# Monster Movies



## Talysia (Feb 27, 2007)

Whilst watching Van Helsing on tv last night, it occurred to me that there don't seem to be as many monster movies made these days. Or at least, I haven't seen many recently, and I wondered why.


Still, what's the best monster movie you've seen?


(By the way, a big thanks to Serin for her Hammer Horror thread for giving me the idea for this one!)

Apologies if there's already a thread like this, too.


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## BookStop (Feb 27, 2007)

I think Alien is probably the best 'monster movie' I've seen. Now, the sequel, Aliens, was also very good, but I enjoyed the suspense of the first.

I'm having trouble thinking of many monster movies (what do you consider a monster movie?zombies?vampires?werewolves?ceature from the deep?):

The Mummy
Alien +++
Jaws sort of
American Werewolf in London
Shaun of the Dead
Dracula
???


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## Talysia (Feb 27, 2007)

I'd say all of the above. Or at least, I was thinking along those kind of lines when I thought up the thread. I guess I'd even include the Godzilla kind of movies, too!


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## BookStop (Feb 27, 2007)

Talysia - you didn't mention your fav. yet


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## Talysia (Feb 27, 2007)

I think it'd be a toss-up between The Mummy Returns and Godzilla.  Actually, I'd say Godzilla just shades it for me.


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## Dr. Atomic (Feb 27, 2007)

Some of my favorite monster flicks...

The Thing (both the original and the remake)
Creature From the Black Lagoon
The first two Frankensteins
The original Godzilla
The original King Kong
Alien

Those my be my faves...


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## Serin (Feb 27, 2007)

The first time I saw King Kong, the b/w version, I remember I felt so sorry for that big old ape, and no matter how many times I have watched it since, it's still the same.


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## Lenny (Feb 27, 2007)

I was 4 when I saw the b/w version... I actually cried when he was shot down!

I didn't cry when I saw the new one, but I did feel sorry for him. I thought it was a pretty good film, even though it clocked in at over 3 hours.


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## Happy Joe (Feb 27, 2007)

In terms of movies that pushed the envelope (although the pacing often suffers when viewed with todays eye), I like;
The original Mummy (with Karloff 1928, if I recall)
the original King Kong
Frankenstein (original)
Creature From the Black Lagoon 
War of the Worlds (1952, I think)

Recent monster flicks that I enjoyed;
Day of the dead
28 Days Later
Van Helsing
Underworld (Both)
King Kong
The Mummy

As to why more aren't made... There are still a lot of poor monster movies made (just look at the DVD rentals available)(some even have a good idea behind them) but to get a great monster movie you need; a good story, great writing, good direction, good acting and some decent special effects (I like a mixture of CGI and makeup FX).  All of these things do not usually come together on the same movie and a failing at any one of the can doom a movie to mediocrity (look at Doom, for example).

Enjoy!


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## williamjm (Feb 27, 2007)

Talysia said:


> Still, what's the best monster movie you've seen?



Some good monster movies:
"The Thing"
"Dog Soldiers"
"Tremors"
"The Mummy"

I suppose you could argue that "The Terminator" is a monster movie of a sort as well...


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## Foxbat (Feb 28, 2007)

For me the best monster movie is James Whale's Frankenstein. A close second (primarily because of moody and beautiful use of a Cello in the soundtrack during the change sequence) is Universal's The Wolf Man starring Lon Chaney Jnr.


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## j d worthington (Feb 28, 2007)

Yep... it all depends on your definition of "monster" for a monster movie. Are we referring to the supernatural players such as werewolves, vampires, zombies, the reanimated dead? Are we referring to grotesques? Not to be too pedantic, but "monster" originally meant a prodigy, or unusual product of nature, with the implication of a divine omen or portent -- in other words, something grotesque or unprecedented produced by nature as a warning. (Which is why we fear them... we've inherited that fear through millennia of history where they were indications of an irruption of the divine or spiritual into the mundane or spiritual world, portending disaster, often for an entire nation or culture.) 

I'm not trying to be pedantic here, I swear... I'm just making this point because monster movies can be any number of things. Here's the definition of "monster" from the American Heritage Dictionary:



> An imaginary or legendary creature, such as a centaur or Harpy, that combines parts from various animal or human forms.
> A creature having a strange or frightening appearance.
> 
> An animal, a plant, or other organism having structural defects or deformities.
> ...


Which means it can apply to mythological monsters, things like the sf-horror films of the 1950s (giant insects produced by radiation being a good example, as they fit the whole portent or omen thing as well), the "monsters" of the Hellraiser films... even the "monsters" of the serial-killer films.

So... what is our working definition _here_? And are we restricted to any period? Knowing that would help to say what someone's favorite monster movies would be without having such a different definition of monster from he others that everyone is scratching their heads wondering "what the heck are they talking about?"

(Which may well be what everyone's doing with me right now.... )

For example: my own choices would include the 1925 *Phantom of the Opera*, with Lon Chaney, Sr.; James Whale's *Frankenstein* (1931) and *Bride of Frankenstein* (1935); *The Wolf Man* (1941); *The Creature from the Black Lagoon *(1954); *Fiend Without a Face* (1958); *Quatermass and the Pit* (1958); *Alien* (1979); *The Thing* (both versions).... and a rather obscure Japanese film, *Matango* (1963; which I saw as a kid under the title *Attack of the Mushroom People*, and which is loosely based on "A Voice in the Night" by William Hope Hodgson), and the recent silent film *The Call of Cthulhu* (2005), for starters....


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## Talysia (Feb 28, 2007)

j. d. worthington said:


> So... what is our working definition _here_? And are we restricted to any period? Knowing that would help to say what someone's favorite monster movies would be without having such a different definition of monster from he others that everyone is scratching their heads wondering "what the heck are they talking about?"


 

Originally, I meant the likes of mythological "monsters" like Frankenstein or the mummy films, and then I started thinking about the "giant creatures attacking some part of the world or another" kind of monster film, such as Godzilla or King Kong. Now it seems that there are more definitions than I can count, including rampaging robots and triffid-like plants!

I think any era of film is ok, as there have been modern remakes. To clarify, though, maybe I should have just said monster movies in the Dracula/Frankenstein/Werewolves kind of vein _and_ the giant mutated creature films - that would have made it a lot easier.   (And I don't mean X-Men when I say mutated creatures.)  I guess it all depends on your definition.

*Bows humbly* Sorry for picking such a confusing topic!


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## j d worthington (Feb 28, 2007)

Talysia said:


> *Bows humbly* Sorry for picking such a confusing topic!


 
Whoooops! No need to apologize. I can just be a stickler for definitions on such things, as it may help keep people on the same page. So no apologies from you necessary... one from me might be in order, though.... 

Okay, pretty broad then... so all those I mentioned would fit just fine. With me, the trouble would be picking, as I devoured the things like popcorn from such an early age I don't even remember the first ones I saw. These were my "Mother Goose" in a real sense. (I didn't sleep with teddy bears... I had monsters in bed with me; I always figured that if there was something under the bed, they could whup it a lot better than any old teddy bear...! ) (Besides, a lot of those things were made from hard plastics, and felt awful nice and cool in a Texas summer night before the advent of air conditioning!)


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## HoopyFrood (Feb 28, 2007)

(Heh, I now sleep with a cuddly Cthulhu...do not be fooled by his fluffy exterior, mess with him and he'll be on you like a powerful moss!)

Hmm, let me think...Well, yeah, got to have the *Alien *films.  I really should watch them again soon, it's been many a year since I last watched them. Oh, and *Tremors*! What a fantastic film. I used to make all my friends play the Tremors game in the playground, where you had to keep off the floor,  climb onto any available high spot, otherwise you'd be grabbed by the monsters! Anything with zombies in it is great, as well...especially the older ones like *Evil Dead* and *Dawn of the Dead*. Brilliant.


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## Curt Chiarelli (Feb 28, 2007)

What, no votes for animator Ray Harryhausen's menagerie? Well, in that case, I'd have to cast my lot in with _Jason and the Argonauts, Mysterious Island_ and_ The Seventh Voyage of Sindbad. _Thanks to Bernard Herrmann's musical genius and Arthur Hayward's brilliant model-making skills (Harryhausen took all the credit for his work), Harryhausen's beasts of legend and lore achieve a power to cavort through our cultural gestalt straight into our collective unconscious to haunt our dreams forever.

And while we're at it, let's not forget Harryhausen's spiritual grandfather, Willis O'Brien and his seminal creation, the original_ King Kong_.

Segueing right along into the "Persecuted and Misunderstood Category", Lon Chaney's original_ Phantom of the Opera, _Jean Cocteau's _La Belle et la Bete _and_ Creature From the Black Lagoon_ are three more childhood favourites that never cease to delight and awe. They also never cease to remind us that the _real_ monsters aren't disfigured or encrusted in scales and hair, but rather normal looking, hidden amongst our ranks like a latent pathogen waiting to hatch out under the right conditions. Only their lack of compassion and brutality reveals their true nature.

I'd also like to second J.D.'s nomination for _Matango_ (A.K.A._ Attack of the Mushroom People_). Saturated in a doom-laden atmosphere, all the elements of this film, from its revoluntionary prosthetic make-up to its superb production design, conspire towards an intense, unmitigated build-up of tension and a grim inevitability.


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## HoopyFrood (Feb 28, 2007)

Ah, yes, how could I forget? *Jason and the Argonauts* gets my vote as well. And also *Clash of the Titans*. The memory of that scene with Medusa and the reflective shield has been with me for as long as I can remember!


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## Curt Chiarelli (Feb 28, 2007)

HoopyFrood said:


> And also *Clash of the Titans*. The memory of that scene with Medusa and the reflective shield has been with me for as long as I can remember!



Yes, that was a creepy and well-staged sequence! Ah, such great childhood memories!


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## HoopyFrood (Feb 28, 2007)

Oh, indeed, indeed! Whenever I hear that either *Clash of the Titans* or *Jason and the Argonauts* is on television (usually over Christmas, it seems ) I will make the effort to watch them, not just because they are great films, but because they are ones that I have watched again and again from a very young age.


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## Curt Chiarelli (Feb 28, 2007)

Right! They did the same thing in States! The 3:00 o'clock movie on Channel 7 in Chicago always showed all these great monster movies over Christamas break. And _Jason_ was often one of 'em. They used to edit (or rather, butcher) the films to fit their small time slots - when _Jason_ played, sometimes the Talos sequence would get axed, in other years the harpy sequence would dissappear in favour of Talos. You never _could_ see the whole movie without those cuts to accomodate their dumb schedule! But that never stopped me from cherishing those moments. It was mother's milk to me! Now I'm getting all nostalgic Hoopy!


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## Urien (Feb 28, 2007)

The sci-fi channel here in the states churns out a monster movie once a week. The most terrifying thing about sci-fi original movies is their utter crapness. 

Usually it's the melding of two beasties, or the return of some ancient monster. 

"Snail Elephant."

"Gargoyle Labrador puppy."

"Hippogriff Chicken."

"Medusa Bushbaby"

They're quite fond of cheapo disaster movies as well. A volcano in New York, or this weeks special is the moon being hit by an asteroid and breaking up. Doubtless out of all the surface area of the world chunks will fall on New York.


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## j d worthington (Mar 1, 2007)

Quite likely, andrew, quite likely.... 

Indeed, Curt... Note I said that my list there was only the_ beginning_. Harryhausen, definitely. For me, especially Seventh Voyage of Sinbad. I'm not quite sure why, but that one comes in even a notch or two above Jason (though I'm extremely fond of both).

And, while we're at it... How about *The House of Wax* (1953)? That one was a favorite of my childhood, and having had the experience of seeing it on the big screen in 3-D (twice!) only made it the more so. There's a lot of corn there, but it is a quite atmospheric and eerie piece, and Price's performance is excellent (though I will confess that I also have quite a liking for the original *Mystery of the Wax Museum* [1933], which has it own macabre charm). And there we have a double dose of the human monster. Not only the monster behind the mask, but the monster who _made_ him a monster.

Oh, what's the use? I could go on for days listing things here. Heck, I've even got to admit I have an enormous liking for the original *She-Creature* (1956)... and the remake had a fair amount to recommend it, too (surprisingly!). Not to mention the seriously flawed but nonetheless often quite powerful *Pumpkinhead* (1989) -- which has what has got to be one of the creepiest witches in all of film, and manages to have a great deal of the feel of a genuine folktale to it. (I also love that final theme ... a perfect blending of the urban and backhills bluegrass that form the contrasting worlds of the film... and a nice piece of music with moments of poignancy itself!)

Let's face it... When badly done, they're unwatchable, but when they do a "monster movie" well, it is a type of art all its own, and worthy to stand with the best in any other genre.


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## Curt Chiarelli (Mar 1, 2007)

Yes, Vincent Price was great wasn't he? My favourite Price vehicle was the _Conqueror Worm - _a very different kind of monster film entirely. His performance ranks up there with Boris Karloff's character, Mord in _The Tower of London_.

I completely understand your feelings about _The Seventh Voyage of Sindbad_. There's a kind of storybook purity and innocence to it, isn't there? That rich, saturated Technicolour palette courtesy of cinematographer Wilkie Cooper is pure eye candy and the cyclops is a truly spectatcular creation! It just makes me feel like a kid again when I see it!
And yes . . . . we could go on making lists forever. The only thing more fun would be to actually watch the movies themselves!


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## j d worthington (Mar 1, 2007)

Curt Chiarelli said:


> Yes, Vincent Price was great wasn't he? My favourite Price vehicle was the _Conqueror Worm - _a very different kind of monster film entirely. His performance ranks up there with Boris Karloff's character, Mord in _The Tower of London_.
> 
> I completely understand your feelings about _The Seventh Voyage of Sindbad_. There's a kind of storybook purity and innocence to it, isn't there? That rich, saturated Technicolour palette courtesy of cinematographer Wilkie Cooper is pure eye candy and the cyclops is a truly spectatcular creation! It just makes me feel like a kid again when I see it!
> And yes . . . . we could go on making lists forever. The only thing more fun would be to actually watch the movies themselves!


 
Oh, yes... *Witchfinder General* (a.k.a. *The Conqueror Worm*)... wonderful take on Hopkins, that. Same director as did *The Sorcerers*, as I recall... which I only got to see a couple of years ago for the first time, in a rather seriously grainy print... still, a very interesting film in its way. I've always found that particular film (C.W.) particularly unpleasant... not at all bad (in fact, it's quite a good film), but quite unpleasant... which is also very much intentional. It's a film that had to grow on me, I'll admit; but I've got to where I quite like it now. 

And that summation of *7th Voyage* is spot on! And, of course, Torin Thatcher as Sokurah is absolutely perfect! Ah, yes, what a film! That's another point... I think I owe it to Harryhausen's films (especially *Jason* and *7th Voyage*) for getting me into mythology, as I saw the films before I learned to read, and as soon as I was in school, checked out a copy of Bulfinch as one of my first library books there... (You know, it's no wonder both Rays -- Harryhausen and Bradbury -- ended up such great friends; magic men, the both of them!)

Trivia bit... I just love Herrmann's sense of humor when he was doing the score for *Mysterious Island*, and told Ray that, for the giant chick sequence he'd decided to use "Turkey in the Straw"....


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## Curt Chiarelli (Mar 1, 2007)

Personally, I love the emotionally raw quality of _The Witchfinder General_. I'm not quite sure which version you've seen J.D., but much of that cruel edge was abated by Paul Ferris' original orchestral score. Inexplicably, the American release replaced Ferris' lyrical, English folk music-tinged score with a ghastly electronic one by Kendall Schmidt. I've seen both versions and it entirely changes the viewing experience.

Interesting to note that director Michael Reeves notoriously refused to get along with Vincent Price on the set of this film. It's the measure of Reeves' streak of perversity to say that Price was quite possibly the sweetest, most affable man to work with. In fact, the film was so low-budget that Price would cook delicious pasta lunches for the whole crew and pay for everything out of his own pocket!

You gotta love Torin! A real show stealer with his old-school, bigger-than-life theatrical quality. 

You know, a lot of academics and purists dismiss Harryhausen's movies because they don't follow the original tales slavishly. A lot of these myths and legends are quite disjointed and I've always countered that criticism by saying that his movies wouldn't have the same quality of invention and and strong sense of continuity if he didn't make those adaptations. 

What I wouldn't have given to have hung out with those two in the Brown Room at Clifton's Cafeteria during the late 1930s when they attended the Science Fiction Society. I understand Ray Bradbury was quite the noisy and expansive one (annoyingly so!), while Harryhausen was the quiet, contemplative sort. A study in opposites, it's quite natural that they'd become pals!

Only a hardcore Herrmann fan would have known about that! By any chance, have you've purchased this new CD, _Conversation Piece: An Unvarnished Chat With Bernard Herrmann?_ FMS: Feature ["Conversation Piece: An Unvarnished Chat with Bernard Herrmann"] What a treat! I guarantee you're going to love it!


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## j d worthington (Mar 1, 2007)

Curt Chiarelli said:


> Personally, I love the emotionally raw quality of _The Witchfinder General_. I'm not quite sure which version you've seen J.D., but much of that cruel edge was abated by Paul Ferris' original orchestral score. Inexplicably, the American release replaced Ferris' lyrical, English folk music-tinged score with a ghastly electronic one by Kendall Schmidt. I've seen both versions and it entirely changes the viewing experience.


 
Actually, I've seen both, albeit a couple of decades apart! And don't misunderstand me... artistically it is precisely the right tone to strike with the thing. I just find it emotionally repulsive in spots; which, as I said, is exactly what it should be for what is going on. He didn't "pretty it up" or make it in any way acceptable or defensible -- it's brutal and cruel and vicious, reflecting very much the actions ... that's something not too many people have done. Usually either they shoot, edit, and such in such a way as to soften the impact (which often turns a rape scene into an erotic scene -- something it should _never_ be) or they sensationalize it with jazzy lighting an effects, so that it becomes a _tour-de-force_... which again reduces the emotional impact of such brutality. It's like the almost documentary approach Hooper took with *The Texas Chainsaw Massacre *(1974), or Craven took with *The Last House on the Left* (1972)... both films are extremely successful in putting you right in the middle of things, but I can't say that I enjoy either film. They are definitely achievements to be proud of artistically for their unflinching look at such brutality... but they repulse me emotionally.





> You gotta love Torin! A real show stealer with his old-school, bigger-than-life theatrical quality.


 
And yes, I agree. Even in that film on *Houdini *(1953), Torin darned near steals the show! He's not quite in the same league with Chief Dan George where that last is concerned, but he's not far behind!



> You know, a lot of academics and purists dismiss Harryhausen's movies because they don't follow the original tales slavishly. A lot of these myths and legends are quite disjointed and I've always countered that criticism by saying that his movies wouldn't have the same quality of invention and and strong sense of continuity if he didn't make those adaptations.


 
Oh, lord, yes... but just try adapting any of the stories directly from sources; with those, with the *Mabinogion*, with Malory, with the Niebelungenlied. Oh, how awful those films would be! It's not only a completely different medium than any of the original tale-tellers could have conceived, but a completely different manner of telling a story within that medium; the emphases have changed radically! But Harryhausen's films have got so many people interested in the myths and legends, that he really deserves thanks.



> Only a hardcore Herrmann fan would have known about that! By any chance, have you've purchased this new CD, _Conversation Piece: An Unvarnished Chat With Bernard Herrmann?_ FMS: Feature ["Conversation Piece: An Unvarnished Chat with Bernard Herrmann"] What a treat! I guarantee you're going to love it!


 
No, I hadn't heard about that one! Thanks! I will definitely have to keep an eye out for it, and scrape together my pennies... (or sell an organ or two) !


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