Why Are so Many of the Great Writers in Science Fiction, Fantasy and Horror Falling into Neglect ?

Extollager said:
Which I just mentioned in a private message to you, before seeing this! Yes, I have the Stoddard-Hodgson book, but haven't yet read it.
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Based on the Amazon reviews , it's book I might just check out.
 
Hugh said:
For me a guideline re "falling into neglect" is how often a once-well-known writer gets discussed in specialist SFF forums such as this.
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The thing about that is that I can think of authors who are still being published, a book or more a year, who have large fan bases, and are never or rarely mentioned here. No doubt many of their fans consider them "great." It's just that members here don't read them, may not have even heard of them, or if they read them didn't think much of them. Although this is, as specialist SFF forums go, a large one, our active membership is really a pretty small sample of the actual SFF readership. Those writers might be known and discussed on other forums, of course, or just not be particularly popular with the people who join forums. But so long as their sales figures are healthy, they are hardly being neglected.

As I have said before, who we believe is getting attention depends on who our friends are, who we talk about books with, what forums we belong to, what conventions and other events we go to, etc. And our impressions based on these can be pretty inaccurate.

And if this is true for writers who keep interest high among their fans by still publishing, it would be even more so for writers of the past. Because we may have read their books years ago, discussed them again and again with friends back then, but we don't bring them up in conversation much because we are reading new books and making new discoveries which we would rather talk about instead of rehashing conversations we've already had many times. That doesn't mean that those who like to reread old favorites have stopped reading those books. It just means we have stopped talking about them unless someone else brings up the authors' names or the titles of their books.
 
For an example of what I mean about writers of the past, take Hope Mirrlees, who wrote one highly regarded fantasy novel, Lud-in-the-Mist. I know for a fact that may people here have read that book at some time and admired it and think highly of it, because when someone starts a thread where people list the best fantasy novels they've read, inevitably a few people will list Lud-in-the-Mist. But nobody is actually discussing that book here (it's one of my favorites, one I have read several times since I first discovered it back in 1970, so I think I would notice if there were conversations about it). Several years ago, a couple of members here reviewed it and there was a little flurry of discussion—mostly of the "that sounds interesting, I'll have to read that book" variety if I remember correctly—but that was it, except, as I said, when someone lists the book as one they admire, but without, usually, saying why they admire it, or anything that could spark an interesting conversation.

But I can't say that she is neglected. As I write this, there are three or four editions of the book currently available on Amazon. Clearly new readers are discovering the book every year.
 
I would like to double-like @Teresa Edgerton 's second last post. There are books/films/TV series that I love, but I'm sick of saying the same things about them. There are discussions here at SFFChronicles that I haven't taken part in because what I would say is exactly what I have said before - and the posts are all still there if you dig deep enough, so why write them again. Also, that this might be the largest SFF Forum on the internet but it is still a very small proportion of people who actually read SFF. Finally, that reviews are very important to authors sales, but they are not at all, any indication of either the quality or popularity of a book.

tinkerdan said:
www.gutenberg.org

Project Gutenberg

Project Gutenberg is a library of free eBooks.
www.gutenberg.org www.gutenberg.org
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This would make a great reading list!
 
When I was at school I read quite a lot, but not a lot of old classics. Some Shakespeare for class, but that was more of an educational language reason then for any great enjoyment. Young people generally don't want to read old material. And I'm sure that goes for a couple of generations ago too. It is not like 50 years ago kids were hoovering up ancient texts.
But now with the internet it is much harder to get kids into old books, or any books. I find I read much less books due to the internet too. Such as from reading this thread..
I suppose teenagers still read an occasional classic for school? That is where they have to get some exposure. Hopefully without it all seeming completely dull.
Regarding Science Fiction, it is simply the nature of the genre that even a "classic" will soon lose its magic. Though the "Time Machine" is still superb, and an easy read.
 
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Judderman said:
When I was at school I read quite a lot, but not a lot of old classics. Some Shakespeare for class, but that was more of an educational language reason then for any great enjoyment. Young people generally don't want to read old material. And I'm sure that goes for a couple of generations ago too. It is not like 50 years ago kids were hoovering up ancient texts.
But now with the internet it is much harder to get kids into old books, or any books. I find I read much less books due to the internet too.
I suppose teenagers still read an occasional classic for school? That is where they have to get some exposure. Hopefully without it all seeming completely dull.
Regarding Science Fiction, it is simply the nature of the genre that even a "classic" will soon lose its magic. Though the "Time Machine" is still superb, and an easy read.
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In junior high I read as a reading assignment Dandelion Wine by Ray Bradbury. I recall liking it.
 
John Brunner is being scrubbed off my library shelves. They only have so much room so they have to periodically make room for new authors. The library offers a service where you can order a book from another library in the state, big selection you would think. Except it appears that he is being scrub off all the shelves. After much searching the library reference agent came up with The John Brunner Collection Volume Two: The Wrong End of Time, The Ladder in the Sky, and The Productions of Time. 2 to 3 weeks waiting time. No mention of Stand On Zanzibar. He's works are still easily found on line. Some had suggested that these on line finds might be signs of people dumping the books and not a sign of a diverse secondary market.

I guess his style of consequences over characterization is not in demand. Plenty of people writing what he wrote about but they have the advantage of seeing it in real life. His books haven't made it to the libraries ebook system, but that system is pretty much patchworked and you literally have to search each source of ebooks, no universal search through all their ebooks yet.

Rereading Sheep Look Up, while the overall severity isn't as deep as predicted, there are plenty of situations that are right on the mark. The narrow trends of extremism are widening out into popular channels. A thought I picked up from looking at Sheep Look Up again, is the idea that superstition might play a bigger role in the obstacles that could disrupt an orderly global wide march into the future. I never looked at superstition as anything that might take on a bigger role in the future. It took a new look at an old book for that thought to occur to me.
 
Ive got a new edition of Solaris by Stanslaw Lem. I would love to see him make a comeback. :cool:
 
Robert Zwilling said:
John Brunner is being scrubbed off my library shelves. They only have so much room so they have to periodically make room for new authors. The library offers a service where you can order a book from another library in the state, big selection you would think. Except it appears that he is being scrub off all the shelves. After much searching the library reference agent came up with The John Brunner Collection Volume Two: The Wrong End of Time, The Ladder in the Sky, and The Productions of Time. 2 to 3 weeks waiting time. No mention of Stand On Zanzibar. He's works are still easily found on line. Some had suggested that these on line finds might be signs of people dumping the books and not a sign of a diverse secondary market.

I guess his style of consequences over characterization is not in demand. Plenty of people writing what he wrote about but they have the advantage of seeing it in real life. His books haven't made it to the libraries ebook system, but that system is pretty much patchworked and you literally have to search each source of ebooks, no universal search through all their ebooks yet.

Rereading Sheep Look Up, while the overall severity isn't as deep as predicted, there are plenty of situations that are right on the mark. The narrow trends of extremism are widening out into popular channels. A thought I picked up from looking at Sheep Look Up again, is the idea that superstition might play a bigger role in the obstacles that could disrupt an orderly global wide march into the future. I never looked at superstition as anything that might take on a bigger role in the future. It took a new look at an old book for that thought to occur to me.
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He's largely being forgotten , or so it seems.
 
There are some stories and authors, including a lot of fluff, that will be with us forever (I like fluff).

Some that come to mind are
The Man Who Counts
The City and the Stars
Against the Fall of Night
The Menace From Earth
The Caves of Steel
The Sackett novels
The Colonel's Tiger
Novice

I don't think they will ever be neglected.

As an aside, Heinlein's sales are still holding up OK.
 
JimC said:
There are some stories and authors, including a lot of fluff, that will be with us forever (I like fluff).

Some that come to mind are
The Man Who Counts
The City and the Stars
Against the Fall of Night
The Menace From Earth
The Caves of Steel
The Sackett novels
The Colonel's Tiger
Novice

I don't think they will ever be neglected.

As an aside, Heinlein's sales are still holding up OK.
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Well said. :cool:
 
I guess there's a feeling that everything that was in SF has been done and is now science fact. I mean now we have personal jet packs for heaven's sake! There will soon be mountain rescue teams using them to get to unreachable people much quicker and cheaper than a helicopter. Iron Man is becoming real!
 
This may be a minor point in this discussion, but for science fiction (I have little interest in fantasy and practically none in horror) if it is a choice between a book published 1950 and one published 2020, and everything else is "equal", I would buy the 2020 one on the theory that the STEM background is more up to date and accurate.
 
TomMazanec said:
This may be a minor point in this discussion, but for science fiction (I have little interest in fantasy and practically none in horror) if it is a choice between a book published 1950 and one published 2020, and everything else is "equal", I would buy the 2020 one on the theory that the STEM background is more up to date and accurate.
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That is very interesting and a valid point. That has never been a consideration for me, and it probably never will, but now that you have mentioned it I am quite surprised that I have not really thought about SF like that, even if to discount that as a criterion.
 
Of course YMMV, and as I indicated that is only one of several criteria, but it is one I myself use sometimes.
 
If this has been said I apologies but I havent read all 8 pages.

The issue with any book is that 99% of them feel like the time it was written in, some books last yes but most fall away eventually because they represent a time and people that have passed.

Of course we have the classics like Lovecraft and Howard etc but they define a genre so they do last, everthing else just fades.

It is the same with music, at one point their were many crooners like Sinatra etc, now how many can any of us name?
 
It has to do with the way the world is. People, it seems, would rather have the depressing truth than a happy lie. Fairy tales are dead and gone. So it is going with fantasy. Sci fi is holding on by way of slim possibility of becoming real one day, but when you have authors like Martin or Rowling be so popular due to either urban style genre-aka, taking place on modern day Earth with modern day technology mixed in-or outright depressing grimdark of Martin-heroes don't survive war and all that sh*t.


It's really sad, and for my part, I'm trying to keep a little of the lighthearted, happier, sillier part alive with Tooninoot, but...


It seems to me that the days of the likes of Tolkien are buried, never to return. :(



For my two cents, I want the fairy tale. I don't want depressing real. I don't want depressing anything. But that's what we're being left with. Slaughter 90% of the characters that people actually have come to like. Let's throw in cars and parking meters and highways. Never mind giving any fantastical creatures or beings more than a soft minor aspect. Never mind letting a group of seasoned warriors and mages go out on an adventure. Never mind putting in solid romance and hope.


I just want my escapism to remain as potential escapism. If I wanted real, I'd go outside. The only classics surviving anything-and don't get me wrong, I really do adore the work of these authors-are the likes of Poe and Lovecraft. Those who put out the darker, more depressing, hopeless side of humanity. Meanwhile, anything silly, lighthearted, or fun like certain aspects of Wonderland...nope, can't have that...
 
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