34.08: Mummy on the Orient Express

The lack of air didn't appear to affect the Doctor in the least.

And while it appeared that it was supposed to be jesting on the Doctor's part, he did tell Clara (after telling her that he moved everyone to this planet) that he had just taken her and blown up the train with everyone else aboard. Which one are we to believe?

I thought that his different biology just meant he wasn't running out of breath as quickly as the others. But yeah, for a while, especially as he was seeming quite shifty, I did think he might be lying and had only saved Clara, leaving everyone else to die. But then Frank Skinner turned up in the TARDIS, so if he saved him too then he probably saved all of them.

Was it just me, or when the Doctor was talking to himself, before the jelly babies in the cigarette case, did he seem to channel the voice of the 4th Doctor?

I heard that! Or at least thought it I heard it, too.
 
And I thought I was bitter and jaded!...

Okay, I'll bite.
OK: we have an orient express snaking through space from side to side: why?
It's a replica train made in some far flung future purely for the purpose of nostalgia... why wouldn't it snake from side to side as if it were on tracks? Of course, the main reason is "because it looks neat on screen", but there is no reason why it shouldn't.
Why when it stopped did it go all funny with kinked carriages.
I'd assume that all the systems didn't shut down in the exact same nanosecond instant, thus some continue onwards a bit longer, or perhaps some had some inertia dampening that lasted a bit longer. Etc etc. I'd also say again "because it looks neat on screen" but there is no reason why it shouldn't.
(it's worth noting, that neither such "there's no reason why it shouldn't" answer could possibly apply to last week, which had utterly nonsensical science that was beyond belief :))
Why was the train there at all. Whoever set it up could just as easily arranged for the train effect in a the 'holodeck' - ARE THEY REALLY SINKING THAT LOW without the need to actually be on a holodeck on a train.
Nostalgia trip. Once again, mentioned in the episode (they didn't make a big deal of it, but once again, if you're making a replica, why not?)
Edit: Also, thinking about it. It's easy to break out of a holodeck and avoid it's test. it's harder to break out of a stranded space-train surrounded by the coldness of space.
Why was the door from the baggage car coming away from the Tardis in the side of the carriage, yet Clara got to the storage area with the stasis thing in it, at the end of a carriage?
No idea, I didn't notice anything odd at that part. I assume I missed it.
Are we going to see more of the sonic shoe? Why not use the other shoe to get out?
Now you're just being silly :)
What an earth was the countdown timer on the screen about. When have we ever had that point of view before.
TV show. Benefit of the viewer no doubt. There was at least one instance in a Tennant episode where I remember an on screen timer for something. I'm sure I'm not making that up :) someone else might have to confirm though.
Not to mention Three Lions on his shirt guy sticking his appearance in. Why would he know anything about the inner workings of a Tardis and what was his expertise exactly?
It was never stated how far in the future the replica Orient Express was. Given the holograms and AI, we can safely assume "far". Thus it's not implausible that he might recognise a form of vaguely familiar technology, in the same way that a pilot might recognise a throttle equivalent in a space ship a few hundred years in the future.
The rolls of plans was just crap. Oh and since he lived it's likely Who did save them all - surely he would have kicked off at Clara if Who had left them all to die. Plus when Who found the teleport innards of the mummy, he was intent on using it to recue them to the Tardis. (forcefield be damned) I think we can allow that if there's something Who knows about, it's teleport devices and their use.
Agreed on those! I kind of assumed that once the AI got what it wanted, and shut down the power, the forcefields just went with it (yes, convenient, but...)
Grabbing someone's mind/personality using what exactly? How handy would that have been in previous episodes?
Who knows! Implied that it was malfunctioning tech I think...
And while we're at it, as someone asked, why was she there at all?
Fair question. For all we know, she might have been an expert on alien language. (but yes, slightly ropey plotting there I would say)
Why the old lady was there was obvious though. She was an expert in dying.
She could have been an expert in all sorts of things. We didn't know her long enough to know.
So some unknown adversary hi-jacks the Tardis and plonks Who into a new adventure.
He was invited. Several times in fact. He said that explicitly. He decided to finally go see what was going on.
Clara, in the interim from the last - go screw yourself ending of the episode - has forgiven Who enough that the trot of for one last trip - the boyfriend who won't remember anything of a conversation he had with Clara,** is perfectly fine with it all, despite his previous 'he's going to get you killed' attitude toward Who.
Slightly cheesy, but people have arguments, they say things in the heat of the moment, then they think it through and change their minds. It's life. It happens.
then we get an elaborate load of nonsense whereby some people get killed by an apparition only they can see just to convince the captain to let Who deal with something he's been dragged half way across the universe for the sole purpose of investigating.
Reasons yet to be discovered it seems. Whoever was behind the AI (or indeed, perhaps just 'the AI')
All those experts - did any of them speak - I can't remember.
Not that I remember no. That bothered me too!
Given the rate of attrition, every ten minutes or so, would there have been anyone left to die on the train by the time Who turned up? He got his invite weeks ago.
Time travel!... he mentioned having the invite many times in the past.
And so, so entity, knowing Who's abilities, gets him to solve his problem of how the mummy works so he can back engineer it. Marvelous. Four Billion years (estimate) of development and someone who can capture a Tardis, imprison Who and develop a space train with all it's gadgets, can't figure a better way to kill people. Ooh I know, maybe they could capture people (using a teleport device maybe) put them on a space train, buy an alarm clock and shock them all to death with an early morning call. (Or even evacuate the air from their sleeper).
- The Tardis wasn't captured.
- I have no idea where you're getting 4 billions years of development from?...
- I would bet good money that the Doctor could have disabled the force field if he wanted to, but then what? He was there for the mystery. he CHOSE to go there for the mystery. Again, this was explicitly stated.
Giving the plot a bit of leeway - if we are to assume that the AI was the one doing this on it's own back (for whatever reason) how else would a system with no means of directly interacting with people get everyone in the same place? Invites to a trip of a lifetime while organising shipment of the thing it wants investigating! Seems reasonable if you look at it that way..
Clara? - She exists in all Who's timeline remember - Could be - Maybe Who's pissed her off so much by the last episode she thinks a little payback is due.
I actually really like this idea :) I'd considered something similar myself.
The Master? - Could be - He's done the rounds, maybe this is just another one.
He was always known for ridiculously convoluted ploys...
Anyway, basically - Usual poor standard IMO.
To be fair... you seem as if you're going into it LOOKING for everything you can pick a hole in. Even where there isn't necessarily a hole to pick.

Don't get me wrong, some of it has plot holes a mile wide - last week had plot holes a whole MOON wide - but as far as implausibility goes?... this one wasn't that bad.

right... back to work now :)
 
Love a good discussion;)

It's a replica train made in some far flung future purely for the purpose of nostalgia... why wouldn't it snake from side to side as if it were on tracks? Of course, the main reason is "because it looks neat on screen", but there is no reason why it shouldn't.

Hence the 4B years guess below. All that snaking would require massive amounts of inertia control stuff to stop the passengers being thrown from side to side: it'd be like an episode of Voyage to the bottom of the sea. And the effect would only be seen from the outside anyway.


I'd assume that all the systems didn't shut down in the exact same nanosecond instant, thus some continue onwards a bit longer, or perhaps some had some inertia dampening that lasted a bit longer. Etc etc. I'd also say again "because it looks neat on screen" but there is no reason why it shouldn't.

Inertia again, this carriage stops that one doesn't - SMASH. IE. why didn't it just break apart?

Nostalgia trip. Once again, mentioned in the episode (they didn't make a big deal of it, but once again, if you're making a replica, why not?) Because it was a trap not an actual train.

Edit: Also, thinking about it. It's easy to break out of a holodeck and avoid it's test. it's harder to break out of a stranded space-train surrounded by the coldness of space.

But as you say, he volunteered so the subterfuge was unnecessary.

Door in the side? No idea, I didn't notice anything odd at that part. I assume I missed it.

Pay attention :)

Are we going to see more of the sonic shoe? Why not use the other shoe to get out?

Now you're just being silly :)

Oh I don't know - it seems to work a lot better/quicker than the screwdriver

TV show. Benefit of the viewer no doubt. There was at least one instance in a Tennant episode where I remember an on screen timer for something. I'm sure I'm not making that up :) someone else might have to confirm though.

That would have been another naff script then. If you want to have the viewer experience the count down, have a Three Lions man do it in the background, but don't do both.

It was never stated how far in the future the replica Orient Express was. Given the holograms and AI, we can safely assume "far". Thus it's not implausible that he might recognise a form of vaguely familiar technology, in the same way that a pilot might recognise a throttle equivalent in a space ship a few hundred years in the future.

He'd be the first: especially to actually offer advice.

She could have been an expert in all sorts of things. We didn't know her long enough to know.

But none of the other experts were there to add anything and really it was a trap/setup for Who. All they supplied was a body count.

- The Tardis wasn't captured.

Well technically it was. Given the symbiosis the Tardis has with Who it should have come screaming to his rescue 4 seconds before he was about to be done in at the hands of an entity that had put a force field round it. (Which points to Clara being responsible again)

- I have no idea where you're getting 4 billions years of development from?...

a guess similar to yours above

Giving the plot a bit of leeway - if we are to assume that the AI was the one doing this on it's own back (for whatever reason) how else would a system with no means of directly interacting with people get everyone in the same place? Invites to a trip of a lifetime while organising shipment of the thing it wants investigating! Seems reasonable if you look at it that way..

Hardly the trip of a lifetime in Who's case though. Hey Time-lord fancy a ride on a train?

And all to 'back engineer' the process just so it could kill people in a mysterious way. Whipping them out of existence (Like it did with the other passengers) is pretty mysterious enough I'd have thought.

Don't get me wrong, some of it has plot holes a mile wide - last week had plot holes a whole MOON wide - but as far as implausibility goes?... this one wasn't that bad.

Managed to escape having to watch that one - Apart from Clara kicking off.

 
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Well, I'm late with the blow-by-blow, but I'm watching it for the second time just before the new one tonight.

This is at least the second time the Doctor has said Clara might be malfunctioning (two emotions at once, this time).

Intestinal parasites? (What are you the doctor of?)

Call me Gus?

"I'm your worst nightmare." "A mystery shopper, oh great." "Really? That's your worst--"

"Can we get a new expert?"

"I can't tell if you're a genius or just incredibly arrogant." "Well, on a good day I'm both."

"You're a genius! This explains everything. Apart from what it is and how it's doing it. Sorry, I jumped the gun with that 'you're a genius, this explains everything' bit."

"I'm the Doctor and I will be your victim this evening."

"You can't hurt me until my time is up. I think."

"You're relieved, soldier." "He's not the only one."

As mentioned previously, I'm puzzled by the soldier saluting the person who just surrendered to him, and then obeying his order.

Ancient soldier being driven by malfunctioning tech.

The Doctor is still doing his frantic calculations, this time in the sand.

Why did he move her out of the TARDIS to let her sleep on the rocks?

"That job could change a man." "Yes, it does. Frequently."
 

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