Help Always Wanted...

Ok you've made me feel guilty (not quite sure how :confused:). I''ve never even looked at any of the critique threads; never felt myself qualified. But you've made your point, TJ and others, I read a lot of books so I should at least be able to let people know what I think... I guess.

Only problem is I'm not the most discerning of readers. Whilst I love and enjoy reading quality authors I do also love reading some seriously lowbrow stuff as well :eek:. But I guess there's a place for both. And I'm certainly no writer as you will all become steadily aware if I keep trying the writing challenge!

So I promise I shall try and make the time to look in on some of the crtique threads!
 
And it was a very good critique, Vertigo. I genuinely mean that.

For those who haven't done any critiques yet, or at all (and I am speaking here to those who have used the critiques forum themselves), I do recommend the gentle glow of virtue one feels after doing a few.
 
i'd be posting stuff, but right now i think i've posted enough of the WIP. as the guidelines state, if you mean it for publication...

but i will try to get back into critiques more - as much as time allows...
 
And it was a very good critique, Vertigo. I genuinely mean that.

For those who haven't done any critiques yet, or at all (and I am speaking here to those who have used the critiques forum themselves), I do recommend the gentle glow of virtue one feels after doing a few.

For me it was more a torrential flow of terror. I feel totally inadequatly educated for doing critiques and was terrified that my comments would just be petty, purile, useless etc. So I very much appreciate your comment, Teresa, it really does make me feel a lot better :)!
 
Vertigo, your critique was very much appreciated by me, and I'm glad it was my piece that you chose to have a go with! :D
 
Thank Mouse, and I really only picked yours 'cos I figured you would be too small to bite my head off :eek:

Actually although a bit scary (in the same way as my first 75 word story) it was really a lot of fun. One of the things that joining this forum has done for me is make me read with a much more critical eye. This in no way spoils my enjoyment of the read (I am still totally immersed in a good story whilst actually reading it) but it does make me think a lot more about what I'm reading which in turn gives me (I hope) a deeper understanding of the book. Actually doing a crtique is sort of the natural end result of this process and I actually found myself getting an almost vicarious pleasure from it, as though I was trying to improve my own story.
 
Whoo-hoo! Our new poster boy for Critiques! And I agree with Teresa, Vertigo -- the comments you've made in the other pieces also, have been to the point and helpful. I dunno. Last month you knock out an excellent short story, which you say is the first one you've done. This month you bash out an excellent critique, ditto. What on earth are you planning for October which you've never done before?!. (At this rate, you'll be writing a best seller by year end...)
 
Funny you should say that....

I have often thought about writing but have a number of blocks. I was always lousy at English and any other languages for that matter; I was even taught Latin and Ancient Greek at school but remember nothing of them. My grammer is dreadful, punctuation in particular; most of my puctuation is pure guess work! I know I could learn but I'm just not motivated enough by it. I'm perfectly happy if the story reads naturally to me and I don't really care or notice any grammatical gaffs unless it makes the reading uncomfortably. Hope that doesn't upset anyone :eek:. However the main block is that when I'm reading a good author I constantly find myself thinking wow that was really well put/described/expressed, I never would have thought of putting it like that. And all those wonderful similes and metaphors that are so essential to creating a vivid mental picture... I just never think of them. Finally dialogue; whenever I try to create my own dialogue in my head, it just comes out stilted and unnatural. Also any books I read invariably have one or two witty or clever characters in them and I simply don't seem to do witty and clever in myself. I see this all the time on the Chrons, I am constantly in awe of the witty repartee going on and I can rarely think of any suitably clever response myself.

Ho hum... but you never know, as I said above, this forum had made me read more "intelligently" (I think) and I am reading a lot more than I used to; for a good twenty five years I barely read any fiction at all and only started again a couple of years ago. So maybe I'll get better....

It's interesting, actually, that I always claimed I didn't have the time to read but in reality I was just watching too much TV and a couple of years ago I started getting fed up with the quality of TV (with certain notable exceptions) and so started reading again :D. At least with the backlog of books that created I don't find myself fretting, waiting for the next book to come out as there are so many already there waiting for me to read!
 
For a person who is apparently hopeless at grammar and punctuation, you make virtually no mistakes, Vertigo, so I'm taking the rest of your self-deprecation with a very large pinch of salt. Writing well isn't easy. If it was, Jeffrey Archer could do it. But other than for geniuses, there's a huge difference between a first draft of a scene and the final product as published. My own skills, what I have of them, are in the editing stage, when I polish and buff and generally hone the words and images -- and that's the kind of thing which comes with long practice. As for wit, mine is of the esprit de l'escalier type -- I always think of the supremely clever retort long after it's useful in real life. But that's fine. I don't need to be as witty as I would like my characters to be, any more than I need to be as pretty/handsome/intelligent/brave/strong as they are. I just need to know how to use other people's wit (bravery/intelligence etc) and steal it for my plots.

Anyhow, I think you're well able to write and I would love to see you take a few more steps over and beyond the 75 word challenge. And there we have it, folks. A new project for us all -- to persuade Vertigo to write something and post it on Critiques!
 
Ah see, now I had to go look up "esprit de l'escalier "!

I thank you for your kind words though TJ and I'm truly not just knocking myself, I don't really have low esteem or anything like that (I am suitably proud of stuff I know I do well, like writing and teaching software). But honestly, when I write I put almost no punctuation in. Every time I post here I go back over what I've written and add it along the lines of "ummmm need a pause here; sling in a comma or maybe a semicolon" :D. And all the talk of tenses and active and passive and stuff like, what is it you say, "close third person" or something. I just find all of that bewildering.

However I don't think poor grammar would completely stop me if I really was determined to write, maybe I'd just pay one of you guys to edit it for me if I was serious about publishing!

So maybe I will have a little go sometime. Possibly not too soon though, the business that I run does over two thirds of its turnover between mid October and mid December. So it is about to go very manic for me in a few weeks time and I shall likely have little time to post here never mind do any writing.
 
I don't know if you realise this, Dear Vertigo, but what you have just experienced was, in fact . . . . Dialogue. :D

It can sometimes be hard to sit down and write out an exchange of ideas and information between characters in a way that reads like an actual conversation, the words instead coming across as stilted and unnatural, but when you converse with others in reality you can feel how dramatically different it is from what you've written (at least from some perspectives). Perhaps if you treat the dialogue between the characters as being more of a conversation between yourself and another yourself it could grow more natural.

One of the reasons I love writing so much is that sensation of BEING the character, of feeling their emotions. One of my best pieces, hidden somewhere between this computer and another, was written predominantly with my eyes closed. I saw what he saw, I felt what he felt, and from there I just described it in a way that would allow others the same sensations I experienced with him. It's like taking a bite of a peach, and then describing that to someone who has never eaten one before. You could do so in the first-person (I, me, my), which is only natural, or you could think of it in the close third-person (he, him, his. [As an aside, the closed third-person could be considered similar to first-person in that the perspective should only express what the character knows/sees/feels/tastes/experiences personally, in a way that they themselves would think/feel/show it. This differs from the omniscient third-person, which can "head hop", or detail the experiences and feelings of all characters, present or not, of the past, present, and future.]), and describe it to them that way. The sensation of sweet, the texture of the juices, the scent of the fruit, the feel of the peach's skin, even the way your breath tastes as you exhale that first time, carrying the aftertaste upon it.

I used to feel woefully inadequate when I realized I would never use imagery the way Dean Koontz does (this was several years ago, now). I wouldn't think to give things the attributes that he does, these metaphors which momentarily pull me from the story to strike me with awe. Not writing the way he does, however, is still one of my strengths, it just took a while to realize that for myself. It's what makes my style uniquely mine, and the more I work at it, the better it gets.

Now of course, no one says you HAVE to write anything, but if it's something you enjoy, then you should indulge once in a while and see just how far you can take it, and how much you can refine it. Like anything in life one enjoys. :)
 
Thank you for those kind words Malloriel and I pretty much agree with all of them. I've never done a great deal of creative work over the years all my work has been in computers. Don't get me wrong, no complaints, I love the work. But I stuggle to let go enough to do exactly as you say "being the character". I'm not too worried though, if I decide to get into writing I am sure it is something I can get the hang of.

As it happens after my last post the idea gnawed away at me until I put finger to keypad and wrote a little intro to a story and after tidying it a bit I shall put up for scrutiny!

Aarrgh did I really say that...
 

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