Varys: What's his motivation? (Mild ADWD spoilers)

[Groot]

Illyrio's wife maybe from the female line of Blackfyre's, So maybe Aegon might be their son?


Illyrio arranged Dany's marriage to Drogo in an attempt to get rid of the her in the East, but then why would he have given her the dragon eggs?


Just some thoughts, what do you think?

 

[Boaz]

Illyrio placing his own son upon the Iron Throne? That's completely new to me... I've never considered that Illyrio might have motives beyond power and finance. Is there a description of his wife?

If Aegon is fake, then Connington cannot know. He is motivated by two things.... justice for Rhaegar and vengeance for himself. I don't think it would have been too hard for Illyrio and Varys to convince him that Aegon was smuggled out in secret and yet kept separately from Viserys and Daenerys... so as not to put all of their dragon eggs in one basket.

As for the eggs that Illyrio gave Dany... Illyrio may have wanted to make Dany happy and convince Drogo to never attack Pentos... Or he may have thought he could give her a highly sentimental gift on the cheap... Yet, I think GRRM wrote it as a convenient means to introduce dragons.

I don't think Dany's marriage was arranged as "an attempt to get rid of the her in the East." I believe it was an attempt to use the Dothraki to install Viserys upon the Iron Throne. If Viserys was successful, then Illyrio gains an ally who owes him greatly. If Viserys failed, Illyrio could blame Drogo and deny involvement. And in either case, the Dothraki would not be focused on Pentos, would be lessened in numbers, and likely sated with plunder for a while.

 

[Brian G Turner]

Interesting - Illyrio's gift of eggs always seemed very ostentatious.

And we have him plotting with Varys when Arya overhears them. I always wondered why Illyrio would go to King's Landing just to chat with Varys about an update.

Certainly there's room to claim there's more to Illyrio. Will be interesting to see what more comes up*.

*Has him being a Faceless Man already come up?

 

[Anushka Mokosh]

Illyrio's wife maybe from the female line of Blackfyre's, So maybe Aegon might be their son?


Illyrio arranged Dany's marriage to Drogo in an attempt to get rid of the her in the East, but then why would he have given her the dragon eggs?


Just some thoughts, what do you think?

I would think he gave her dragon eggs as a part of his personal gamble. If she revives them, she owes to him for her dragons. If she does, and he shows her Aegon, "son of Rhaegar", she would be like to help him for the throne for Aegon has the best claim. Remember that when Dany left, she was pretty meek and willing to please.

And if she doesn't, well, his bet failed, but Illyrio did say that you can't gamble unless you are prepared to take a loss.

Interesting - Illyrio's gift of eggs always seemed very ostentatious.

And we have him plotting with Varys when Arya overhears them. I always wondered why Illyrio would go to King's Landing just to chat with Varys about an update.

Certainly there's room to claim there's more to Illyrio. Will be interesting to see what more comes up*.

*Has him being a Faceless Man already come up?

I think that was Imp's theory, that Varys and Illyrio are in charge of FM.

 

[Groot]

No way Aegon is the son of Rhaegar, their are too many mentions of the "false dragon" in Danys visions and Brans I think it was.


He must be a blackfyre.

 

[ArstenWhitebeard]

Yeah I am in agreement Groot. I really think Aegon is a fake.

I have no idea what Vary's motivation is but I am pretty sure he wants either Faegon or Dany to sit the throne. I personaly doubt that Varys is a FM, but he may very well have some Targ blood in him. It is hard to take any of his "back stories" as true so it's completely up in the air.

Someone had mentioned a theory before that Shae or Bron or both may have been in Varys' pay (possible) or were even his "Little Birds" all growed up, which would be impossible since they both have their tongues.

 

[Boaz]

The story (I say story because many think Aegon is fake) of the scheme that saved Rhaegar's son in order put him on the throne in the future revolves around only a handful of people.

The only person definitely involved in any escape was Elia. A baby could not be taken from his mother without her knowledge. My guess is that Rhaegar and Ashara were involved as well. I doubt Elia told Oberyn. If he'd known, he probably would have pushed for a war. Varys might have not been included in the plan, but I'm sure he knew about it. If he was against Rhaegar, he could have exposed the whole thing to Aerys II. Even if he was not involved, he could have kept tabs on Aegon's locale and/or passed the info to Illyrio.

Even if Aegon died at Gregor's hands, Illyrio and Varys would have told fake Aegon a similar tale.

Only a few people knew of Aegon's upbringing... Illyrio, Varys, and Connington. Connington was rumored to have drank himself to death within a few years of his exile. That suggests to me that he was contacted soon after Robert's coronation and quickly included in Illyrio's plan.

Now whether Illyrio gave the real Aegon or a fake Aegon to Connington, I dunno. But I'm convinced that Connington believes Aegon is real.

A few people know of Aegon's existence... Haldon, Duck, Lemore, Yandry, and Ysilla. But only Illyrio (mayhaps Varys) knows the truth of Aegon.

A-roc, I dunno about Illyrio, Varys, and Serra all being siblings. The only independent source of info on Vays is Illyrio and vice-versa. Hey, I love Targ conspiracy theories! But unlike Tyrion (Cersei, Jaime, Sansa, Jon, Bran, and Catelyn all give us POV insight into his life while Varys, Oberyn, Shae, Pod, and Tywin all corroborate info on him), we get next to nothing at all for Varys. Pycelle and Robert confirm he served Aerys II. Arya's, Tyrion's, and Kevan's POVs confirm he knows the secrets of the Red Keep. Edwards, Tyrion's and Jaime's POVs show he is a master of disguise. But that is all. The rest we have to take on faith that he's telling the truth. Are we really to believe what a spymaster and his ally tell us about themselves?

I've not added anything new with this post. I'm just pointing out that it could all be lies.

 

[Anushka Mokosh]

The story (I say story because many think Aegon is fake) of the scheme that saved Rhaegar's son in order put him on the throne in the future revolves around only a handful of people.

The only person definitely involved in any escape was Elia. A baby could not be taken from his mother without her knowledge. My guess is that Rhaegar and Ashara were involved as well. I doubt Elia told Oberyn. If he'd known, he probably would have pushed for a war. Varys might have not been included in the plan, but I'm sure he knew about it. If he was against Rhaegar, he could have exposed the whole thing to Aerys II. Even if he was not involved, he could have kept tabs on Aegon's locale and/or passed the info to Illyrio.

Even if Aegon died at Gregor's hands, Illyrio and Varys would have told fake Aegon a similar tale.

Only a few people knew of Aegon's upbringing... Illyrio, Varys, and Connington. Connington was rumored to have drank himself to death within a few years of his exile. That suggests to me that he was contacted soon after Robert's coronation and quickly included in Illyrio's plan.

Now whether Illyrio gave the real Aegon or a fake Aegon to Connington, I dunno. But I'm convinced that Connington believes Aegon is real.

A few people know of Aegon's existence... Haldon, Duck, Lemore, Yandry, and Ysilla. But only Illyrio (mayhaps Varys) knows the truth of Aegon.

A-roc, I dunno about Illyrio, Varys, and Serra all being siblings. The only independent source of info on Vays is Illyrio and vice-versa. Hey, I love Targ conspiracy theories! But unlike Tyrion (Cersei, Jaime, Sansa, Jon, Bran, and Catelyn all give us POV insight into his life while Varys, Oberyn, Shae, Pod, and Tywin all corroborate info on him), we get next to nothing at all for Varys. Pycelle and Robert confirm he served Aerys II. Arya's, Tyrion's, and Kevan's POVs confirm he knows the secrets of the Red Keep. Edwards, Tyrion's and Jaime's POVs show he is a master of disguise. But that is all. The rest we have to take on faith that he's telling the truth. Are we really to believe what a spymaster and his ally tell us about themselves?

I've not added anything new with this post. I'm just pointing out that it could all be lies.

This is what kills me about Varys. He is probably my favourite character, but we only know about him what he chooses to reveal. FFS, I had been suspicious of his play the entire time I read the books and there were so many instance where I was like, is he really being forced or is he just pretending to be? And then Epilogue of ADWD struck and a lot of people were just stumped. So much got new light shed on it, or rather, the light suddenly changed colour making essentially all we know about Varys highly questionable. Even the tale Illyrio tells to Tyrion is put into question because it just seems hard to understand some of the motivations for his earlier actions, e.g. his early interest in Westeros and his supposed interest in Aegon returning to rule because he would be a good king.