# What should Nine Stones represent?



## Asmer20 (Apr 20, 2009)

In my story, one of the tasks of the Lady of the Elements is to find the nine stones that feed loving power to the Healing Sword (I'll explain the concept later).  I tried the four elements, but that leaves five left.  I tried the directions, N E W S NE NW SE SW.  I was going to try something with native american lore, but it would be appreciated if you lend your suggestions, thanks!


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## Shadow Trooper (Apr 20, 2009)

Could be virtues? Like loyalty, honour, selflessness etc


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## HareBrain (Apr 20, 2009)

Is there a particular reason you want it to be nine?


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## ratsy (Apr 20, 2009)

You could say that they each are pieces of fallen gods (asteroids).  In this case they could each represent a different God...ie. god of luck, goddess of love...etc


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## dustinzgirl (Apr 20, 2009)

Asmer20 said:


> In my story, one of the tasks of the Lady of the Elements is to find the nine stones that feed loving power to the Healing Sword (I'll explain the concept later).  I tried the four elements, but that leaves five left.  I tried the directions, N E W S NE NW SE SW.  I was going to try something with native american lore, but it would be appreciated if you lend your suggestions, thanks!



Oh, there's more than four elements, if you are going that route,

Water, Ice
Fire, Lava
Earth, Life
Air, Wind
And one to rule them all.....


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## HareBrain (Apr 20, 2009)

DG no stranger to videogame RPG's methinks ... 

You can't have ice as an element! That's just water plus cold, same as lava is earth plus heat.

BUT you could have the four elements, plus the four humours of the human body (blood, phlegm, yellow and black bile) and of course the fifth element, life (as DG so rightly pointed out) or ether or akasha, which binds both sets of four together.

The four humours were used by medieval (and earlier) physicians, so there's your healing link. And each was also linked to one of the four elements.

Thing is, who would go on a quest to find the Stone of Phlegm?


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## dustinzgirl (Apr 20, 2009)

HareBrain said:


> DG no stranger to videogame RPG's methinks ...
> 
> You can't have ice as an element! That's just water plus cold, same as lava is earth plus heat.
> 
> ...



OK That is just gross.

How about

Earth, Air, Water, Fire
Good, Evil, Neutrality, Chaos, and Spirit


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## Teresa Edgerton (Apr 20, 2009)

The idea of four elements is part of a particular magical/philosophical worldview that need not be that of your story.

When you say "Lady of the Elements," what does that word "elements" mean to you?  Do you mean, as with the classical Earth-Air-Fire-Water, different states of matter?  Different kinds of matter?  Component parts of matter?  "Elements" as in weather? If it's any of these, there could be nine just as easily as any other number.

But whatever you decide to use, it sounds like this is something important enough that it should develop from concepts integral to the world you have created for your story.  My advice would be not to look for _outside_ suggestions, but to look _within_ your story for the answers that may already be there.


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## Teresa Edgerton (Apr 20, 2009)

HareBrain, according to medieval alchemy, heat and cold are not something you add to the four elements, they are two of the properties or principles which define/create them.

Earth -- dry/cold
Air -- hot/wet
Fire -- hot/dry
Water -- wet/cold

(Wet essentially meaning "fluid.")

But in Asmer's world, it could be an entirely different system.


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## ktabic (Apr 20, 2009)

HareBrain said:


> DYou can't have ice as an element! That's just water plus cold, same as lava is earth plus heat.



Would have thought it was more

Ice = water minus fire plus earth
Lava = earth plus fire

The idea being that you only needed the four elements (in differing proportions) to create everything.


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## The Procrastinator (Apr 21, 2009)

The nine stones don't have to symbolise nine specific things. Maybe nine is a sacred number, because its so cool (lets face it, nine _is _cool). Or, if you want specific things, I would take advantage of one of the unique properties of nine and go for three threes. Try thinking of properties or elements in terms of sets of three - the Celts used to do this a lot, its very interesting. Adds a bit of internal consistency to the nine business.


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## Asmer20 (Apr 21, 2009)

Teresa Edgerton said:


> The idea of four elements is part of a particular magical/philosophical worldview that need not be that of your story.
> 
> When you say "Lady of the Elements," what does that word "elements" mean to you? Do you mean, as with the classical Earth-Air-Fire-Water, different states of matter? Different kinds of matter? Component parts of matter? "Elements" as in weather? If it's any of these, there could be nine just as easily as any other number.
> 
> But whatever you decide to use, it sounds like this is something important enough that it should develop from concepts integral to the world you have created for your story. My advice would be not to look for _outside_ suggestions, but to look _within_ your story for the answers that may already be there.


 
Teresa, 

I know you have been following my thread about the thought dialogue.  I think I pointed out that Lady of the Elements is like being the Dalai Lama, she is a spiritual leader who clears the world of its destruction and abuse.  One may suggest that I am solving the environmental issues in a book.  Lady of the Earth was the original name for this leader, but I felt like it didn't fit well, because the Amoretorians develop from four elements, Air Earth, Ether, and Water.  The physical beings serve three elements that they are naturally born to love.  L of El made more sense because she is similar to a President, serving all elements, rather than just earrth servants known as Susols.  I am evidently using common knowledge and expanding it to create a way to solve political disputes and environmental issues that we face in this world today.


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## Asmer20 (Apr 21, 2009)

HareBrain said:


> Is there a particular reason you want it to be nine?


 

I had the idea of having 33 stones, but that made it too complicated
5 elements
8 directions
3 functions of the body (mind body soul)
1 animals
1 plants
1 rocks
etc etc


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## Asmer20 (Apr 21, 2009)

ratsy said:


> You could say that they each are pieces of fallen gods (asteroids). In this case they could each represent a different God...ie. god of luck, goddess of love...etc


 

Great idea!!!   I should call one stone Emotions.


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## Asmer20 (Apr 21, 2009)

Thank you all for your suggestions!!!!

I do have to point out 

Susols are servants to the Earth
Angees serve the Wind and Sky
Mermees serve bodies of water
Fire is considered the offspring of fear, which will not be served by any Amoretorians
Ether i the substance of the Sword and also shapes the beings who train physical beings as Asmers.  Called Ethernals


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## Scifi fan (Apr 21, 2009)

I happen to know that, in numerology/astrology, nine represents Mars and the God of War.

Wikipaedia has a list of cultural references to nine.


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## ManTimeForgot (Apr 21, 2009)

In my own particular fantasy world creation there are 8 fundaments (elements) and 4 cosmics (ideologies).

Earth, Air, Fire, Water, Darkness, Light, Life, and Death are the 8 fundaments.  The 4 cosmics are: Chaos, Order, Good, and Evil.  But you could use the 8 with the addition of a 9th in the form of "morality" or "quintessence" something to govern the _lesser_ 8.


Just food for thought anyway.

MTF


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## Teresa Edgerton (Apr 21, 2009)

MTF, are you aware of _all_ the definitions for the word "fundament"?

Because you might want to rethink using that particular word, unless you are intentionally going for a humorous effect.


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## HareBrain (Apr 21, 2009)

ManTimeForgot said:


> Earth, Air, Fire, Water, Darkness, Light, Life, and Death are the 8 fundaments.


 
In light of Teresa's comment, I think these should be renamed the fundamentals - which are like elementals that come from the fundament after the Curry of the Gods has been consumed. Each of these fundamentals can be linked to a particular ingredient in said curry - fire with chilli, water with e-coli, etc. It's probably best that I stop there. I leave the fate of this post in the lap of the mods.


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## dustinzgirl (Apr 21, 2009)

Does it mean fun to mint? Or is it a dented form of fondue?

(ok, sorry, that was lame, but you smiled and you know it).


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## ManTimeForgot (Apr 22, 2009)

No, actually I wasn't aware of the "secondary" definition of fundament referring to a human body part.  I guess that is just a much more common usage in Britain, because I can guarantee that the "underlying ground or theory" (as in something fundamental to the creation thereof) was the intent, and I certainly haven't heard that usage anywhere in the United States (I've lived or spent several days in almost all of the lower 48, so it would have to be a pretty rare usage to have avoided my notice).


I suppose "fundamentals" is alright, but it strikes me as similar to the relationship between elements and elementals.  And besides "fundament" also denotes ground unspoiled by human hands (sacred in a way) which was an alternative way of viewing the idea that I was shooting for.


DG:  That was a trashy pun... but I did smile.

MTF


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## Teresa Edgerton (Apr 22, 2009)

ManTimeForgot said:


> I certainly haven't heard that usage anywhere in the United States (I've lived or spent several days in almost all of the lower 48, so it would have to be a pretty rare usage to have avoided my notice).



Except that I'm in the US and have been familiar with that usage all of my life.  Maybe it's more of a generational thing than a regional thing.  When I was young, and there were so many words that nice people just didn't _say_ in public, we made gleeful use of any and all acceptable euphemisms.


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