven, I think you will like Dick.

He and Le Guin were actually pretty close at one time. I believe that Dick confided in her.

I became interested in Le Guin because of Dick! Although, it took A Lathe of Heaven for me to really get into her. That book blew my mind.

 

[woodsman]

Sounds great. Might also check out those other authors you mentioned; in good time.

I love the short stories Le Guin writes: hits you with a point, you finish reading, spend a couple of days thinking. Not too much of a slog, however, I'm also a bit of a sucker for a long, easier to read/digest fantasy.

 

[Fried Egg]

My main problem with fantasy is the length of the books and how they seem to always be part of a series. Just hit me with a solid, smart, and thought provoking, single volume narrative.

I know exactly where you're comming from. The modern trend for bloated, never ending series/franchises is the very side of fantasy that I don't like (anymore). That's why I tend to read most older stuff, but then again, I also read predominately older SF too.

 

[D_Davis]

I know exactly where you're comming from. The modern trend for bloated, never ending series/franchises is the very side of fantasy that I don't like (anymore). That's why I tend to read most older stuff, but then again, I also read predominately older SF too.

We're on the same page here.

I'll take Elric, Conan, and The Gray Mouser any old day.

Sagas made up of short concise stories - no filler. These are reductions of fantasy convention, stories told with brevity.

 

[Connavar]

Thanks a lot. Will look into those.

At least (IMHO) Le Guin has a sub-forum, although it's under-populated. in fact I became interested in Dick because several people said he was similar to Le Guin who has produced some amazing work.

If you want some thought provoking and broaden horizons several of his better works are perfect for that.

Why i enjoy him so much is that even in his weaker books he will make you think things you dont usually think about.
About Le Guin, she seems to have a been a fan of his. Her high praise of him is on several blurbs of my PKD books.

I would recommend the ones that impressed most so far. I havent read many of his so far.

Now Wait For Last Year
Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep ?


If you are interested in short stories or find a collection of his cheap somewhere. Minority Report is a very good story.

 

[woodsman]

If you want some thought provoking and broaden horizons several of his better works are perfect for that.

If you are interested in short stories or find a collection of his cheap somewhere. Minority Report is a very good story.

Firstly: did they make a film of that?

Secondly: thanks Conn I know you've praised PKD a lot, something which has tipped me in the direction of giving him a go! I think you might also like Le Guin if you like short stories that deal with different subjects or the 'old' subjects from different angles. I just finished The Birthday Of The World which is a great collection - if you can get hold of it, give it a whirl!

Have set aside some £'s for a couple of PKD books, as of today!

 

[Connavar]

Firstly: did they make a film of that?

Secondly: thanks Conn I know you've praised PKD a lot, something which has tipped me in the direction of giving him a go! I think you might also like Le Guin if you like short stories that deal with different subjects or the 'old' subjects from different angles. I just finished The Birthday Of The World which is a great collection - if you can get hold of it, give it a whirl!

Have set aside some £'s for a couple of PKD books, as of today!

Nice to i had something to with it. Despite his rep you can never get enough PKD readers

Yes they made that Tom Cruise movie. Which was good but of course not dark,smart enough for a PKD story. It had some of the elements from the short story but not very similar to it.

Thanks for Le Guin short story tip. Im currently in short story mode and i have wanted to try her mostly cause like PKD she seems to be about social side of SF.

 

[D_Davis]

The Birthday of the World was the first Le Guin book I read.

I picked it for a women's lit class I had.

The professor was not impressed with my decision to read SF, but I totally won her over with my paper.

The academic world is a silly place, especially when lit is concerned. Forever slaves to tradition and the status quo.

 

[woodsman]

Too true I'm afraid and many academics seem to be somewhat ego-driven as well in my experiences.

If I tell someone I'm reading a SF novel their immediate reaction tends to be: "what, like Starwars/Startrek and stuff?" - infering somekind of childish slur - missing the fact that many of the most though provoking novels have been written in this genre. Yeah the lit world can be very snobbish, we just have to live with it I fear.

 

[Connavar]

The Three Stigmata of Dr Palmer Eldritch.

Have you guys read this book ? What did you feel about ? Favorite character ?

D_Davis is your nick from the book ?

 

[Fried Egg]

My main feeling after reading the Three Stigmata is that I should read it again, promptly. I haven't yet however. To be honest, I wouldn't say I fully understood it after one read.

 

[Connavar]

I understood it even if i still wonder why that being let Barney go as it said. Why did it accept its fate at the end.

Characterwise i didnt feel it was strong as usual in a good PKD book but ideas wise it was really good. The latter part of the book shocked me in a way that i didnt see the twist of who Palmer who truly was coming. I also liked how PKD played with what was real and what was not real. Everytime they were in a fake reality i was as lost as the character. Refreshing too that we never got to know what the being really was or where it was from.

That made the book very memorable. Also the fact none of the characters was heroic in any way. They cared more about keeping their job or getting their boss's job or about their dominance of the drug trade etc
Not like the main characters in PKD novels or short stories i have read. They was moved by some good intention for others and not only for their sake.

 

[D_Davis]

The Three Stigmata of Dr Palmer Eldritch.

Have you guys read this book ? What did you feel about ? Favorite character ?

D_Davis is your nick from the book ?

This is my favorite PKD book.

But no - my nick is just the initial of my first name - Daniel




I need to reread this soon and write a review for it.

 

[Connavar]

Heh funny i saw a Don Davis in the book and thought would Davis's nick be a guy that you only saw the name of.

 

[Fried Egg]

I'm just reading Ubik now and really enjoying it so far.