# Burmuda Triangle; fact or fiction?



## argenianpoet

Dear fellow thinkers and creative geniuses, I have done extensive reading on the subject of the Burmuda Triangle and have come up with some theories of my own pertaining to the number of disappearances over the years, but they are just 'possibilities' and none of them can be proven, nor do I claim to know anything special about this subject; it's just that I have always been fascinated by the stories told since I was a child, and have several _really _good ideas floating around in my head that want to come out in fiction form.  

Does anyone have the same fascination as I do with a place that is thought to be just a myth?  If so, have you been inclined to write stories about the subject like me?  I am not trying to prove that this place is supernatural by posting this thread; I am merely posing an open-minded question that will possibly invoke a really interesting discussion for free thinkers.  What are your thoughts on the Triangle, and do you have the same obsession that I have had with it for years?


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## j d worthington

I was, of course, fascinated by this -- as well as many other such things -- when I was younger; but the more I looked into the evidence, the less substance seemed to be there, and I lost interest. For myself, the problem with using this as a fictional locus is that there has been so much pseudo-scientific stuff written about it that it's difficult to separate that from the idea itself; a pity in a way, as I hate to see any imaginative possibility become so tainted that it's difficult to use effectively. (Not impossible, perhaps, but darned difficult.) At least, in serious as opposed to humorous fiction.


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## argenianpoet

j. d. worthington said:
			
		

> I was, of course, fascinated by this -- as well as many other such things -- when I was younger; but the more I looked into the evidence, the less substance seemed to be there, and I lost interest. For myself, the problem with using this as a fictional locus is that there has been so much pseudo-scientific stuff written about it that it's difficult to separate that from the idea itself; a pity in a way, as I hate to see any imaginative possibility become so tainted that it's difficult to use effectively. (Not impossible, perhaps, but darned difficult.) At least, in serious as opposed to humorous fiction.


 
I agree with you in the sense that the idea has been over-used and molded into just a cliche over the years.  I don't know if I will ever attempt the story ideas I have about the Burmuda Triangle, but I do find that it makes for an interesting read, since all that I read anymore is (ironically) nonfiction.  It seems that you write nonfiction mostly, and I write fiction, but read nonfiction.  Does that make any sense?  I try to steer away from cliches, but this one has got a special place in my imagination and I just can't break the inspiration; it comes back to me at various times as strong as ever, almost lulling me into its web of supernatural bliss.  But anyway, I see your point J.D. and being that you write nonfiction I can see why you would take this view.  Keep submitting and don't ever give up.


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## j d worthington

Actually, I read quite a bit of both, usually in parallel tracks. For example, I'm currently reading China Mieville's _Looking for Jake_ (story collection), but I'm also working on S. T. Joshi's biography of H. P. Lovecraft, and a collection of essays by Bertrand Russell; after which I'll be reading (probably) a collection of 18th-century essays while finishing the bio and moving on to Jack London's _Before Adam_, etc.

(Totally off-topic, but just to reply to your post.)

(Speaking of which: Where the heck *is *everybody???)


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## mosaix

Two things that may, in part, go some way to explaining ships and planes going missing in particular geographical areas:

1) Magnetic anomolies that could have an affect on navigation equipment.

2) Methane build up in rock formations on the sea bed. Apparently massive bubbles of methane can build up in rock formations. A minor land slip can cause these to be released and surge to the surface. This would be catastrophic for any vessel floating above as they would 'fall' into the bubble beneath them and the sea would close over the top. 

Note that both of these are not dependent in any way on the weather and this may help to explain lost craft in good conditions. 

I am not commenting on the Bermuda Trianlge 'per se' here, I seem to remember that a statistical analysis showed that this area was no more likely to have suffered unexplained losses than any other busy sea route. I am just pointing out that there are geophysical phenomena that could be considered when considering unexplained losses.


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## jackokent

It's quite obviously Aliens !


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## argenianpoet

The idea that inspired me the most was that the lost city of Atlantis was located there; hidden beneath the ocean, and that 'they' were the root cause of almost all of the disappearances.  Of course, this cannot be proven, I know...


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## argenianpoet

jackokent said:
			
		

> It's quite obviously Aliens !


 
Maybe the _so-called_ aliens are really residents of Earth, living beneath the waters of the Atlantic... Food for the imagination here guys; just go with it on an open-minded note, because I am not saying that it is true.  I just think deeper than most, imaginitively speaking.  Just think:  an entire empire hidden beneath the ocean deep; far advanced and sophisticated than we will ever be.  Gives me the shivers just thinking about it...


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## littlemissattitude

Well, I suppose that considering that we don't know that much about the deep ocean floor (since it _is_ deep, and very difficult to get to, technologically speaking), a deep-water colony isn't completely out of the question.  Although the technology would have to be awfully advanced.  (Think: the underground city in _The Abyss_.)  Also, I don't know much about the depths in the Bermuda Triangle area and whether or not it would be deep enough there for some sort of colony to go undetected.  That's a pretty heavily-traveled part of the ocean - which at least in part accounts for why there are so many disappearances there, even positing a mundane explanation for all the reported problems there.

And, there have been reports of USOs - underwater submarine objects - much like UFO reports.

It's a fun idea to play with, I'll admit.  But, the same objections stand as those to UFOs being material and extraterrestrial.


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## argenianpoet

littlemissattitude said:
			
		

> It's a fun idea to play with, I'll admit.


 
That's just the attitude I was looking for; no pun intended LittleMiss... Supposedly, the mythical city of Atlantis was more advanced than we are today, way back when... If they are still here among us, you could only imagine how much more advanced that they would be.  Maybe the great destruction that took place was a hoax; a cover up for a much sinister plot, and if they had television, and death rays then I would imagine that the illusion of their destruction would have been an easy one, when all along they were preparing their kingdom beneath the ocean...


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## argenianpoet

I saw another thread above this one called _Wormholes_ and I couldn't help but remember a documentary I saw once on television about the Triangle.  The entire length of the show was true accounts of people who had survived the Triangle and what they claimed they saw...

One guy said that a buddy and him were out on a boat in the Triangle when they saw a portal open up above their heads and a space ship descend from the heavens above and enter inside the portal and they watched as it closed back and both were gone...

Another guy said (on the same documentary) that he was flying his plane and all of a sudden the instruments went hay wire as he realized he had entered into some sort of tunnel.  This lasted for a couple of minutes and when it was all over he said that he realized he had made a two or three hour trip in less than two minutes...

I just wonder if these fellows were talking about a worm hole?


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## j d worthington

Unfortunately, upon close investigation, nearly all such stories prove to be unfounded. They usually are either actual fabrications; misinterpretations of natural phenomena (as in the case of ufo sightings and the like); mistaking those peculiar dream states that are so realistic (alien abductions, etc.) -- and on these, has anyone noticed that the scenarios are almost identical to those propounded for so long about visitations by incubi and succubi? save for the science-fictional terminology; and the fact that the "aliens" are almost without fail taken from pulp illustrations of the 1940s and 1950s? Or they are relatings of tales that someone told someone else, who told someone else, who told.... This sort of thing is how we ended up with the old "Indian rope trick" story that, to some degree, persists through today. In no single case has anything of this nature ever withstood critical scientific scrutiny (that is, scrutiny by someone other than "psychic investigators", "ghost hunters" and the like, who have a stake in these things being accepted (after all, their livelihood and/or fame rely on such). They may still have fictional viability (though in dealing with any such blending of ideas, it's almost impossible to avoid cliches or terrible logical flaws within a story), but speaking on them as fact, they simply haven't been able to produce any form of evidence that has withstood this sort of searching examination. And believe me, I've seen plenty of scientists who would _love_ for this sort of thing to have some basis in fact -- they'd be like a kid in a toyshop.


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## argenianpoet

I think that whether its true or not it makes for pretty good fiction, although if it's clichical I would have to disagree.  I'm not familiar with every single story out there and whether there are novels already written on the ideas; but if the truth be told there probably are stories just like the ones I mentioned above (the ones I saw on the documentary).  I think more or less the point of this thread is to show the fascination with such ideas and imagine how they could be killer stories.  I hardly ever write a story exactly the way I heard it; instead, I change it around so much that it would take an expert to say, hey that sounds just like... I think the general themes, such are:  aliens, wormholes, alternate universes, time travel, ghosts, The Burmuda Triangle, Atlantis, government conspiracy, etc. etc. etc. can be redone over and over and never really lose their punch if the stories are _original_ takes on older themes.  I can still remember how excited I got when people talked about ghosts, the paranormal, or anything that was out of the ordinary and I thought to myself then:  'I want to do something with that one day.'  When I read fiction it is just like that; I want to feel like a kid, sitting idian-style, listening to my grandfather or my dad telling stories of the past, and when I write I use that kind of inspiration.  Sometimes I get goosebumps when I think of those old stories, and I think to myself_:  That would make a really good story_.  However, these stories I have never written; I am only discussing topics that interested me as a child, but now that I am older, I write much differently.  Maybe some of those old stories will come out someday (I'm almost sure they will) but until then, I will write the ones that are not cliches.


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## j d worthington

You might be surprised how and where they show up in your stories; in fact, you might not recognize it yourself until pointed out to you. That's how the creative mind works, as said earlier: it sparks from any number of things, combines, alters, transmutes, and turns out something different, with the views of that person. When it becomes cliched is when it follows earlier models that have been so overused they become trite and lose their emotional impact, their "freshness". As long as they can elicit that _frisson_, there's life in them still.


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## argenianpoet

j. d. worthington said:
			
		

> You might be surprised how and where they show up in your stories; in fact, you might not recognize it yourself until pointed out to you. That's how the creative mind works, as said earlier: it sparks from any number of things, combines, alters, transmutes, and turns out something different, with the views of that person. When it becomes cliched is when it follows earlier models that have been so overused they become trite and lose their emotional impact, their "freshness". As long as they can elicit that _frisson_, there's life in them still.


 
Agreed.


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## Milk

This may or may not relate to the topic, but I remember reading somewhere  that all sections of  all bodies of water,  from all oceans and all seas have just about an equal number of missing planes and boats in them as the bermuda triangle.  In fact it appears to me that missing boats and planes above any body of water is more common then one might think.  So planes and boats are crashing and sinking into water all the time, everywhere there is water and a boat to sink it into theres a chance one will sink. This has been the case since boats and planes were invented, I dont see the Bermuda Triangle as being any different then another part of water.  I bet all the worlds ocean's have sunken ships and planes.


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## El_L1

Milk-

regarding your statement that the bermuda triangle is not any different than any other ocean. the deepest oceans in the world are the mariana trench in the pacific and the puerto rican trench in the atlantic. The atlantic trench is in the burmuda triangle-the #1 deepest is the mariana trench and it is in the pacific ocean's version of the bermuda triangle know as the dragon's triangle.

Being the 2nd deepest area of water in the world _is_ different than all other oceans except of course the #1 deepest known as the mariana trench.


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## Spartan27

argenianpoet said:


> Dear fellow thinkers and creative geniuses, I have done extensive reading on the subject of the Burmuda Triangle and have come up with some theories of my own pertaining to the number of disappearances over the years, but they are just 'possibilities' and none of them can be proven, nor do I claim to know anything special about this subject; it's just that I have always been fascinated by the stories told since I was a child, and have several _really _good ideas floating around in my head that want to come out in fiction form.
> 
> Does anyone have the same fascination as I do with a place that is thought to be just a myth? If so, have you been inclined to write stories about the subject like me? I am not trying to prove that this place is supernatural by posting this thread; I am merely posing an open-minded question that will possibly invoke a really interesting discussion for free thinkers. What are your thoughts on the Triangle, and do you have the same obsession that I have had with it for years?


 
Arge...I didn't catch were your opinion on this was above nor if you yourself believe it's fact or fiction. The question I have is what are your thoughts on the triangle?

Mine are rather easy and simplistic...yes it exists, why it exists...don't know. What is this place?...don't know....have boats/planes/people disappeared?...yes they have.....now you've got my ideas. Good luck on your fiction novel.


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## Urien

It's Flipper, he and his mates are testing their sonic weapons in the Bermuda triangle. Never trust a dolphin. Especially when playing one at poker.


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## Spartan27

andrew.v.spencer said:


> It's Flipper, he and his mates are testing their sonic weapons in the Bermuda triangle. Never trust a dolphin. Especially when playing one at poker.


 
yeah especially when he bluffs....and holds a kicker ace in the hole...


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## Saltheart

It's the Kraken, duh! I mean, obviously it's a giant squid. Where do you think the myth came from?


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## Spartan27

Saltheart said:


> It's the Kraken, duh! I mean, obviously it's a giant squid. Where do you think the myth came from?


 
Ahhh Yessss.....I see


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## rocklobster21

FACT!  There are many different thories surronding the triangles, the dragons triangle taking four times more victims than the american one.  It is proven that waves crash at weird triangle patterns making navagation almost impossible for the largest ships.  Even when the Japanese government sent a giant research vessel with 22 crew and 9 scientists it vanished.  Many strange occourences have been found, even an american military plane, checking his location by stars hourly, flew three times the possible distance of the plane in one hour when crossing dragons triange.  Many who have lived through the triangle report losing 15 to 30 minutes when returning to land, having been through some type of time vortex.  The most disturbing fact is the UFO's and USO's (unidenified submerged objects).  One Japanese man has done research and photographed over 200 different UO's.  ships have been circled for lengths of time before or after these objects have gone under the water.  They come in shapes ranging from small egg shapes to over 100 foot long cigar shaped crafts.  One theory suggests that the aliens have a undersea base in both triangles.  Weather they do or not, you wont catch me anywhere near those deathtraps.


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## rationaltofools

argenianpoet said:


> I saw another thread above this one called _Wormholes_ and I couldn't help but remember a documentary I saw once on television about the Triangle. The entire length of the show was true accounts of people who had survived the Triangle and what they claimed they saw...
> I just wonder if these fellows were talking about a worm hole?


 
may i ask what this documentary was called or where i could possible find it?
these do very much sound like "wormhole" experiences
sounds like a very good idea to play with


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## The Ace

I think it's just hokum, but you earthlings will believe anything.


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## Interference

Science has the answers - just not quite all of them.

As I understand it, the shape of the Bermuda triangle is adjusted periodically to take in a few more wrecks.  I think it's famous because of the military losses during WWII which included the famous "My compass is gone haywire" radio signal from flight 42 or whatever it was.  It was later shown that his compass may not have indeed gone haywire, but because visual observation seemed close to what they expected to see - but on the wrong compass point - they only concluded that there was a mysterious malfunction involved.  The flight was found hundreds of miles from where it had been thought to have crashed, under the sea and undiscovered for forty years.

Pilot error, in that case.

So, does this matter?  Possibly not.  Does it deny the possibility of unexplained phenomena completely?  Of course it doesn't.  For every news report, there's a theory that that's not how it really was.  So let's place Atlantis off the Bermuda coast, way down there below human contact.  Now let's contact them and see what it does to surface shipping.

Run with the idea, argenianpoet, but remember:  The Submariner is Prince of Atlantis; Aquaman is the King; Arion was its first Magician and everything else is up to you.  



El_L1 said:


> the #1 deepest is the mariana trench



Aren't you assuming the Atlanteans haven't put a roof on theirs, which is actually _the_ deepest, but it's never been discovered?


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## Spartan27

jackokent said:


> It's quite obviously Aliens !


 
Yes at least from a mathimatical probability point of view.


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## x//ada\\x

the triangle has to be one of my favouite topics when it comes to writting proven essays at school.......(hope you know what they are) erm...i have never really been impeled to write stories on the subject but i do belove that somthing sinister oes on in that area of the world. of course it could be magnitism????? any one thaught of that before or it could just simply be the forces of evil working against us .......

x//ada\\x


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