Could a technological society develop without language?

AllanR said:
Science developed from philosophy. A few hundred years ago they were indistinguishable. A PHD is a doctorate of philosophy (the specific field comes next). For quite some time science was called natural philosophy.
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Interestingly, though, a doctoral degree in modern languages, history, English etc is also known as a PhD. I've always found this curious, as what these people are doing is unrelated to either philosophy or its descendant, science. Maybe in those subjects a better title for the degree would be Doctor of Letters?
 
AllanR said:
Science developed from philosophy. A few hundred years ago they were indistinguishable. A PHD is a doctorate of philosophy (the specific field comes next). For quite some time science was called natural philosophy.
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They don't need to be related at all. And a few thousand years ago the talky kind of "natural philosophy" killed off the real science and math of the Greeks. The folks that thought daydreaming with words was the way to go (Aristotle) destroyed the kind of non-verbal science and math people like Archimedes invented independently.

Instead of saying one arises from the other, I would say that they were misclassified as being related, which led to the 2000 year downfall of the more useful one.
 
Orcadian said:
Interestingly, though, a doctoral degree in modern languages, history, English etc is also known as a PhD. I've always found this curious, as what these people are doing is unrelated to either philosophy or its descendant, science. Maybe in those subjects a better title for the degree would be Doctor of Letters?
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There already is a Doctor of Letters (D.Litt), which is not associated with language:
In the United Kingdom, Australia, India, and Ireland, the degree is a higher doctorate, above the Doctor of Philosophy (Ph.D.) or Doctor of Education (Ed.D.), for example, and is awarded on the basis of high achievement in the respective field or a long record of research and publication.
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It's often given as an honorary degree, eg to Mark Twain, Nelson Mandela, David Attenborough, etc, as recognition of their contribution to society.
 
Going back a couple of hundred thousand years to unwind philosophy and science is an interesting thought experiment. Eating off the land, living off the land, and language, those came first. Language develops complexity with planning meals and shelter. Technology where we don't know how it works develops, mainly copying what the neighbor is doing to make life easier. Somewhere in there religion and philosophy started up. As philosophy warmed up, and technology became more complex, it became natural to watch, even ask how things besides life worked, which eventually grew into science. By then science was looking at all kinds of things and how they worked without an actual goal in mind, although knowing how something worked could easily be based on fiction. A possible origin of science fiction.
 
Robert Zwilling said:
Going back a couple of hundred thousand years to unwind philosophy and science is an interesting thought experiment. Eating off the land, living off the land, and language, those came first. Language develops complexity with planning meals and shelter. Technology where we don't know how it works develops, mainly copying what the neighbor is doing to make life easier. Somewhere in there religion and philosophy started up. As philosophy warmed up, and technology became more complex, it became natural to watch, even ask how things besides life worked, which eventually grew into science. By then science was looking at all kinds of things and how they worked without an actual goal in mind, although knowing how something worked could easily be based on fiction. A possible origin of science fiction.
Click to expand...
I believe a more accurate historical account would be that technology developed before the largest advances in human language processing. Language transformed a group of dextrous tool users into large, hierarchical groups that could apply technology more efficiently and store surpluses. This allowed all kinds of pursuits to flourish, including technology - but also religion, politics, misogyny, warfare, human sacrifice and slavery.
 
The bridge between both sides of the brain, the tongue suitable for various sounds needed for spoken language, and the opposing digit needed for precision work for weapons, tools, and later writing.

Try the first episode of Ascent of Man and others:

 
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