# Why do you think the American Mayans disappeared



## Haidi (Feb 9, 2013)

Hi!

Have you studied ever about the Mayans in America?  What did your book say about, why did they disappear? What is your own thought about it? Thank you for telling and answering!

My books give several different reasons:
-They disappeared because of the Spanish invader, (they coundn't defend themselves.)
-They disappeared because of illnesses
- They disappeared because of weather changes (but to where?)


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## Brian G Turner (Feb 9, 2013)

The Mayans were subjugated by the Spanish.


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## Venusian Broon (Feb 9, 2013)

Simple answer: what I,Brian says. 

The current Maya would be a bit surprised to be described as dissappeared. They're still in the same places today. 

Perhaps you are thinking about the fall of the classic Mayan Empire 250-925 AD, who appear to give way or are replaced by a strong Toltec state in many of the areas previously Mayan. This classic period is the pinnacle of the independent Mayan civilisation (ignoring post independance from Spain). However I don't think the Toltec state lasted that long and it all became a bit fragmentary

What caused this great classic Maya civilisation to collapse? My souce book (Michael D. Coe's _The Maya_) says no one knows. But he says that archeologists and historians agree that three factors were paramount. 

1) Endemic internecine warfare
2) Overpopulation and accompanying environmental collapse
3) Drought. 

When the Spanish arrived in 1530 it was the coup d' grace as they brought diseases that virtually wiped out (I think) up to 90% of the population. So they were too weak to do anything about Spanish subjugation and colonialism 

At least that's what I think at the moment. I am probaby wrong in a few or some of the details


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## Vertigo (Feb 9, 2013)

That's pretty much how I understood it VB; my understanding is that as a coherent civilisation they were pretty much done (for exactly the reasons you gave) by the time the Spaniards arrived on the scene.


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## Bowler1 (Feb 14, 2013)

The movie Apocalypto hints at all the problems that brought down the Mayan if you've not already seen it. Whatever problems this civilisation was having, the Spainish finished them off, small pox mostly.


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## jasminevincent (Feb 26, 2013)

I agree with you Boron. Mayas are still around today and are living in countries like Bolivia, Guatemala, etc. And some of the Mayan children are still learning their ancestor language.

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## AnyaKimlin (Feb 26, 2013)

As the others have said they are still here just like the Egyptians, Greek and Romans.   There are a variety of reasons but I think with any disaster the pampered/better fed rich are the better fed/first to save themselves etc which leaves a less competent population and they continue in less great circumstances.

It is a lot more difficult to build your pyramids without an army of slaves.


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## jastius (Mar 6, 2013)

the American Mayans were all the way up into the Utah - Nevada areas before they lost steam. One of the interesting things about these particular areas, ( besides the dried up primordial seas and the odd creatures thereof) is that is is the only place on the North American continent with a reservoir of creatures that all carry the bubonic plague. 
Using the geologic studies done on the Yucatan peninsula, there was a meteor strike in the area of the sea of Mexico that flattened everything. Since we know now that the sea of Mexico is a giant oil reservoir area, there was probably a massive  amount of sea life lost as well,( if the BP well incident is any sort of gauge).  So your if you were fleeing such a catastrophe would be away from this area, traveling upwards to the north. An area unbeknownst to the Mayans, endemic with Bubonic Plague active within the animals. As soon as they stopped and had lunch on the nearest wild life, it would have been introduced into their group. The usual rate of survival is less then three percent of any given population. They couldn't flee back south , because there were only ashes left of the great forest (due to the meteor strike).  No forest, no food. So they were virtually extinguished in the area. several hundred years later, in the 1790's when the mountain men were exploring the interior of the continent, there were reported in the Utah area tribes of indians with dark hair and blue eyes, similar to the lost mayans. When a proper expedition was mounted to search for these tribes, they weren't found, only the tribe that had taken over the area, the Apache. Whether they were integrated or not is not certain, but to this day some of the Apaches are born with blue eyes.


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## Nerds_feather (Mar 6, 2013)

I said:


> The Mayans were subjugated by the Spanish.



Technically true, but when the Spanish came to present-day Mexico and Guatemala the Maya were already subjugated by newer peoples like the Aztecs, whose empire the Spanish did indeed cause to collapse. 

As it happens, the classic Mayan period (when they built the pyramids and did all the awesome astronomical/calendrical stuff) had ended about 500 years before the Spanish arrived. There are several plausible theories outlined in the wiki page for why the classic Maya civilization collapsed, but as I understand it most experts today theorize it was from a combination of drought and internecine warfare.


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## MPorter (Jun 14, 2013)

I blame time travel.

~Mike


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## Tor__Hershman (Jun 24, 2013)

From what I know, and on this subject that 'tis tiny, I would say 
over-farming the land and lack of knowledge of fertilizers.


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## BAYLOR (Oct 1, 2017)

Slash and burn agriculture exhausted the farm land and combined with probable drought conditions resulted in  Not enough food to sustain the cites caused them to abandon their cities.


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## BAYLOR (Oct 11, 2020)

Civil war perhaps?


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## Narkalui (Oct 29, 2020)

My guess would be a combination of over farming, drought, subsequent famine and then civil war.

Frankly, I'm far more fascinated by the Olmecs


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## Don (Oct 30, 2020)

AnyaKimlin said:


> As the others have said they are still here just like the Egyptians, Greek and Romans.   There are a variety of reasons but I think with any disaster the pampered/better fed rich are the better fed/first to save themselves etc which leaves a less competent population and they continue in less great circumstances.
> 
> It is a lot more difficult to build your pyramids without an army of slaves.



Lower ranking Mayans probably enjoyed urban excitement at first. Although there was always a chance they'd get picked to be sacrificed,  the odds were generally quite low. But, the next thing you know, the chief's three sons each demanded their very own sacrifice in order to feel as important as dad. So, lower ranking Mayans did the math and returned to jungle life.


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## Vladd67 (Oct 30, 2020)

It's quite clearly documented that the Mayans escaped from the Spanish to the Valley of the Vanished in present-day Hidalgo where they were discovered by Clark Savage. After Clark's murder, the vast gold reserve of the valley was used by his son Clark 'Doc' Savage to carry out his mission of righting wrongs and punishing evildoers." 
As a side note, I have just started reading some of these tales again, the casual racism does jar a little.


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## Venusian Broon (Oct 30, 2020)

Narkalui said:


> My guess would be a combination of over farming, drought, subsequent famine and then civil war.
> 
> Frankly, I'm far more fascinated by the Olmecs


This, nice and timely lecture suggests that over-farming is a bit old hat and probably not true - the Maya were in fact very good at preserving what is a pretty delicate environment. However drought likely did have a big impact on crops.






His main point is that he's found evidence that there could have been invaders/new elite coming from the West that may have helped the collapse, I believe. (Taking advantage of societies in turmoil because of drought? And other things of course!)

Still would recommend the lecture because he does discuss it in reasonable detail.


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## svalbard (Oct 31, 2020)

BAYLOR said:


> Slash and burn agriculture exhausted the farm land and combined with probable drought conditions resulted in  Not enough food to sustain the cites caused them to abandon their cities.





BAYLOR said:


> Civil war perhaps?



I have to say Baylor that you are bona fide legend in resurrecting threads. Almost 3 years to the day you reply to your  own post. Quite remarkable. Love it


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## BAYLOR (Nov 2, 2020)

svalbard said:


> I have to say Baylor that you are bona fide legend in resurrecting threads. Almost 3 years to the day you reply to your  own post. Quite remarkable. Love it



Sometimes,  I long to ponder things for very long periods  of time .


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