Hugo 2020 Short Story nominees
- Thread starter Bick
- Start date
You do all know it’s voted for and only by members of Worldcons? Buy a membership and vote if you don’t like the direction of travel...
I was at Dublin 2019 last year, a really diverse Worldcon. It was fabulous. I welcome the opening up of our stuffy, one demographic led genre.
I was at Dublin 2019 last year, a really diverse Worldcon. It was fabulous. I welcome the opening up of our stuffy, one demographic led genre.
I disagree Jo - the problem for me (and my main gripe about the awards) is that the stories are simply not very good. Couple that with the narrow demographic a writer apparently has to align with to get nominated, and it understandably has folk shaking their heads. If the stories were great the discussion wouldn't arise. And yes, the Hugo's are also open to fantasy, but it would be nice (for me) if fantasy didn't almost completely eclipse SF.
I don't think the awards are reflecting the best of what's currently published, bottom line. You suggest its good to have moved away from a stuffy one demographic led genre. I expect you mean Caucasian men and women who (I hope we can forgive them) are straight? That would probably describe the majority of current SFF writers in the English language then? I'm interested to know why you think its good that all these 'stuffy' writers are apparently cold-shouldered because the're not in a 'diverse' demographic? Why is that refreshing exactly? Wouldn't it be more refreshing if the best stories were nominated regardless of whether an old white guy wrote the story or a young Asian lesbian, so long as they were good.
And yes, I'm well aware its voted by Worldcon members, I am one - I voted this year and discuss this issue earlier in the thread. It makes no difference, as the PC dice have been cast unfortunately.
Before we get into social politics, it's worth pointing out that the Hugo's is just a popularity contest. That cannot be equated with "quality" except in the most idealistic sense. We've seen discussion in other threads suggesting that the Hugo's haven't followed that ideal for perhaps decades.
In the meantime, if the popular opinion is to challenge existing boundaries to expand the genre of speculation fiction, then that's entirely up to those who do pay to vote. If people have problems with the Hugo's they should take it up with the organizers themselves.
Personally I'm getting tired of poisonous arguments about "popular" voting awards being brought here, because at the end of the day these awards only serve a minority of readers. Most people on chrons don't care about them and vice versa.
At the end of the day chrons is a community with a lot of science fiction and fantasy readers who can accept that different people have different tastes, and celebrate the enjoyment of reading in itself - as well as enjoyment of SFF across other genres. I think that's a better ideal than worrying about whose voting for what and where.
In the meantime, if we must discuss award cliques, discuss the nominees by all means but let's leave their politics off chrons, please.
In the meantime, if the popular opinion is to challenge existing boundaries to expand the genre of speculation fiction, then that's entirely up to those who do pay to vote. If people have problems with the Hugo's they should take it up with the organizers themselves.
Personally I'm getting tired of poisonous arguments about "popular" voting awards being brought here, because at the end of the day these awards only serve a minority of readers. Most people on chrons don't care about them and vice versa.
At the end of the day chrons is a community with a lot of science fiction and fantasy readers who can accept that different people have different tastes, and celebrate the enjoyment of reading in itself - as well as enjoyment of SFF across other genres. I think that's a better ideal than worrying about whose voting for what and where.
In the meantime, if we must discuss award cliques, discuss the nominees by all means but let's leave their politics off chrons, please.
I think Brian’s summed up my thinking pretty well there. In terms of the actual awards and whether the books etc chosen are rubbish - how very subjective. It may not be the type of Sff one person likes but it is patently the type others like.
In terms of the actual winners
The Three Body Problem (2015) is consistently talked about on this forum and others as a great modern sf book, is sf. Others shortlisted include Ancillary Justice, ditto.
2016 N K Jemisin (and again in 2017 and 2018) an original world that touches on both sff and which is considered a stand-out, again by many. It’s hardly PC niche territory (it also sells like mad)
I see Jim Butcher was shortlisted both years - he’s not exactly ‘out there’ in PC land. Also included is Neal Stephenson who is mainstream sf.
2017 - We’re seeing the likes of Becky Chambers popping up, a hugely popular series, sf not fantasy, and absolutely representative of what sf readers we’re buying and recommending that year.
These may not be to your taste, they may not be what you consider the best but they do include solid sf novels, recognised writers of many demographs (including white and straight, since that was brought up above), but they are what people who voted wanted. And, as a bookseller, they are representative of what people buy (Becky Chambers sold absolutely loads, 3 body problem is established as a key must-stock title etc etc).
More than that though is that this is the way a huge number of sff readers want the genre to go. If that does lead to PC lists for a few years but opens the genre and conversation up, making it a more diverse and exciting place in the years to come, so be it.
No awards ever reflect all tastes. If you find the Hugo’s don’t produce the outcome you like reading, go and look at other awards (the Clarke awards, for instance, tend to a very different awards list and I tend to enjoy their selection so i follow theirs more than the Hugo’s)
In terms of the actual winners
The Three Body Problem (2015) is consistently talked about on this forum and others as a great modern sf book, is sf. Others shortlisted include Ancillary Justice, ditto.
2016 N K Jemisin (and again in 2017 and 2018) an original world that touches on both sff and which is considered a stand-out, again by many. It’s hardly PC niche territory (it also sells like mad)
I see Jim Butcher was shortlisted both years - he’s not exactly ‘out there’ in PC land. Also included is Neal Stephenson who is mainstream sf.
2017 - We’re seeing the likes of Becky Chambers popping up, a hugely popular series, sf not fantasy, and absolutely representative of what sf readers we’re buying and recommending that year.
These may not be to your taste, they may not be what you consider the best but they do include solid sf novels, recognised writers of many demographs (including white and straight, since that was brought up above), but they are what people who voted wanted. And, as a bookseller, they are representative of what people buy (Becky Chambers sold absolutely loads, 3 body problem is established as a key must-stock title etc etc).
More than that though is that this is the way a huge number of sff readers want the genre to go. If that does lead to PC lists for a few years but opens the genre and conversation up, making it a more diverse and exciting place in the years to come, so be it.
No awards ever reflect all tastes. If you find the Hugo’s don’t produce the outcome you like reading, go and look at other awards (the Clarke awards, for instance, tend to a very different awards list and I tend to enjoy their selection so i follow theirs more than the Hugo’s)
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AlexH
Well-Known Member
I'm also a cynical person, but I'm glad stories by people from diverse backgrounds are presented to me now rather than me finding very little when I seek them out (which is still difficult in many other art forms). Whatever makes the nominations, it can only be better in the long term to read from more different points of view. I'm generally unaware of the background of an author's story I'm reading, but I know for sure that some of my favourites are from historically underrepresented groups.
I read award nominees out of interest and often they are stories I dislike or don't get, but it is subjective. I read a story recently that I thought was terrible, yet every review I saw after was about how brilliant and hilarious it was.
As for these Hugo nominees, I thought "Ten Excerpts from an Annotated Bibliography on the Cannibal Women of Ratnabar Island" was okay, but there wasn't enough to get my teeth into. I may have paraphrased Victoria there. I've started reading "As the Last I May Know."
As primarily a fantasy fan, I've been frustrated by what seems like the domination of sci-fi, though that's in a more general sense, as I don't specifically take notice of what genre is nominated for awards. So I'm pleased there's a bigger fantasy lineup. Hopefully, that will encourage more fantasy writers, magazines and anthologies!
In related news, I spotted this Kickstarter campaign for more sci-fi, which looks as though it may not reach its target:
www.kickstarter.com
Apex Magazine (funded within a few hours of launching) is also making a comeback:
www.kickstarter.com
I read award nominees out of interest and often they are stories I dislike or don't get, but it is subjective. I read a story recently that I thought was terrible, yet every review I saw after was about how brilliant and hilarious it was.
As for these Hugo nominees, I thought "Ten Excerpts from an Annotated Bibliography on the Cannibal Women of Ratnabar Island" was okay, but there wasn't enough to get my teeth into. I may have paraphrased Victoria there. I've started reading "As the Last I May Know."
As primarily a fantasy fan, I've been frustrated by what seems like the domination of sci-fi, though that's in a more general sense, as I don't specifically take notice of what genre is nominated for awards. So I'm pleased there's a bigger fantasy lineup. Hopefully, that will encourage more fantasy writers, magazines and anthologies!
In related news, I spotted this Kickstarter campaign for more sci-fi, which looks as though it may not reach its target:
Amazing Stories Year Two - Once More Dear Friends
A second glorious year of the award-winning Amazing Stories magazine!
Apex Magazine (funded within a few hours of launching) is also making a comeback:
Apex Magazine 2021
A relaunch of the Hugo Award-winning genre fiction zine Apex Magazine.
It is so subjective. Even the Hugo Award itself. What popularity or merit went into the decision to name the award after Higo Gernsback?
It doesn't sound like he had much appreciation for his writing, based on what the likes of James Blish and Brian Aldiss said about it.
It doesn't sound like he had much appreciation for his writing, based on what the likes of James Blish and Brian Aldiss said about it.
Those are novels. I was critiquing the short stories here and the short story nominations list. There's a pretty clear reason why the novel category is much more representative of popular opinion than short stories or novellas, which I could explain, but it looks like I'm not really allowed to discuss the Hugo nominations so I'll leave it there and move to other threads.
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