Longer short stories

Before anyone gets too excited about this, any competition around here is going to need a moderator to administrate it. So you need to find one who is interested in doing that.

I'm already helping to run one competition, and that's all I can manage. The number of moderators who participate in the writer's forums is limited, so it may be difficult to get this started.
 
Indeed, this will not go ahead without moderator sanction. It has been discussed briefly amongst the moderating group already, without a lot of support. In fact, it has been raised and mooted in the past - http://www.sffchronicles.co.uk/forum/31863-monthly-short-story-competition.html. The objections remain the same. And as you are new, Bella Donna, I should just explain that Brian is the Big Boss. He owns this place, pays for it out of his own pocket, and very kindly allows us to play here.

My suggestion, BD, is that you might like to hang out for a while, participate in the challenges and exercises and whatnot that are already underway, and get a feel for the place (and let the place get a feel for you) before you undertake such a great endeavour as this. There are ample opportunities to start writing exercises and mini-challenges in the Workshop, or post excerpts of your work for critique (and return the favour) in Critiques, or just generally discuss writing in GWD.

Please don't take this as censorship or disapproval - it's wonderful that you've taken such an immediate interest in the community. But, you know, baby steps...
 
Ultimately I don't think it matters WHEN you do it, as long as the dates are clear in the first post of the thread. The 75 word challenge doesn't match up exactly with the start and end of the month, but people don't seem to have a problem with it.
 
Indeed, this will not go ahead without moderator sanction. It has been discussed briefly amongst the moderating group already, without a lot of support. In fact, it has been raised and mooted in the past - http://www.sffchronicles.co.uk/forum/31863-monthly-short-story-competition.html. The objections remain the same. And as you are new, Bella Donna, I should just explain that Brian is the Big Boss. He owns this place, pays for it out of his own pocket, and very kindly allows us to play here.

Ah. One of the members -- may have been a mod -- I didn't check -- suggested that I start this thread, otherwise I wouldn't have done so. I'll have a look at that link.

My suggestion, BD, is that you might like to hang out for a while, participate in the challenges and exercises and whatnot that are already underway, and get a feel for the place (and let the place get a feel for you) before you undertake such a great endeavour as this. There are ample opportunities to start writing exercises and mini-challenges in the Workshop, or post excerpts of your work for critique (and return the favour) in Critiques, or just generally discuss writing in GWD.

Please don't take this as censorship or disapproval - it's wonderful that you've taken such an immediate interest in the community. But, you know, baby steps...
I get it. :)

If the others feel the same way, we could let this quietly drop, but if they don't, I'll take responsibility for it. I'm not fussed about length or anything, I just wanted something where I could post longer works, along with other people, that's all.

Edit: I looked at the thread. People were mostly up for it, then counted out because of the "planning" and other complications. I've run short story contests before, the idea being that there would be a theme, people would enter, then there'd be a week to vote for the winner. Sometimes I only got three entries, but at least there were some. I never did any planning or moderation -- I just came up with a theme and let the winners suggest the next one. Stories were voted for on the basis of whether people liked them or not.

I noticed that Brian and you quite liked the idea. Might it be worth trying out as an experiment? No planning, no commitment, just a theme, a deadline and a poll that runs for a fortnight.
 
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Actually, digs, the 75 word Challenge does start on the first of every month (if the theme-setter is ready...). It ends well in advance so as to give the 5 days for reading and voting and then the two days for the tie-break if needed -- and most months the last day of the tie-break is indeed, the last day of the month. So there is a basic underlying logic to it. That's not to say that other dates can't work -- the legal profession used quarter days for centuries -- but, frankly, picking the solstices for no other apparent reason than it looks exciting/cool/neat/adjective-of-choice seems, well, misguided.

My thoughts:
(1) I would not support anything which interfered with the success of the 75-word Challenge.

(2) I would not be available as a mod to do much by way of admin/organising (I leave the 75-worder to Teresa and Cul for very good reasons).

(3) We have repeatedly seen that -- with very few exceptions -- the only people who vote in the 75-worder are those who contribute a story. Moreover, not everyone who does write a story then bothers to vote. Therefore the fewer participants, the fewer votes, the less worthwhile it is as a contest.

(4) One of the great challenges of the 75-worder is to write within that specific limit. It also means that the stories are much the same length and therefore easy to weigh against one another. The higher the limit, the greater variety of length in stories and therefore the harder to make comparisons, and the less satisfactory the decision-making.

(5) We have imposed a limit of 1500 words in Critiques for the very good reason (inter alia) that work over this limit rarely gets read and commented upon. I find it hard to believe that people will read several stories of several thousand words each in order to vote in any meaningful way.

(6) Most people rattle off the stories for the 75-worder. I seem to be the only sad individual who spends days in the actual writing. This means that it encourages a greater amount of participation than is going to be found in a contest which requires several thousand words for an individual piece. The higher the word limit, the less likely it is that people will find the time or make the effort to enter.

(7) A story which is good enough to post here as an entry should be good enough to be submitted for publication. Enter a short story contest which is private, and if you don't win you can still try and tweak the story and submit it somewhere. This is an open site and therefore the chance of re-using a story is as good as lost. This will also deter some people.

(8) The 75-worder is a bit of fun which, I sincerely hope, no one takes too seriously -- but nonetheless receiving no votes and few or no honourable mentions for something of which you are proud can be distressing. Writing a long story which might take a considerable amount of time and effort will involve a greater degree of emotional investment -- and therefore a greater degree of emotion if the story receives no votes, and consequently a greater risk of upset within AW.

(9) I'm not an expert, but the short story contests I've seen require anonymity so that people who vote, do vote for the story, not for the person. That ain't gonna happen here -- so again the decision-making is not as good as it should be. With the 75-worder, and a monthly contest, that isn't a problem. Elsewhere it might be.

Finally, cheating. Sorry to raise this ugly head, but if there's an elephant in the room, I like to talk about it. We have a rule in the 75-worder that one cannot vote for oneself. We have no way of knowing whether anyone does. I hope not. But with the great number of participants one vote only makes a difference if the story has already picked up several votes and therefore is, in a sense, a worthy winner. (No winner has received fewer than 5 votes.) With fewer participants, and therefore fewer voters, there must be a real risk of several stories having, say, two votes, and therefore that "cheating" one would be decisive. This -- to my mind -- is another reason to want to increase participation, which -- again to my mind -- means bringing the word limit down.


Sorry to have wittered on at such length. The points I've made are none of them insuperable, but collectively they push me to think that a challenge of this kind isn't something which should be rushed. Having said, that we were greatly surprised by the enthusiasm for the 75-worder -- we originally only expected about 20 or so entries each month -- and some of the concerns we had proved unjustified.
 
I'd hate to think of anything interfering with the 75 word challenge. Hopefully, it wouldn't. All the other points are good ones, though. Still, it was worth a thought.
 
Bella, I see you want somewhere to post longer works. Are you doing this to get feedback, ie you want to improve and you want help? If so, the place for that is Critiques.** If you just have an urge to share your work, you can put it on your blog. I can't see that a contest is the way to go about it, though, is it? Unless you were planning to have unlimited entries to the Challenge, that would only provide you with one story outlet every 3 months, which hardly seems worth the effort.

If you want to write shorts, there are plenty of contests and plenty of magazines. Mouse is a fount of knowledge on that score, and there's Duotrope's Digest


** in terms of how long you've been with us, I still think it's a bit early for you to jump in there with your own work, despite your enthusiastic participation in AW. But have a look at some of the threads and start critiquing, and that will provide a good foundation.
 
Bella, I see you want somewhere to post longer works. Are you doing this to get feedback, ie you want to improve and you want help?

Mostly for the fun and the experience. And yeah, perhaps some help. I'm aware that I'd need to get a few hundred posts made before I could put my own work up for critique.

If so, the place for that is Critiques.** If you just have an urge to share your work, you can put it on your blog. I can't see that a contest is the way to go about it, though, is it? Unless you were planning to have unlimited entries to the Challenge, that would only provide you with one story outlet every 3 months, which hardly seems worth the effort.
The idea was to create an environment for others to share in the fun. This is not, and never was, about indulging myself. I've seen it done successfully elsewhere and hoped to bring that success here.

If you want to write shorts, there are plenty of contests and plenty of magazines. Mouse is a fount of knowledge on that score, and there's Duotrope's Digest
Thanks for the info.


** in terms of how long you've been with us, I still think it's a bit early for you to jump in there with your own work, despite your enthusiastic participation in AW. But have a look at some of the threads and start critiquing, and that will provide a good foundation.
Ah. I thought I'd have to be able to post stuff there to offer crit. Thanks for that.
 
Ah. One of the members -- may have been a mod -- I didn't check -- suggested that I start this thread, otherwise I wouldn't have done so. I'll have a look at that link.

Ah, that was me wot suggested a discussion thread to see the possible interest in a longer competition - forgot we needed a moderator/administrator to do it... sorry. But the discussion re a possible longer competition is still valid...
 
Ah, that was me wot suggested a discussion thread to see the possible interest in a longer competition - forgot we needed a moderator/administrator to do it... sorry. But the discussion re a possible longer competition is still valid...
I didn't want to get you into trouble by mentioning you by name, Boney. I'm glad you suggested it, though, even if it did get a bit of controversy going. Not that I intended to cause any, if you catch my drift.

I'll stop babbling now.
 
Wouldn't enter the challenge myself, as the short stories I write, I write for publication... Just wanted to nip in here (and nip is the right word, I'm snowed in so working from home. Too many distractions!!) to say 'Mouse' and 'fount of knowledge' in the same sentence?! :D Cool.
 
Mind if I pick your brain, then? I'd love to know if there's a thread with links to the sites we can post entries for short stories on, of if I should refer to Duotrope for that. It's pretty useful, but also very big.
 
I'm not sure if there's a thread here listing competitions, but you could try a search for it.

Been a long time since I entered a comp, but I do still have some links saved on my computer.

Writing Competitions Is pretty good. Lots on there with all the details and whatnot.

There's the Writer's and Artist's Yearbook one, but I think that's over now: Writing competition 2010 : Writers and Artists

And this is like duotrope for competitions: Competitions - Free Writing Poetry / Fiction Contests (firstwriter)
 

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