Terry Goodkind

[Denie Alconn]

Hmpf, I`m too gobsmacked to really say anything to that... Inside I`m laughing my behind off but it sure doesn`t really surprise me

 

[Brys]

I love those interviews/chats Goodkind does. They never get old. That one about irrevocably changing the face of fantasy is one of the best, but the entire response which it comes from is one of the best examples of comedy I've ever seen. Goodkind is our God site is hilarious - but compared to the man himself, it just can't compete:

http://www.terrygoodkind.com/chats/PIchat5.php

You really don't get much better than this.

Before we begin, I would like to clarify an important point that is often the source of confusion: I am a novelist; I am not, in the essential sense, a fantasy author.

The scary thing is that he's actually saying some sensible things. He's completely misapplying them, but he actually has a few good ideas there. Of course, he does decide to then make some really stupid claims and turn himself into a laughing stock. It's quite interesting to see the difference between someone using essentially this argument very well (Hal Duncan), who manages to come off as a very intelligent unegotistical writer compared to Goodkind's arrogant belief in his own supremacy.

This is probably the absolute pinnacle of Goodkind's chat:

Question: Lately I've found myself in many arguments defending your books against 'fans' who say they used to like your books but no longer do to the extent that they used to. Would you mind settling some debates by answering the Question: What, if anything do you have to say to the people that voice the opinion that you're latest four books haven't been as good as the previous four and call them "too preachy"?

Answer: Don't be fooled. The assertion made by these detractors is a note wrapped around a brick thrown through the window. These people are not fans. There are hundreds if not thousands of fantasy books that fulfill their professed taste in books. Why would they continue to read books they claim are bad? Because they hate that my novels exists. Values arouse hatred in these people

 

[the_faery_queen]

yeah. that was my favourite. that people dislike his books because they are 'good' and speak of morals and ethics or whatever.

i hate that his novels exist, but not because of his 'values' but because of the way he treats his women and i know that's a deal breaker for a lot of people.

i also heard that he once told a fan that she couldn't possibly understand him (his subtlitys or something) because she was a woman.

he really is a most pleasant person!

 

[Denie Alconn]

In Norway we call people like that *special* HAHAHAHA

 

[kaneda]

I'm not as big fan of Goodkind, couldn't get past the first book.

same here.

 

[red_temple]

Ahhhh - I though I smelled a Goodkind beatdown thread - I'm such a sucker for these. Much more entertaining than his books. I really cannot add anymore to what has already been said above, but if you are hungry for more, go here:

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?showtopic=4588

 

[the_faery_queen]

me too! its partly why i like this site so much. i've been harrassed and insulted and basically complained at for daring to say i dislike goodkind on other sites before. so its nice to find im not alone

 

[Marky Lazer]

I have to say that I haven't even touched one of his books, but Faery Queen pointed out some interviewsto me, and I can't say anything than that he's disturbing.

My Mom always told me not to judge someone on his/her appearance, but that Goodkind fellow just looks like a creep. And he confirms that picture in his remarks in interviews I've seen. *shudders*

 

[red_temple]

me too! its partly why i like this site so much. i've been harrassed and insulted and basically complained at for daring to say i dislike goodkind on other sites before. so its nice to find im not alone

Hmmm.... Which sites have you been on in the past? I've found that Goodkind beatdowns are a favorite pastime on most reading-related forums. Perhaps you found yourself on a Goodkind site inadvertantly....

 

[Thadlerian]

Interview on USA Today, some really good quotes:

On why he doesn't write about elves and dwarves:
My purpose is not weirdo cultural diversity.

On his influences:
Philosophy is what has an influence on me. Current affairs and politics are driven by the same philosophy, therefore my stories always seem to be relevant to what's happening at the moment.

On time travel:
If you could take my stories back to any time in history and read them at that time, they would also seem relevant to what was happening now.

And on it goes...

 

[the_faery_queen]

red_temple it was actually a writing site (fantasy-writers.org) and it was two members really. one who YELLED at me that my opinion he was a misognist was just my opinion (i'd not really said it wasn't) and someone else who, to wind me up, i think, said she'd read it just to see what the fuss was about (meaning i was making a fuss) many of the other members had posted quotes and references and discussions about why he was a baaaaad writer, but this first guy, well he was nasty. he was often nasty to anyone who disagreed with him and he totally attcked me for thinking goodkind is amisognist in a thread that had nothing to do with him in the first place.

and on another community as well, i was saying pretty much the same thing (its what i usually say abotu him!) and someone came along and said they hadn't read the books for years, and couldn't remember them very well, but they didn't think it was all that bad. so i said why i disagreed (and i can remember them that well) and i got yelled at and told off for it. *shrug* so yeah, been yelled at a few times. they rarely offer any evidence to counter my belief, tho. they just seem to like to get at me for having it. although one person did say that all the rapists suffer later on in the series. but to me, well that's too late and totally beside the point! the point isn't whether or not the rapists suffer, its how often teh women are raped and for what reason. to me at least

ok so rambling now, sorry! but yeah, been ranted at a couple of times for it.

 

[red_temple]

but this first guy, well he was nasty. he was often nasty to anyone who disagreed with him and he totally attcked me for thinking goodkind is amisognist in a thread that had nothing to do with him in the first place.

That's actually fairly typical of a rabid Goodkind fanatic.

and someone came along and said they hadn't read the books for years, and couldn't remember them very well, but they didn't think it was all that bad.

This is also a fairly typical response, and I, myself, was one of those types in the past. Having read the first book a looooong time ago, my memory only told me that it was typical hack fantasy, and not something to get overly worked up about. So I would actually defend the guy on forums. *shudders*

But then, one day, I was in my local bookstore and Goodkind was there, coincidentally, for a book signing. So I decided to sit and listen. Needless to say, after sitting there for an hour as he abused the audience and talked down to them in not very subtle ways, I was permenantely put off the man.

so i said why i disagreed (and i can remember them that well) and i got yelled at and told off for it.

Again, typical. However - I have nothing against *normal* Goodkind fans (there are a few out there ). It's those really overbearing, illogical, belligerent, ranting fans that makes Goodkind especially fun to abuse. But really, it's not the fans' fault. Goodkind brings it all on himself. He's a one-man anti-PR machine.

 

[the_faery_queen]

im not even sure the second person was a goodkind fan. i thik we were arguing about violence in fantasy, or something, and i was saying how unneccessary all teh rape was, and she was like its not that bad, i read it years ago etc. so im not sure how much a fan she was, having only read 4 books years ago. but definetly the first guy was and he REALLY upset me with his attack

it baffles me, sometimes, the wya people STILL like goodkind. i mean, ok they like the plot, characters, somehow, for some reason, but the man himself is SO abhorant from what i've read, and you say you overhead, why on earth would anyone keep buying his books and indluging that ego? it baffles me i guess its because im a strong believer in the personality of the writer being as important as their work. i guess i hate the idea of giving money to someone who's a misognist or a homophoboe or something like that.

sometimes i'd love to meet goodkind just so i can tell him what i think, and correct his mad idea that people dislike him because we hate what is good. but i know he is SO full of himself he'd just think im delluded. sigh. and that would make me hit him. which wouldn't help

tho would be fun!

 

[Yar]

That's actually fairly typical of a rabid Goodkind fanatic.



This is also a fairly typical response, and I, myself, was one of those types in the past. Having read the first book a looooong time ago, my memory only told me that it was typical hack fantasy, and not something to get overly worked up about. So I would actually defend the guy on forums. *shudders*

But then, one day, I was in my local bookstore and Goodkind was there, coincidentally, for a book signing. So I decided to sit and listen. Needless to say, after sitting there for an hour as he abused the audience and talked down to them in not very subtle ways, I was permenantely put off the man.



Again, typical. However - I have nothing against *normal* Goodkind fans (there are a few out there ). It's those really overbearing, illogical, belligerent, ranting fans that makes Goodkind especially fun to abuse. But really, it's not the fans' fault. Goodkind brings it all on himself. He's a one-man anti-PR machine.

Well, as I was ther at that book signing, I can whole disagree with your statement. Goodkind had the crown laughing and there was not one person with out a huge grin. Not only that, but as I walked around taking pictures ( I prolly have one of you Red), I was also listening to people talk amoungst themselves.

What yo are doing is again trying your hand at subtil and innocent looking attacks... trying to cleverly insert the word "hack", "he abused the audiance" things like that. While yes, you have an opinion, please do not subject the rest of us to your badmouthing of an author we like. It just make you look bad.

ALso having been there at the book signing, I can attest to the fact that the people felt elated and left feeling it was more that worth their time to meet the man and get ton's of book signed.

Ya know, what is truly amazing is the fact that Goodkind will sit and signe every book that a fan brings in, No other world renoun author will do that... That also say a lot about the character of the man.

Now, Red I'm not attacking you, just placing the proper spin on your post... I was there and what you are trying to portray is incorrect.

 

[Yar]

I have to say that I haven't even touched one of his books, but Faery Queen pointed out some interviewsto me, and I can't say anything than that he's disturbing.

My Mom always told me not to judge someone on his/her appearance, but that Goodkind fellow just looks like a creep. And he confirms that picture in his remarks in interviews I've seen. *shudders*

Well stated Markey.

These "anti" fans are afraid that people will read the series and find out that the whole series is about Good VS Evil and Good triumps! Good can and does win. The series is abotu having values and not betraying them when the going gets tough. It is about a man loving a woman with al of his heart and holding true to his commetment to her. The series has some wonder and influental points about how to live your life. Good old fashoned honesty and respect perimeate the series as a whole.

So someone doesn't liek that series? So what... it is a true telling of their character that they would go to such lengths as to beat down anyone who does like the series or is favorable toward it. To attempt to ridicule like school yard bullies.

QF there offers up, "it baffles me, sometimes, the wya people STILL like goodkind". That would be because these people are trying to turn people against something and are only offering up their own slanted view to prop up and validate their week opinion. 99% of the people who have met him, will attest to the fact that he is a really great person. Funny, caring, honestly interisted in what the people have to say when they meet him and he is genuine.

You red a few interviews and think "wow what an aragant man", yet you refuse to open up your eyes to the evil that exist in this world to which he is refering to in these interviews.

 

[Brys]

Interview on USA Today, some really good quotes:

On why he doesn't write about elves and dwarves:
My purpose is not weirdo cultural diversity.

On his influences:
Philosophy is what has an influence on me. Current affairs and politics are driven by the same philosophy, therefore my stories always seem to be relevant to what's happening at the moment.

On time travel:
If you could take my stories back to any time in history and read them at that time, they would also seem relevant to what was happening now.

And on it goes...

Even his fans couldn't entirely remove these quotes - they did take down the interviews from his official site, but fortunately most of them are still on the internet.

Don't forget "If you notice a similarity, then you probably aren't old enough to read my books." on similarities between his books and Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time.

Ya know, what is truly amazing is the fact that Goodkind will sit and signe every book that a fan brings in, No other world renoun author will do that... That also say a lot about the character of the man.

Well - if we just happen to ignore most bestselling authors, then sure, that statement's true. I think a lot more is said about the character of Goodkind in his multiple statements proclaiming his own perfection.

You red a few interviews and think "wow what an aragant man", yet you refuse to open up your eyes to the evil that exist in this world to which he is refering to in these interviews.

That's exactly the kind of arrogant attitude we're attacking in Goodkind's interviews. You say we refuse to open our eyes - but why should we have to like Goodkind's novels. Why is this "evil" actually evil - can't we have alternative opinions? In Goodkind's mind, the answer is clearly no - unless his interviews have actually been a brilliant satire.

Well, as I was ther at that book signing, I can whole disagree with your statement. Goodkind had the crown laughing and there was not one person with out a huge grin. Not only that, but as I walked around taking pictures ( I prolly have one of you Red), I was also listening to people talk amoungst themselves

Do you know red_temple then personally? I really don't know how to interpret this statement - how could you know that you were at the same booksigning, when red only describes it as his local bookstore. And I seriously doubt there "was not person without a huge grin" - I don't think I've been in any situation, ever, in which that was true.

While yes, you have an opinion, please do not subject the rest of us to your badmouthing of an author we like. It just make you look bad.

Wait - first you accuse him of intolerance. Then you say he has an opinion, but he shouldn't be allowed to express it. And quite frankly, it doesn't make him look bad any more than you saying you like Goodkind (though I know a lot of people who would say differently for the latter point).

 

[Brian G Turner]

I think it's fair to say that Terry Goodkind is one of those authors who tends to generate strong likes and dislikes within the fnatasy genre.

 

[the_faery_queen]

yar, i think you totally misunderstand my point of view on this. I am not saying this because i am a bully, or because i don't udnerstand his work, or can't stand other epople liking things that i hate, or anything else like that. i am saying it because i truly believe his work is disgusting and misgonistic. i take women's rights really seriously, being a woman and a feminist. i imagine people would get this passionate, and speak out against books that they felt were homophobic or racist. so why am i being a bully for speaking otu against books i feel are misognistic and offensive to women?

and yes, evil exists in the world, but not the way he shows it. that's also part of my problem with him. his 'good' girl characters are never raped, never 'soiled' by sexual violence. only the bad women characters are. the rapists themselves are potrayed as evil monsters, making them out to be so much more than they are. without getting into a huge ranty ramble, in my opinion, rapists are cowards. they're bullies and cowards. potraying them as some sort of nameless devil is a really bad thing to do, it is almost elevating them, and i dont' think they deserve it. he also showed no research, no understanding whatsoever, of the way that rape effects women. kalahan, for instance, was threatened with rape countless times. it never seems to bother her! yet her raped sister is so traumatised she gives up the throne. so that's also part of it. he fill shis books with violence against women, then seems to glorify those who commit those crimes by making them out to be MORE evil than pathetic. his good verses evil battles are completely over the top. they're nothing like the real world. rape rarely happens the way he has potrayed it. nothing about his world is realistic. it is a black and white, good verses evil, shallow definition. that's all well and good, but that doesn't mean it is honourable or noble or a good story. and to be honest, good ALWAYS wins in fantasy! the idea that that is a novel thing for goodkind is rather odd. i haven't read a fantasy yet where evil wins. i kinda wish it would, just for the novelty (and my gothic tendancies)

goodkind himself once said that people dislike his work because they don't like what is good. and to be honest, yar, your argument seems a total reflection of that. rather than say, ok yes, i can see why you might think that, and then offer a counter argument, you just decided that we had a slanted view and a weak argument. we don't. i could offer you a lot of examples from the first four books to back up my belief of his misogny. and i read these books years ago (that's how badly the taint of them has stuck with me. i can still remember them over 6 years or more) you don't have to agree with our argument, but you can't just dismiss it as being weak and invalid because you don't agree with it.

sorry, am getting preachy there. i tend to avoid these conversations because this is something i take personally. but i hve to add, as a final whatsit, that robin hobb signed the book i took to her. george r martin also signs, from what i understand, any book brought to him. and i know robert jordan does as well.

but yeah, brian is right. goodkind does seem to generate a love or hate feeling towards him. more so than any other writer. i hope that doesn't happen to me!

rant over

 

[Lunatic]

You red a few interviews and think "wow what an aragant man", yet you refuse to open up your eyes to the evil that exist in this world to which he is refering to in these interviews.

On fans who think his book is too preachy:

"Why would they continue to read books they claim are bad? Because they hate that my novels exists. Values arouse hatred in these people. Their goal is not to enjoy life, but to destroy that which is good -much like a school child who does not wish to study for a test and instead beats up a classmate who does well. These people hate what is good because it is good. Their lives are limited to loathing and indifference."

Ahhh!! Evil fans!!

Anyway, I've read the first 5 books in the SOT series, before I gave up. I liked the first two, but it just sort of went downhill for me after that.

BTW, I got that quote from the following site(it's a rebuttal to one of those chats):

http://www.inchoatus.com/Critical%20Essays/Essay--Goodkind's%20Rant.htm

you don't have to agree with our argument, but you can't just dismiss it as being weak and invalid because you don't agree with it.

Agreed.

 

[the_faery_queen]

yep
and that was the article i'd read with his, they hate what is good. and how he doesn't appear to see that others may have different reasons for disliking him.

his comments about how all other fantasy books are tolkein clones is really a nice sign of his personality, i thought. lets just dismiss all other writers as being unoriginal, despite the fact many think his is just a copy of the wheel of time!

and this ' What I have done with my work has irrevocably changed the face of fantasy. In so doing I've raised the standards. I have not only injected thought into a tired empty genre, but, more importantly, I've transcended it showing what more it can be-and is so doing spread my readership to completely new groups who don’t like and wont ready typical fantasy. Agents and editors are screaming for more books like mine. '

i LOVE that. he says he's not writing fantasy, but novel. then he says he has brought life into a tired genre. and raised the stanards?

na. george r r martin did that (in my opinion). god. sometimes i love goodkind and his self belief!