Happy or not happy endings ... thoughts?

[Lukron]

Recently I have been influenced by Kurt Vonnegut's shapes of stories, so I do think a story needs to come to some kind of resolution.

I have also been doing some Greek tragedy as well, and I think that is the counterpoint to the hero's journey that Kurt is elaborating.

I have to agree with the sentiment that it depends on the story. I understand more experimental/existential stuff that wants to make the point that life doesn't have endings at all. Depends on whether you want to give the reader the experience of a closed story with a resolution and release of tension at the end, or something different.

 

[Hex]

Hex, I'm intrigued to hear what it is you don't like about tragedy. Why does it break your heart? Do you like Macbeth, or...?

Phyre -- I don't really like things that make me sad.

I tend to read fantasy for relaxation so I get really involved in the characters and I get upset if the ending is depressing (not seriously upset, but it feels unpleasant).

On the other hand, although I won't read the Joe Abercrombie trilogy again (brilliant as I thought it was), I didn't think the end was wholly depressing -- it was happy for some characters, and I liked that.

Did anyone read Lloyd Alexander's Taran books? I think the end of The High King was pretty perfect and I suppose that's bittersweet.

I never liked Macbeth. Not for reading for fun. I quite like Twelfth Night, though. My favourite not-fantasy for years was Middlemarch because Dorothea tries so hard to be good and it pleased me that she was rewarded (if you see Will Ladislaw as a reward).

 

[Aminar]

Haha I was thinking please don't do it Canavan, please don't do it...oh you did it -_- well that is just stupid at the end of the Black trilogy, I had high hopes for the ending of the White trilogy, then massive disappointment...

The Mistborn trilogy has possibly the greatest ending ever for what happened. He felt no need to shy away from the, to me "correct" ending, and it gave so much more impact...truly masterfull...

I remember finishing Mistborn. I wanted to be angry or upset or something. But all I could think was, That really had to happen. It hurt but it felt so good.

 

[kshRox]

I never read The Bridge to Teribithia but viewing the movie I became so emotionally invested in the protagonist that the ending unsettled me in a deeply profound manner. I kept waiting for some twist, turn or surprise to save us, save me from this unimaginable tragedy. I didn't understand why Emma Thompson insisted her protagonist in Stranger Than Fiction had to die until after viewing The Bridge to Teribithia.

I wanted her to come back so bad, to have some weird twist make it not so. But then it would not have had the profound effect it did. I hope some day to create a character that touches another as this character touched me.

This was a perfect ending. There was poignant loss yet at the same time, strength, wisdom and love. The lives and relationships she touched were not uplifted but transformed giving her a legacy that allowed her to live on through others. Not over the top or forced, but very real and very immediate.

Others may not have felt this, but as the father of daughters this story left an impression which makes me cherish them all the more.

 

[Aminar]

I never read The Bridge to Teribithia but viewing the movie I became so emotionally invested in the protagonist that the ending unsettled me in a deeply profound manner. I kept waiting for some twist, turn or surprise to save us, save me from this unimaginable tragedy. I didn't understand why Emma Thompson insisted her protagonist in Stranger Than Fiction had to die until after viewing The Bridge to Teribithia.

I wanted her to come back so bad, to have some weird twist make it not so. But then it would not have had the profound effect it did. I hope some day to create a character that touches another as this character touched me.

This was a perfect ending. There was poignant loss yet at the same time, strength, wisdom and love. The lives and relationships she touched were not uplifted but transformed giving her a legacy that allowed her to live on through others. Not over the top or forced, but very real and very immediate.

Others may not have felt this, but as the father of daughters this story left an impression which makes me cherish them all the more.

Bridge to Terabithia lies. It's got such a cool name and such an ordinary story. The ending is beautiful, but I will always hate the book for wasting such a cool name.

 

[kshRox]

Bridge to Terabithia lies. It's got such a cool name and such an ordinary story. The ending is beautiful, but I will always hate the book for wasting such a cool name.

Yea, your right. I hadn't thought about that, but it is a really cool name.
Terabithia . . .

 

[nightdreamer]

I'm with allmywires when it comes to making an emotional investment in the characters. If it's going to be a tragic ending, then it had better come as the logical (and in retrospect perhaps inevitable) consequence of the plot. It's the worst when tragedy seems to be thrown in unnecessarily just to make "impact," whereupon I come out of it feeling betrayed and angry, often sorry I even read the novel. I've never read Gone with the Wind, and I never will after seeing the immortal film. I'm assuming that it followed the novel rather closely, which implies that Mitchell simply tried to stuff as much tragedy into the ending as she possibly could, far beyond making her point. Kylara mentioned Mistborn, and I have to disagree with her on the ending. Part of it was brilliant, but part of it left me with that feeling of betrayal. Sanderson could have retained the cleverness and satisfaction of the ending another way. What set me off the most was The Amber Spyglass, where Pullman had to invoke deus ex machina to make the ending unhappy. Jeesh!

I think it was Robert Silverberg that said something to the effect that you don't write a book about stranded astronauts working to repair their spaceship on some alien planet only to have them smashed by an asteroid as soon as they reach orbit.

Above all, avoid what I call "The Hollywood shocker ending." You know what I mean. You think the good guys have won, only to be slammed with some unlikely revelation just before the credits that renders the whole plot futile. It's so trite it's sickening. I believe that their formula generator can't come up with a good ending, so they just throw in some "impact" to hide the fact. Not that I think you would do that, but this is something that galls me enough that I rant about it from time to time.

 

[kshRox]

I think it was Robert Silverberg that said something to the effect that you don't write a book about stranded astronauts working to repair their spaceship on some alien planet only to have them smashed by an asteroid as soon as they reach orbit.

OMG - That sounds hilarious to someone who did not invest time in reading the book or becoming attached to the characters.

 

[allmywires]

What set me off the most was The Amber Spyglass, where Pullman had to invoke deus ex machina to make the ending unhappy. Jeesh!

Yeah, talk about bucking the trend!

Those were some of my favourite books as a child. And the ending was so sad, but I still remember it really clearly. I'm sort of glad they never managed to make that a film (or ruin it as a film, depending on your view of the Golden Compass). Some books you just can't match in film. I'll always maintain that.

 

[psychotick]

Hi,

For me the ending to LOTR was perfect. Bittersweet. He saved Middle Earth but not for himself. I loved that. On the other hand the ending to Mist (the movie version) was absolutely aweful. And not just because it was meant to be aweful. But I got to the end of the movie and thought to myself, after all that struggle, what was the damned point. He should have just shot himself in the head at the start and been done with it. It would have saved me an hour and a half of watching the movie and wondering how they would escape. And since I usually identify with a character on an emotional level, I would prefer to be dead then to shoot innocent people.

Another movie that got me the same way is Seven. What an absolute carp ending.

For me the ending has to fit the story. But it doesn't have to be so bad that it makes everything that has come before turn out to have been a complete waste of time. So I'm happy for the heroe to die heroically, if he's achieved his goals. I'm not so happy for him to die heroically, having failed completely. And if the ending comes about through some completely trite plot device, so much the worse.

Cheers, Greg.

 

[Aminar]

Yeah, talk about bucking the trend!

Those were some of my favourite books as a child. And the ending was so sad, but I still remember it really clearly. I'm sort of glad they never managed to make that a film (or ruin it as a film, depending on your view of the Golden Compass). Some books you just can't match in film. I'll always maintain that.

And breaking character... I still beloved one or the other would have changed dimensions. Their reasons were so infuriatingly stupid...

 

[allmywires]

And breaking character... I still beloved one or the other would have changed dimensions. Their reasons were so infuriatingly stupid...

I'm sure they would have rather lived together for a bit rather than apart from a lifetime...but then I guess if whoever switched dimension changed their mind, they'd be bitter and arguments would ensue. *remembers it's not real*

 

[Gumboot]

I quite like bittersweet endings. "Lord of the Rings" kind of set the tone of that, but most fantasy seems to have reverted to the fairy tale "happily ever after" ending. Many of the stories I most enjoy wrap up with the good guys "winning", but the hero not really "winning" personally.

One of the best examples is Fitz in "The Farseer Trilogy".

 

[kshRox]

Yeah, talk about bucking the trend!

Those were some of my favourite books as a child. And the ending was so sad, but I still remember it really clearly. I'm sort of glad they never managed to make that a film (or ruin it as a film, depending on your view of the Golden Compass). Some books you just can't match in film. I'll always maintain that.

I liked the Golden Compass and was disappointed they never followed up with a sequel. I thought it was the 1st story of a trilogy.

 

[Kylara]

Something that does bug me about endings is when the story ends in an acceptable alright fashion and then a few weeks/months/years later (on the next page) they are revisited and all is roses, very annoying...

 

[James Coote]

It's not about happy or sad. Real endings are about regret. Does the resolution leave regret in the characters' hearts or are they broadly speaking 'happy' with it?

 

[AJB]

This has been mentioned in various ways, but I like multi-layered endings. Mixed emotions, unexpectedness, resolution, open-endedness, tragedy, joy... Mind, this might not be easy to do or may not even be right for particular stories.Just a thought: The end of the novel/film may not be the only 'ending' in the book. There may be different threads of story that finish in varying ways, which could be one method of creating multi-layered endings.On a slightly different note. Stories which are not in chronological order can be interesting. One that pops in my head is Pulp Fiction. Although the 'end' of the film has the two of the main characters walking into the sunset (literally) we know that later on, one of these characters gets killed. By playing with the 'Hollywood Ending' convention, this gave the audience the tradition happy ending (sort of) while bringing depth through hindsight.AJB

 

[Colbey Frost]

When I begin writing, I always want everyone to die at the end. I get bored easily and don't want to return to the same characters. But in time they grow on me and this changes... mostly.

 

[kshRox]

When I begin writing, I always want everyone to die at the end. I get bored easily and don't want to return to the same characters. But in time they grow on me and this changes... mostly.

Remind me to start kissing up early if I ever find myself in one of your novels!

 

[psychotick]

Hi,

Re: The Golden Compass. Yes the books are a trilogy and a trilogy was planned for the movies as well. Sales in the US didn't pan out well enough, And so even though later sales around the rest of the world, and then dvds put the first movie into serious profit, the sequels were quietly shelved.

The producers claimed it was because of the anti catholic church vibe of the movie, but that was really just an excuse. It's all about the dollars.

Cheers, Greg.