# Vampires At The Movies



## Foxbat (Aug 27, 2005)

OK. It's not quite september yet but I thought I'd start this one off a little early to give you folk a chance to think. This month, we're trying out a theme: *Vampires At The Movies*

Basically it's just an opportunity to say what you want on this subject. Do you like Vampire films? Do you hate them? In both cases - why? What films do it for you? Absolutely anything on the subject of vampirism and celluloid can be discussed.

If this goes well, we could perhaps have other theme months - maybe 50s Science Fiction movies or Monster Movies or something. I suppose this is a bit of a test run so why not come and have a good rant about your favourite bloodsucker


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## Foxbat (Aug 27, 2005)

I'll start the ball rolling (hopefully)

I suppose I’m a bit of a traditionalist when it comes to Vampires. Much as I admired Max Schreck in his 1922 portrayal of Nosferatu,  I prefer the suave sense of nobility brought to the role by Bela Lugosi. His Hungarian tinged accent, formal attire and his piercing stare have become staple visions of the Vampire about town. Certainly more elegant than that fanged furball we call the Wolfman – or the incoherent lumbering monster of Frankenstein folly, the vampire seems to be the monster everybody would want to be seen with. 

Still there are others – and one that springs to mind is Guillermo Del Toro’s Cronos. It provides an interesting slant on the tale of the bloodsucker. An old man discovers a clockwork beetle-like device, which had been devised by some  Alchemist long ago. It prolongs life by sucking the blood from innocents and transferring that very same life-essence to its owner. Others covet this device and conflict quickly ensues. Starring Ron Pearlman, it’s well worth looking out for.

Then we have The Last Man On Earth (adapted from I Am Legend by Richard Mathieson). This movie features Vincent Price as (yes…you’ve guessed it…the last man on Earth). He stalks the day whilst his Vampire enemies stalks the night. This story asks an interesting question – who is the freak? One man? Or hordes of Vampires? It’s a much truer telling of the original story than The Omega Man (starring Charlton Heston). Although this film is good in its own right, it certainly suffers by way of the vampires being replaced by albino mutants. It just does not have that edge that a pair of fangs and red eyes gives you.

And what about that age-old question? Why do we like vampires so much? The usual answer is that there is a sexual element involved and that the vampire (him/herself) is analogous to a sexually transmitted disease. Certainly Hammer made a point of reaping this point of view with the likes of Twins Of Evil with it’s beautiful,  heaving breasted vampire girls. I think there’s probably truth in this link of vampire and sex – and maybe that’s why they are so popular. A few years ago, I went to ‘Dracula the ballet’ in the Festival Theatre in Edinburgh (very good and highly recommended) and was utterly amazed at the number of folk that came either dressed as vampires or as wasp-waisted, pale faced victims in full Victorian costume. Perhaps there’s an element of power involved here. Well, they do say that power and sex are interchangeable.

Vampires also work well with their tongues firmly in their cheeks (they just have to be careful not to bite) and one of my all time favourites that carries a fine sense of humour is John Carpenter’s The Vampires. The master of the low budget flick really manages to update and re-position the vampire in the modern world (and update some killing techniques into the bargain). Watching this movie is as  good a way  I can think of to waste an hour and a half.


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## polymorphikos (Aug 28, 2005)

Vampires work marvellously as monsters, because, as Foxbat said, they are something to be both feared and desired. Like pretty flames. 



Perhaps it’s because of this that I love the repulsive vampires so much. The Reapers from Blade two are marvellous constructions, as is Old Vlad in the otherwise-disposable Bram Stoker’s Dracula (Oldman did Old Vlad so well, yet Young Vlad – ugh), and of course Count Orloc. They instantly become even more disturbing and perverse by assosciation, and the sexual element of the vampire takes-on double horror.


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## Wolfeborn (Sep 2, 2005)

I love vampire films, everything from bella legosi through hammer into the new stuff such as blade, although vampires themselves I have littleaffinity with.

Some of my vaourite vamp flicks are those that take vampires adn either set them in a modern sense or ad soem twists into the typical count in a castle terrorising the villagers.  two such movies are Near dark, adn Lost boys, both are very witty and show vampires in a very different light to others, I especially like the fact that both these films are set in a modern time yet keep the majority of the vampire mythos.

Another very good vampire flick that is different from the norm is Shadow of the vampire, extremely funny and very well thought out script as the vampire playing max shrek in nosferatu is actually a real vampire ensues filming at night in an abandoned set etc.

anyone else love the different from the norm vampire films? and could possibly recomend some?


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## Foxbat (Sep 2, 2005)

I think that a new twist or take on the vampire story definitely keeps the genre alive. Sometimes those new ideas can be extremely subtle - a new score for the Bela Lugosi Dracula (performed by the Kronos Quartet and composed by Philip Glass) makes watching this movie almost like a brand new experience. 

As for recommendations on variations on vampire flicks, you might want to check out David Cronenberg's _Rabid _for something a little different.

I've never seen Near Dark so I'll have to find out more about that one


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## Jason_Taverner (Sep 7, 2005)

I've always been a fan of vampire films I started with the old hammer films when I was younger but lately there hasn't been a good outing for a vamp. The first time I saw blade I loved it, it brought a bit of freshness into the old blood sucker much like lost boys did. The latest blade film was terrible and I can't think of a good vampire film for the last 5yrs. In fact I think that horror films are all losing the edge maybe its me seen that many films always looking for something new, but they get so cut these days to get a lower BBFC rating you may as well change the name to teen drama rather than horror!


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## Wolfeborn (Sep 7, 2005)

Your absolutley right most horror films are so wishy washy its unbeleivable, last outting for blade was attrocius and havent been scared by a film since I was about 13 .  Perhaps someone will go against the grain and come up with a gritty horror film, Saw was extremely well done, and amazingly an 18 certificate (in uk at least) but as for vampire films I dont think youll se a decent one for some time, Unless of course I manage to finish writing my book and it gets made into a film but that could be years hehe.


I guess we'll just have to keep watching the old classics and hope something turns up.  Is Blade the last good vampire film?  Underworld as trerrible not in that it was a bad film but because it could have been soooo much better.


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## Ahdkaw (Sep 7, 2005)

I can't get into a long diatribe about this.

Nevertheless my favourite recent vampire flick has to be From Dusk Till Dawn, which I was completely unaware it was a vampire flick until I watched the movie. Fantastic, and the good thinmg was that it seemed to stick to the basic truths regarding vampires, it didn't make up stuff about vampires that wasn't already known.

I think now though that vampires have changed so much, we're seeing a more fantasised version of vampires, and not the original style vampire of ye olde molde days.

Like Buffy the Vampire Slayer which was so full of inconsistencies it was ridiculous, but then it was such a fun movie it didn't really matter too much.


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## Lacedaemonian (Sep 7, 2005)

Vampires these days seem to get lumbered with too many homo erotic overtones for my taste.  Not sure why the gays hijacked this particular 'monster' but it is not cool.  

I loved Oldham as Dracula in the Bram Stoker movie but Canoe Reeves almost ruined this movie for me.


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## Foxbat (Sep 7, 2005)

> I think now though that vampires have changed so much, we're seeing a more fantasised version of vampires, and not the original style vampire of ye olde molde days.



I think this is an important point. To me (at least) there is something very Victorian about the Vampire (or should that be Edwardian?) 

 However, I think there is merit in attempting to update this view but (as is the norm) many people will be resistant to change. This is possibly one reason why people don't take too well to repositioning the vampire in cinema. But my personal view is that it is not so much the retelling of the vampire that is the problem but the general lack of imagination (and writing talent) within Hollywood today. I think that with the right combination of writer/director/actors, there is still plenty of mileage within the genre.


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## Foxbat (Sep 7, 2005)

> Vampires these days seem to get lumbered with too many homo erotic overtones for my taste.


 
I've always never been quite sure about this. Yes, first impressions would tend to agree that there is a homo-erotic overtone but I wonder if perhaps it is not so much the vampire that comes across as homo-erotic or that our perceptions have become skewed? 

What I mean is that the Vampire lusting after blood probably will not care whether the victim is male or female, but it seems to make a difference to the viewer. Dracula biting the neck of a female seems more acceptable than Dracula biting the neck of a man....... but blood is blood so does it really matter to him?


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## Jason_Taverner (Sep 8, 2005)

I think in the earlier days with the vamp film they including  homo-erotic overtone to make things a little bit more disturbing for the viewer as gay relationships in the 70's for example were frowned on ppl were very narrow minded back then.  To Ahdkaw I would agree with ur point on dusk till dawn I hadn't heard of it before didn't know what it was about and I was so surprised and excited when it turned out to be a vampire movie I loved it I still do today but I don't think it ages too well but I have watched a lot. 

If anyone is looking for an entertaining new horror I would recommend the descent a good old bristish ****-fest


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## polymorphikos (Sep 8, 2005)

On the subject of undertones, we studied Dracula this semester in Narrative & Genre, and the general consensus amongst academics seems to be that Bram Stoker was subconsciously (or consciously) hot for cockerel. This irked me, as I always found the most disturbing aspect of the vampire, in regards to sexuality, to be its omnisexual nature. Basically, the vampire will go anything with a bit of life in it. 

On a side note, I have discovered in studying lit at uni that every single novel, film or general work of art ever made is either homosexual, feminist or mysoginist. Damn you, modern era.


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## sanityassassin (Sep 8, 2005)

I quite like vampire films and not all seem to contain a sexual subplot in modern films there seems to be a need for love storys in most films which i think is why it appears


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## MoonLover (Sep 9, 2005)

I'll watch (or read) anything with fangs in it. One of the best vampire flicks I've seen is "Tale Of A Vampire", which had Julian Sands as the lead biter. I also enjoyed Gary Oldman's portrayal of Vlad some years ago. Lost Boys is a perennial favourite at my house.
I've always liked Anne Rice's description of a vampire as "angels going in the other direction". They're metaphysical creatures with souls who are as apt to ignore you as to bite you.
The one thing that I've always found annoying in general vampiric literature and movies is the old 'holy water and crucifix' routine. Why is it that the Christian God is seen to be repellent to these creatures? I think vampires (and the legend of them) have been around far longer than that particular deity - so why not run at the sight of Ganesh or Shiva as well? Has Bollywood ever made a vamp flick?

Karen


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## Foxbat (Sep 9, 2005)

> The one thing that I've always found annoying in general vampiric literature and movies is the old 'holy water and crucifix' routine. Why is it that the Christian God is seen to be repellent to these creatures? I think vampires (and the legend of them) have been around far longer than that particular deity - so why not run at the sight of Ganesh or Shiva as well? Has Bollywood ever made a vamp flick?


 
A very good point. It may well be that our view has become polarised by the worldwide fame of Bram Stoker's bloodsucker, and we forget that there are vampire roots in other cultures. I, for one, would welcome a new cultural approach to the vampire story.


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## Leto (Sep 9, 2005)

Check for south-asian and chinese or japanese ghost movies then. Can't name one right now, but they often imply vampires (sucking more the life essence than the actual blood).




			
				Lacedaemonian said:
			
		

> Vampires these days seem to get lumbered with too many homo erotic overtones for my taste.  Not sure why the gays hijacked this particular 'monster' but it is not cool.


Not these days. Vampires are - in most cultures - the ultimate sex fiend, and they'd prey on you using desire as a bait no matter what your gender is. 
_Carmilla_ by Sheridan Le Fanu, written by a man in 19th century, is about lesbian homoerotism. And led to several movies (mostly in the 70s -80s) between soft porn and horror. 
Besides, strangely (and I have in mind Anne Rice's vampires), male homo erotic overtones is not made to seduce gay men, but to attract female young audience (look at male slash fanfic, 95 % of them is written by women) who seems turned on by it. Why ? don't know.


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## polymorphikos (Sep 9, 2005)

Same reason men like lesbians, probably. I'm in an anime club and half the girls (as well as some of the guys) are mad for yaoi, or gay cartoon porn. However, this seems largely to do with the camp value.

I'd like to see a movie about ghouls, myself, or maybe lamia or something. I know ghouls live in graveyards and eat corpses, but I don't care.

I'd also like to touch on Anne Rice - if vampires were real, I believe they would have eaten her by now.


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## Leto (Sep 9, 2005)

remember a fine Tale from the Crypt episod with ghouls. And of course there's always _Cabal_ by Clive Barker.


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## polymorphikos (Sep 9, 2005)

I have not read this Cabal book. But I will grab the episode of Tales from the Crypt should I come across it. 

I hope next month we do witches.


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## Leto (Sep 9, 2005)

It is a book, and a movie directed by Clive Barker. After all we're in the movie section 

Where would some one classes the Three Mothers as despicted by Dario Argento : goddesses ? vampires ? or witches ?


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## MoonLover (Sep 10, 2005)

Leto said:
			
		

> Check for south-asian and chinese or japanese ghost movies then. Can't name one right now, but they often imply vampires (sucking more the life essence than the actual blood).
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
I think you're right about the male homo-erotic overtones appealing to women more than gay men themselves. I'll go out on a limb and say that women find such trysts attractive because we perceive it as being deviod of the habitual guilt that women are taught to associate sex with. What the vampire adds to the mix is a total domination, of body, soul and sexuality. To give in to the fiend is to embrace death, and yet it is irresistable.
Karen


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## ravenus (Sep 10, 2005)

> Has Bollywood ever made a vamp flick?


The *Ramsay Brothers* who were a sort of Indian counterpart to *Hammer Studios *(but much poorer both money and talent wise) made a fair number of films in which the monster is basically a variant on the vampire mythos, given to sleeping in crypts and draining victims of life and often sensitive to sunlight and religious artefacts, be they crucifixes or Hindu symbols like tridents.

If you don't know the Hindi language though, you'll have a bad time of it because atleast in India their films are not available in english subtitled form and they're not known much outside of India.

Hammer themselves made a film in co-production with Hong Kong's Shaw Brothers, a Kung Fu meets Dracula venture called The Seven Golden Vampires or something like that, where the vampires are also scared of Buddhist icons.

*@Karen:*
Were you a part of Richard Scheib's now defunct forums?


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## Jason_Taverner (Sep 10, 2005)

The seven golden vimpires I wouldn't recommend that to many ppl isn't the best of films the dark days of hammer towards the end I think that was made. The asian vimpire films where the suck the souls are an interesting idea and its fun to see another cultures view on the subject but as i watched one or two of them and found them terrible films very very bad effects and a dis-jointed story line maybe it was the way it was translated but poor films all round. Can anyone give an example of a published vimpire work or a established vampire myth before bram stoker as I think he basically invented the whole thing alot of books have been written after him that claim there story is set in real roots but where is the eveidence are they not just another take on his story telling genius.


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## ravenus (Sep 10, 2005)

vampire mythology


			
				Jason_Taverner said:
			
		

> Can anyone give an example of a published vimpire work or a established vampire myth before bram stoker as I think he basically invented the whole thing alot of books have been written after him that claim there story is set in real roots but where is the eveidence are they not just another take on his story telling genius.


Vampire mythos has ben part of local folklore of many regions in Europe as well as Asia. Even english literature has had vampire stories before Stoker wrote his magnum opus.

Link to article on Vampire mythology

I quote a relevant excerpt from that article here:


> The first vampire to appear in English fiction seems to be from Johann Tieck's 1800 story _Wake Not the Dead_, but the genre only became popular with the publication of Dr John Polidori's _The Vampyre_ in 1819. This novel centred round one Lord Rutven, the vampire of the title, and was incredibly popular in its day, perhaps because the monster was a thinly disguised caricature of Lord Byron. As you may be aware, this book is one of the results of _that_ evening, by the lake in Switzerland from which _Frankenstein_ also came.
> 
> Quite some time later, 1847 to be precise, the next most influential figure came along, Varney. Told in 108 episodes, totalling over eight hundred pages, _Varney the Vampire, or the Feast of Blood_ satisfied perfectly the public's desire for the macabre and was a great success. Written anonymously, it was long thought that the tale was penned by one Thomas Pecket Prest, though in the 1970s new evidence was revealed to show the author was almost certainly James Malcolm Rymer. At the end of this epic Varney committed suicide by throwing himself into a volcano (for some more info on Varney's life and times see my article on Penny Bloods).
> 
> ...


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## MoonLover (Sep 11, 2005)

*@Karen: *
Were you a part of Richard Scheib's now defunct forums?[/QUOTE]

Umm, no. Who is Richard Scheib?

Karen


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## ravenus (Sep 11, 2005)

Ah OK, because I think there was a Karen there too and damn if your posts didn't sound familiar to hers.
Richard Schieb is a brilliant amateur film critic who focusses on Sci-fi, horror and fantasy films (his website can be seen here).
Richard writes very detailed and insightful reviews and even if one doesn't always agree with his POV one does respect it. The fact that he runs the whole show single-handed and without any real sponsorship is astounding because you'll find likely much more than a thousand reviews of genre films. Thanks to his reviews I discovered a lot of cine gems that were hitherto unknown to me and I recommend the site to anyone interested in films of these genres.

Sometime back his site had a discussion forum but that died out due to insufficient genuine posts and attck by spammers.


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## MoonLover (Sep 12, 2005)

Ahh, well, there are those missing hours that I can never seem to account for.....

Karen


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