# Do science fiction and spirituality blend well together?



## bretbernhoft (Sep 18, 2021)

I'm writing a story about spiritual awakenings within a science fiction context. But I don't know if this has already been tried?


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## W Collier (Sep 18, 2021)

Who cares, if you can do it better?

Though I suppose I am curious to know what you mean by "spirituality" and "spiritual awakening."  Do you mean a religious conversion, or something else?


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## bretbernhoft (Sep 18, 2021)

W Collier said:


> Who cares, if you can do it better?
> 
> Though I suppose I am curious to know what you mean by "spirituality" and "spiritual awakening."  Do you mean a religious conversion, or something else?


I am writing a story about non-religious spirituality, and what that might look like 100 or 200 years from now; especially as altered states of consciousness and mindfulness are concerned.


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## Rodders (Sep 18, 2021)

I think science fiction explores spirituality quite well, but being what it is, it usually ends up debunking the notion as a psychological comfort blanket.

Greg Bear's Anvil of Stars had an interesting sub-plot involving religion.
Alistair Reynolds's Absolution Gap had another interesting take. The book makes mention of a religious virus that is used to infect non-believers. It was an interesting thought.


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## hitmouse (Sep 18, 2021)

bretbernhoft said:


> I'm writing a story about spiritual awakenings within a science fiction context. But I don't know if this has already been tried?


There is quite a well-known book called *Dune *by Frank Herbert where this is a theme. Recommend you try to find a copy.


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## Wayne Mack (Sep 18, 2021)

I am not sure exactly how to interrupt the question, but I see nothing inherent in the major religions to preclude them from science fiction. I note that science fiction rarely references the religious beliefs of any of its characters, but that is also true of any of the other genres.


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## AlexH (Sep 18, 2021)

I can't see why they wouldn't, and it sounds a good combination to me. I imagine it's been done before, but that doesn't matter as your take will be your own unique take.


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## Jo Zebedee (Sep 18, 2021)

CS Lewis, Space, or Cosmic, trilogy are well known for this. I enjoyed them a lot.


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## AllanR (Sep 18, 2021)

One trope (or is it a cliche?) I don't like is when humans and aliens intermix, aliens always seem to have a unified religion where humans don't (a good example is Babylon 5.) or they only show religion to be a punching bag (Mormons in The Expanse).

Stranger in a Strange Land, Parable of a Sower and A Cantible for Leibowitz are full of religious themes. Shorts by Clark like The Star or Nine Billion Names of God also fit.

edit in The Chrysalids and Handmaids Tale (theocracies).


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## Vince W (Sep 18, 2021)

Rodders said:


> I think science fiction explores spirituality quite well, but being what it is, it usually ends up debunking the notion as a psychological comfort blanket.
> 
> Greg Bear's Anvil of Stars had an interesting sub-plot involving religion.
> Alistair Reynolds's Absolution Gap had another interesting take. The book makes mention of a religious virus that is used to infect non-believers. It was an interesting thought.


Wasn't that Chasm City?

Dune has already been mentioned but I think Frank primarily took a dim view on organised religion showing how it can be used to manipulate whole societies.


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## Venusian Broon (Sep 18, 2021)

Vince W said:


> Wasn't that Chasm City?
> 
> Dune has already been mentioned but I think Frank primarily took a dim view on organised religion showing how it can be used to manipulate whole societies.



I think the OP meant Absolution Gap, as it's there - but I read it as a dig at religion, given that a mere virus or disease could make you religious., which sortof could be read to imply that religious people today are ill.... There is a moment in Chasm city where someone offers the protagonist a virus too or give it to him, from memory, that might be important for the main character's development. 

I never saw Dune as saying much about relgion - other than the manipulation that you mention, religion is used by groups for control. The Dune series starts really, I think, warning about deifying messiahs and 'strong men'. It then goes over to examining what a real human with god-like power would actually do.

EDIT: Something I'd like to point out - Spirituality does not always mean religion. I'm not relgious and I've had spiritual (and definitely not relgious) experiences.


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## hitmouse (Sep 18, 2021)

OP is asking about treatments of non-religious spiritual awakenings in SF, not about religion in SF per se. This thread has wondered off the subject a bit.


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## W Collier (Sep 18, 2021)

So, to wander back on, what constitutes a non-religious spiritual awakening?  Best define it before we try to answer the original question of how well it has or will work in sci-fi.


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## Venusian Broon (Sep 18, 2021)

W Collier said:


> So, to wander back on, what constitutes a non-religious spiritual awakening?  Best define it before we try to answer the original question of how well it has or will work in sci-fi.



I tentatively suggest that Arthur C. Clarkes _Childhood's End _could qualify as 'spiritual' and SF.


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## W Collier (Sep 18, 2021)

How so?  What about it are you characterizing as spiritual?  (Not saying you're wrong, just opening the floor.)


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## hitmouse (Sep 18, 2021)

Venusian Broon said:


> I tentatively suggest that Arthur C. Clarkes _Childhood's End _could qualify as 'spiritual' and SF.


I agree. Clarke was into his Teilhard de Chardan type spiritual transcendence.

Iain M Banks has something analogous in his Culture novels.

Blood Music by Greg Bear has another take on this. 


…and back to Paul Atreides in Dune for individual spiritual awakenings.


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## Venusian Broon (Sep 18, 2021)

Well it's story of us humans evolving to join the overmind - something we normal humans (in the book) have little understanding or even contact with. So it's an awakening of a species to a much more expanded universe. A complete change of view. 

Surely the total re-organistion of your view of the universe counts as a massive spiritual event (the universe itself has not changed at any point, it's your understanding of it that has.)

As a side note I remember reading ACC himself put in an introduction that he got swept up in the Uri Geller stuff in the early 70s, what with spoon bending and psychic powers*, that for a few days he even started to believe that these manifestations were the start of the changes he had written about in _Childhood's End _and said a few stupid things. But then he sobered up and realised they were mainly just tricks.  

===============================

* As a second side note, I find it interesting how much of Golden Era SF assumed that humans were going to have psychic powers like telepathy or telekinesis etc. Much less so now, I feel.


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## Wayne Mack (Sep 19, 2021)

My spelling must be diminishing with old age,


Wayne Mack said:


> I am not sure exactly how to interrupt the question


Should have been, "I am not sure how to interpret the question...'


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## Parson (Sep 20, 2021)

Science Fiction can center a story or comment on almost anything. Religion is not excepted from that rule.


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## Montero (Sep 20, 2021)

A broad definition of spirituality would be useful here - are you talking purely otherworldly - as in a belief in spirits/higher power/supreme being(s)?
Or meditation?
Or would you include ways of interacting with the world around you from other people to nature? I am thinking of humanism, of Bill and Ted's "Be Excellent to Each Other", of vegetarianism and veganism, of believing that nature is to be protected? (Or it is all there to be exploited by man - that too is a belief, though not one I like.)

It is fantasy, not sf, but you might find Bujold's "World of the Five Gods" useful reading (as well as entertaining)  as the gods in that are most definitely real - it is their interaction with people that she examines and that is very interesting - and is not at all "do this or else".


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## Venusian Broon (Sep 20, 2021)

Montero said:


> A broad definition of spirituality would be useful here - are you talking purely otherworldly - as in a belief in spirits/higher power/supreme being(s)?
> Or meditation?
> Or would you include ways of interacting with the world around you from other people to nature? I am thinking of humanism, of Bill and Ted's "Be Excellent to Each Other", of vegetarianism and veganism, of believing that nature is to be protected? (Or it is all there to be exploited by man - that too is a belief, though not one I like.)


Well, the literal dictionary definition of spirituality is:

"the quality of being concerned with the human spirit or soul as opposed to material or physical things."

It's a broad church and can be applied to many things.


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## HareBrain (Sep 20, 2021)

Wayne Mack said:


> Should have been, "I am not sure how to interpret the question...'



Not being sure how to interrupt it was quite understandable, though, given that the question had been asked several hours previously.


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## Jo Zebedee (Sep 20, 2021)

One thing we need to remember is that part of the strength of sff is the space for a reflective mirror, and that means spirtuality absolutely has a place in the canon. If we can't explore and, sometimes, challenge, then why are we here? It's not all for the blasters and thigh-high boots, surely? I wrote Abendau as much about exploring my own concept of existentialism as I did anything to do with space opera.


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## Montero (Sep 20, 2021)

Venusian Broon said:


> Well, the literal dictionary definition of spirituality is:
> 
> "the quality of being concerned with the human spirit or soul as opposed to material or physical things."
> 
> It's a broad church and can be applied to many things.


Watched "Pride" the other year (and re-watched it) and there is a lovely scene where one of the striking miners wives sings a folk song with the punchline of  "Give us bread, but give us roses".





I think that defines spirituality for me - feed the body and the spirit.


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## Dan Jones (Sep 21, 2021)

I can't think of a single genre of book that isn't compatible with exploring questions of spirituality, religiosity, and the big questions of human experience. 

In fact SF seems in some way to be uniquely placed to push these questions farther than most genres; it can ponder whether these questions change over time as we reach far future scenarios, or whether they are replaced by something else, or whether, for all the advances in technology and endeavour, there are ancient truths that are so deeply embedded in our biologies and behaviours that no matter how many light years we travel, we cannot extricate them from ourselves?


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## Brian G Turner (Sep 21, 2021)

_Babylon 5_ has strong spiritual themes, especially in terms of Minbari and Naarn philosophy, not least the concept that we are all the universe experiencing itself. And that's before we get into more overt plot elements, which I won't mention because I know one active member has just started watching it now and I don't want to post spoilers.


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## Montero (Sep 21, 2021)

Yes. The Centauri are not what you'd call spiritual.

I do love the religious conference episode. Especially Delenn's expression on a couple of occasions.


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## Deke (Sep 24, 2021)

Battlestar Galactica reboot did a good job of blending the spiritual and the sci fi with their lords of Kobol plot line.


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## paranoid marvin (Sep 25, 2021)

Yes, BSG used it as the guiding principal for their journey, but it tended not to feature too heavily in the episodes.

DS9 used it far too much towards the end of the run, and the show finished poorly and disappointingly.


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## CTRandall (Sep 25, 2021)

Ummm...

May the Force be with you?


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## Guttersnipe (Dec 8, 2021)

To paraphrase astrophysicist Neil deGrasse Tyson, there is something poetic and spiritual about knowing that we are made of stardust. If it works with science, it should work with science fiction.


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## Justin Swanton (Dec 11, 2021)

My own take is that 'spirituality' has become such a vague word, used for so many different things, that it no longer has any meaning. If "spirituality" is used to mean "preoccupation with religious beliefs and their practical consequences" then my answer is yes.


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## bretbernhoft (Dec 11, 2021)

I'm pleased to read all of the responses to the original question about whether science fiction and spirituality can mesh well together. I've been giving this query more time in my own mind, and I'm quite certain the answer is "_Yes"_. Spirituality and science fiction can and do go well together.

What I currently exploring, is how the social sciences have made sense of sacredness in digital environments; in simulations. As well as how technology is used in a spiritually significant way by anyone, past or present.

What I've found is that countless users of technology and readers of science fiction understand that tech/tools can be spiritual, in some way for them. The trick now is for me to understand (more generally speaking) how this occurs for most people who experience "it".

In other words, I am seeking to understand the larger narrative of how science fiction and technology are spiritual for so many people. When I come to a clear answer, I will share within this forum.


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## psikeyhackr (Dec 12, 2021)

Have you read any of Ian Stevenson's books.









						Ian Stevenson - Wikipedia
					






					en.m.wikipedia.org
				




The words 'avatar' and 'reincarnation' are not used in The Matrix movies but the ideas are woven into it.









						The Matrix: Every Hint Neo Wasn't The First ONE
					

The Matrix Reloaded's twist was foreshadowed.




					screenrant.com
				








__





						The Aquarian Gospel of Jesus Christ Index
					

The Aquarian Gospel of Jesus Christ, by Levi H. Dowling, [1920], full text etext at sacred-texts.com



					www.sacred-texts.com


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## paranoid marvin (Dec 12, 2021)

Some of the questions I think related to spirituality ' what is our reason for existence', 'what happens when we die' and 'are we alone in the universe' I think are pretty much fundamental to scifi.


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