Harnessing the community

Jo Zebedee

Jo Zebedee

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blah - flags. So many flags.
we've had a thread about this before, but it was in response to a specific comment on someone's blog, and I thought it would be useful to extend this out.

We have an amazing writing community here, by whatever quirk that happened, and an amazing reading community, and everything in between. I've been floored by the support from you all for my launch and I know eg @Mouse, for twitter parties etc even in a genre most of us know little about, had that support (and now has her own following and doesn't need us - I shed a tear at that twitter party and toasted the good ship Mouse).

What I wanted to get a picture of is - what is support? I can't, simply can't, afford to buy every Chronner's book (I get as many as I can) but I retweet anything that moves, beta read, share posts and blogs. Others review. One approach doesn't fit all.

But here are the things I think helps writers, and other creatives, coming through:

Buying. With the proviso above - no one should feel the need to buy something because it's a chronners, or guilty if they don't. It is only one way to support (but anyone want a space opera.... :D) but it is an important way. So, yes, purchasing.

Reviews. Only now am I realising how important they are. I'm no great reviewer - I always feel I have little to add - but I do plan to be more proactive in eg rating on Goodreads. But, as far as I can see, they're a huge boost to any writer.

Guesting/hosting blogs - allows the writer to reach a new audience and a double promo - from the host and guest. Kameron Hurley found it a useful strategy.

Interviews - nice because you can tweet/facebook. I've had a couple conducted by Chronners and, at this stage, they're profile building. And come up on some searches. Go, Thad and Ratsy!

Retweeting, twitter events. Using #sffchrons will get you picked up by a few of us who check it, and a retweet given.

Sharing on facebook, liking facebook pages, inviting relevant people to like (note, not spamming. But if someone likes fantasy and you have a page they might find interesting, why not?)

Facebook groups. Mouse started one and it seems to go well. I'm in a lively space opera one which allows promo once a month. Should we have a Chrons one?

Supporting short stories, spreading the word of them. Hitting the post so the hits go up (is reading optional? In a marketing savvy world it might be. :D)

Any I've missed? Could we be doing more? Thoughts?
 
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Great thread. I would add to your mention of reviews by saying that people can really help a writer by posting reviews on various places. The point of sale, other big retailers, Goodreads, LibraryThing, your own twitter account, your own blogs, or Facebook pages. If you like a book, or just want to help a writer out, talk about their books.

Specifically about reviews, if you want to help a writer, post a positive review with four or five stars. Anything lower and you're actively hurting that writer.
 
And remembering that no one is expected to do it all... As a community, if each of us did even one small thing - from buying a book to a simple retweet - it already helps.

Goodreads stumps me a little, I have to admit. I get lazy just thinking about it. Must spend a morning updating my shelf and writing up some reviews.

How about video/audio presence: google hangouts (@The Bluestocking is pretty savvy about those I think), podcasts, YouTube... Anyone have thoughts on use of stuff like that?
 
Vaguely worried the thread sounded like a guilt-trip, which was the exact opposite of what I meant by it.... Um. Yes, never any pressure anywhere, I hope, but gratitude for any support. But I like to know when I do something it's helpful and it's really just a sharing of what is. Um.
 
One problem with Goodreads is that it marks "friend" reviews as such, treating reviews by people you may not even know -- or barely know -- the same as if they were reviews by your actual friends and family. Which is one reason, perhaps, not to friend people on Goodreads too freely, especially people you became acquainted with in the first place because you admired their books.
 
Teresa Edgerton said:
One problem with Goodreads is that it marks "friend" reviews as such, treating reviews by people you may not even know -- or barely know -- the same as if they were reviews by your actual friends and family. Which is one reason, perhaps, not to friend people on Goodreads too freely, especially people you became acquainted with in the first place because you admired their books.
Click to expand...

Ah, I didn't know that, thanks. I shall be careful who I friend. :)
 
As mentioned, I quite like Twitter-stuff and interviews. I'm wary of reviews. The problem is, if I post something good then it might well be seen as coloured by a vested interest (especially if that writer then reviews *my* book). And if I post a bad [though honest] review, it hinders rather than helps.

Free short stories may help. They could remind people of a certain character/series' existence, or get people who haven't read it yet interested.
 
So, do we need a forum here for non-friendly reviews? ;)

Though I think our Critiques section already gives you Tough-Love. When I was a School Governor we were told we should be seen as Critical Friends.
 
I totally read the title as 'harassing the community'. :D

I've been lax lately, with promoting my own stuff as well as helping out other people. Been far, far too busy and stressed, what with all the house/hospital stuff and now work being vile.

I do plan on buying your book, springs, because I have beta'd it, and I want to see what you've changed! (As well as it being a good story, obvs.) But I can't afford it at the mo.

I've offered to do reviews, and I was supposed to be sent a review copy for something but never received it. I very rarely review books, so unless I'm sent a review copy, I'm unlikely to review a book. I'm not going out of my way to help people who don't help me. (Maybe reciprocity is the key... is that the right word?)

Always happy to host on my blog (and be hosted in return!)

I'm kinda ok on Goodreads so will help anybody who needs help on there. I have two author pages - one for each name.

Re Twitter, to be honest, I mostly Tweet about Hollyoaks and pick up most of my followers from that. HOs has a good LGBT following due to having good LGBT storylines and characters, so I'm hoping that whoever does follow me from that, checks out my Twitter profile!

I have to scoot to work now, sorry!
 
thaddeus6th said:
The problem is, if I post something good then it might well be seen as coloured by a vested interest (especially if that writer then reviews *my* book). And if I post a bad [though honest] review, it hinders rather than helps.
Click to expand...

IMO the usefulness of a review is not to say "this book is good or bad", but to make it clear what sort of book it is, so that the potential reader can decide whether this really might be for them, or not.

What is plot development like? Characters? Which authors is the book most like? What niggles or criticisms would a potential buyer find useful to determine whether this is for them, or not?

Also - if you're worried about being perceived to be reciprocating good reviews, then don't post your review to your own website, but instead just to Amazon.
 
I know a lot of people who say that when they are interested in buying a book they ignore all the 1 star and 5 star reviews. And yet those are the ones I often find the most revealing. With 5 star reviews, the reviewer is more likely to take the time to explain exactly why they are enthusiastic about the book. I find that useful because those same things may or may not appeal to me. If they appeal, then I'll read a few more reviews. If what the reviewer is commending is that there is lots and lots of exactly the kind of thing that doesn't appeal to me, then I'll avoid the book. There is a good chance I would not have found that out from a less enthusiastic reviewer. The 1 star reviews can be trickier. They may point out things that I really consider a problem, steering me away from a book. They may point out things that they hate, but that I would generally consider strengths. In that case, if there is a Kindle edition I will download the sample. Or they may just say, "the book was boring." (Not helpful.) Or, "The book was not delivered on time." (Not helpful either.) Yet the "book wasn't delivered on time" review gets averaged in with the rest, dragging down the rating, especially when there are only a handful of reviews. So, I am particularly interested in the content of the 1 star reviews.
 
I don't read reviews on Amazon very often**, but when I do, I tend to read all of them (as long as there aren't too many). After all, I don't know any of the reviewers and so why would I take only a few strangers' opinions seriously when I have no idea what they are looking for in a book?


** - And almost invariably after I've read the novel in question, so I'm looking less for recommendations than seeing what others made of the book. (Naturally, if people I know here recommend a book favourably, that's likely to increase the likelihood that I'll seek it out.)
 
Great thread!
I think that what everyone is ultimately after is traffic that leads to sales.
1. Correct me if I'm wrong but reviews hopefully will increase the chance of a sale.
2. Linking, tweeting, FB groups etc is supporting one another with the goal to increase the traffic levels.
These all sound good to me.

What I would like to do drive traffic to other authors sites. I'm sure that the old axiom of what goes around comes around will work.
 
Stephen Palmer said:
I've found 99% of 5* reviews to be utter bilge, usually it's OTT enthusing about a genre or something similar. 1* reviews are equally unremarkable, in my experience anyway. It's the 3* and 4* reviews that I read, when they are posted at all.
Click to expand...

Same here. I don't see much, if any, critical analysis in most 5* reviews. Usually they offer little more than gushing enthusiasm about a favourite character, or unabashed fan worship of the author. And a culture has grown up around ratings where anything less than a 5* is a penalty in the contest of overall ratings, so if you like a book at all it's your duty to give it 5*. I regard reviewers who throw around 5* like candy with a jaundiced eye. I'm a cranky, fussy reader, and appreciate reviewers who are the same. In my experience, 3* and 4* reviews are much more likely to offer critical analysis.
 
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