# Asteroid Belt



## Eriond (Sep 4, 2006)

Uh... Hi. I'm an aspiring game developer (and avid sci-fi fantasy reader) and I need a bit of science fiction consulting . (apologies if this is in the wrong section)

Now, I'm planning to set my game in an asteroid belt, essentially a star system without any planets, only one giant belt. My main problem is... fuel and food. Now, I know you can mine minerals from asteroids, etc, something that's predominant in science-fiction, but what I need to know is, exactly what can be mined?

What I'm really asking is, can you mine carbon and oxygen from asteroids? 

Also, I'm planning to have the main source of power to be anti-matter power cells and fusion reactors. Now, I know fusion requries hydrogen, but is there enough ambient hydrogen just in space (or in an asteroid belt for that matter) for it to be energy-efficient to scoop it up and use it for fuel, or am I going to have to go with solar power?

Any help is much appreciated ,
Eriond


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## zorcarepublic (Sep 6, 2006)

/rubs hands

Don't you worry, Im here to help.

Asteroids: In fact, the majority of asteroids are of the carbonaceous (sp?) chondritic type, which means that carbon should be no problem.

And, if you're relatively well up-to-date on the hypothesis of system forming, you can have a Kuiper Belt and/or an Oort cloud as well. The Oort cloud is too far away if you haven't got a form of FTL (its supposed to be around one light year from the system primary for main-sequence stars), but the Kuiper Belt is around where Pluto would be. In fact, thats the reason why some people are considering that Pluto is not a planet--because of the Kuiper Belt. And Kuiper Belt objects are full of water ice, so you've got no problem water-wise.

Hydrogen can be obtained from the Kuiper Belt as well, simply by splitting the water. And the way you can do this? Solar power. Simply use the star to split water into oxygen and hydrogen. It'd have to be close-ish to the star (about 1 AU should be sufficient), but then you could have civilian stations, or neutral stations etc that could process the fuel, sell it at a knock-down price (enough for a profit), and also be able to grow food by using hydroponic bays.

But, if I might make a suggestion, don't go entirely for asteroid belts. The microgravity of such bodies will mean that, if you want to go back to a standard planet, you might very well be killed. I'd suggest having one or two gas giants with large moons, or a selection of rocky bodies between Mars and Earth size. It'd also give you a place to grow other food than the 'gas stations'

I hope thats helped...


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## Coops (Sep 6, 2006)

I agree with zorca:
Rather than scoop the Hydrogen, you are better off mining comets or ice asteroids for water and using solar power to make Hydrogen and Oxygen.

Water to drink and use as a solvent in the food conversion process.
Oxygen to breathe and make food along with the Carbon.
Hydrogen to power the fusion reactors.
How will you make the antimatter?  Maybe you don't really need it.

You can get Carbon from the asteroids along with some heavy metals (iron, nickel, and some trace elements like Manganese, Magnesium, Copper, Zinc etc.)  Use bacteria to process the Carbon into edible forms using water and oxygen.  You will also need a supply of Nitrogen, Sulfur and Phosphorus to make food.
Instead of bacteria, you might also consider using some as yet undiscovered manmade catalysts to convert carbon to sugars, proteins and lipids.


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## Dave (Sep 6, 2006)

Coops said:
			
		

> Use bacteria to process the Carbon into edible forms using water and oxygen.  You will also need a supply of Nitrogen, Sulfur and Phosphorus to make food.
> Instead of bacteria, you might also consider using some as yet undiscovered manmade catalysts to convert carbon to sugars, proteins and lipids.


I think I'll give that restaurant a miss and stick with my regular pre-packed astronaut meals.


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## Eriond (Sep 6, 2006)

Thanks everyone who replied  I appreciate the help.

And just in response...


			
				zorcarepublic said:
			
		

> But, if I might make a suggestion, don't go entirely for asteroid belts. The microgravity of such bodies will mean that, if you want to go back to a standard planet, you might very well be killed. I'd suggest having one or two gas giants with large moons, or a selection of rocky bodies between Mars and Earth size. It'd also give you a place to grow other food than the 'gas stations



I'm trying to pioneer a new type of game, sort of a survival sci-fi game, rather than the typical space rpg, where one just sits around and hyperjumps/uses jumpgates/some other form of super-ftl to escape any situation and just run trade routes all day.

So yeah. Landing back on a planet won't have a problem. I'm also planning to have a small group of factions of not too many people, so there won't be too many mouths to feed, or huge navies. This way you don't have the huge galactic empires and commonwealths spanning entire solar systems, which would if you took things seriously be almost entirely impossible for a player character to actually affect. If I use a few thousand people spread out over an asteroid belt, and have regions which are rich in certain minerals, etc.., this being the only place you can get them, you can be there'll be fighting. You'll also need to dodge asteroids, which is always fun


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## zorcarepublic (Sep 7, 2006)

Thats fine.

Actually, you must be a twin, because I was thinking of a similar set-up for an RPG/SD. Some weird astronomical coincidences meant that multiple star systems had drifted close to each other, and because no FTL drive had been discovered (yet) the races on each star met for the first time.

Essentially a clash of cultures-type game.


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## SteveR (Sep 7, 2006)

With respect to a rare metal that might be considered valuable in the game cconsider iridium. This is found in some asteroids in fairly small quantities and so might be considered rare and thus valuable. Iridium - has a nice ring to it anyway - like platimun and latinum from DS9.


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## zorcarepublic (Sep 8, 2006)

Yes, iridium is reasonably useful. But I keep forgetting--what is it useful for?


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## Coops (Sep 8, 2006)

From the Wikipedia

"Iridium ...A dense, very hard, brittle, silvery-white transition metal of the platinum family, iridium is used in high strength alloys that can withstand high temperatures and occurs in natural alloys with platinum or osmium. Iridium is notable for being the most corrosion resistant element known and for its association with the demise of the dinosaurs, in the form of a meteorite strike. It is used in high temperature apparatus, electrical contacts, and as a hardening agent for platinum."


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## SteveR (Sep 8, 2006)

I was just going to say that when Coops beat me to it!


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## Milk (Sep 9, 2006)

I always like the idea of mining microscopic black holes for an energy source.

I think it was in the Nine Worlds Saga (which would be one of Ophiuchi Hotline, Golden Globe, Steel Beach) of John Varley. Although it may have been in another storyline. Anyhow I remember it and it stuck.  The miners would search for 20 years just to harvest a single tiny black hole.  One sell and they make enough money to retire.

A few science fiction books take the idea of mining water ice. For propellant from the h2 and also for slamming into planetoids to give an atmosphere for a few decades before it dissapates.


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## chrispenycate (Sep 11, 2006)

If the protoplanetary lense condensed into a series of small bodies instead of planets it is reasonable to suppose (which means "might be completely wrong") that the elements available would be roughly equivalent to those in the cloud that turned into our solar system. Ninety oomph percent is hydrogen or helium, largely concentrated in our system in the gas giants, but whose escape velocity ensures that they would never be captured by the minibodies, and would only exist as chemical compounds (and _nothing _reacts with helium) So water ice, metallic hydrides, a few organics; a bit like comets. Huge masses of iron and nickle, from the bottom of the energy curve; we have a tendency to forget how great a percentage of the Earth's mass is core, and think of the rocks we walk on as heavy; actually, they're the light scum that's floated to the top. I'd expect the asteroids to contain a larger quantity of the heavier minerals than the solar asteroid belt. Carbon, silicon, oxygen, aluminium, all the elements of the crust will be there, and in quantity, but I put, as a mere suggestion, possibly fairly dilute. Without a gas giant's gravitational field stirring the mess, why would the elementstend to get concentated into "nickel/iron" or "carboniferous chondrite"? More likely it would be pretty homogenous, heavier, higher melting point closer to the star, lighter further out. Bad for the story; it needs a rich vein of this or that, oxygen rich to regenerate the atmosphere, platinum rich to be worth mining, whereas what I'm offering is an everything poor stew. Answer? Either tailored lifeforms (microgravity and vacuum resistant) or von Neumann machines, essentially a manufactured version of the same thing, concentrating elements over the decades, specific species for specific elements, then being "harvested" when sufficiently big, or sufficiently numerous, to be commercially interesting, Evidently, the company that "sows" them believes it has some kind of moral right over the proceeds; but does it expect this to be eternal? Over the kind of timescales we are considering, governments and legal systems are transient affairs, civilisations temporary; even if a company doesn't go bankrupt over the first century, whose to say that no other company can convince the government in power that, when the capital expenditures have been recuperated, competion is good for the economy…
Oh, I'm sorry, I've diverged from the original question; I tend to do that, I'm afraid. Never leave me alone with an idea, you'll probably end up with more than you bargained for.


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