Help!

[Rowan]

URL

www.silverdreams.org. currently locks up on me. I'll check it later.

 

[CynVision]

the click on url is throwing a "." in there. backspace it out of there.


:erm: Good lord, I now have a vision of Ayrun Sun from FarScape meeting O'Neill and making some remark that John Crideon isn't the stupidest earthling after all.

 

[Rowan]

URL

Went through fine. I can see some reading ahead. I like X-files. Hope to budget the series in DVD sometime.

 

[Highlander II]

I thought Jack was AF in the movie? he was wearing blue (of course that could mean absolutely nothing) -- but just my thinking - the rest of the team may have been marines, but i was pretty sure they said he was AF --- (darn it, now i gotta go re-watch it again) --


oh - and i had heard about the comments that the PTB of the movie made about the series -- my question to them would be- 'are you guys out of your minds?' -- the series is one of the most popular sci-fi programs on tv -- if they're not proud that the movie they made (which i still don't particularly like very much) inspired such an excellent program - well, then they're just a little full of themselves now aren't they? i don't begrudge them their opinions, just don't understand how closed minded they are -

Kurt Russell (from my understanding) likes they show - or at least he pretended to, he visited the set and talked w/ ppl there - (saw article in a UK magazine) --

just my comments ----

oh -- and as far as your fic goes CynVision -- you could always make it an AU fic that says Jack was a pilot -- in AU - just about anything goes ---

later!!!
H2

 

[Rowan]

You got me....

You're right Highlander... O'Neil is in the AF in the movie. the orignal draft had him in the Marines and they changed it. I seem to be on a computer marathon tonight/today and my brain is beginning to waste away. [It's now 1025 PDT on 10 July and I got up at 0700 9 July]. I should never try to teach myself HTML. I forgot how I used to get when I was taking a 2 year in programming... a serious marathon writer who would end up crashing the main frame by discovering all by herself the concept of a self modifying code loop with no exit.

<sigh>

And now we're coding ... :flash:

 

[CynVision]

Originally posted by Highlander II
my question to them would be- 'are you guys out of your minds?' -- the series is one of the most popular sci-fi programs on tv

oh -- and as far as your fic goes CynVision -- you could always make it an AU fic that says Jack was a pilot -- in AU - just about anything goes ---

I think they fought hard for the choices they made in the movie. From what I heard in the commentary, the studio was urging them to pick up the pace so much that the scene with O'Neill and Skarra would have been left out of the theatrical version. They fought for that one hard so that it was clear how Skarra had the lighter in the rescue. The movie is rather good at making you feel for the characters. At least some of the time they wanted to paint them an extra dimension and make the audience care.

I think the movie VS. TV guys have the sort of relationship the kids in Jurassic Park had.

"If I do, what will you give me?"
"Respect."

AU isn't something I've tried. I'm a bit scared of it. Not to knock it or anyone happy using a AU but what's running through my head is "those who can do, those who can't cheat." I'ts a cheat I can't bring myself to fall back on. I'm very real with my approach to fic. I'm a writer wanna be and that's my hopeless delusion. As I keep reading stuff on sites I'm seeing I'm going to have to change some stuff. If there isn't a place anywhere saying he's a pilot I'm sol on that angle and it'll be a challange to get it to fit in. Or, leave it alone and as confusing as the show.

 

[CynVision]

Re: You got me....

Originally posted by Rowan
a serious marathon writer who would end up crashing the main frame by discovering all by herself the concept of a self modifying code loop with no exit.

December of last year I had a vacation and I spent it writing the XF fic "Intersection." I was up so long the white part of the Word screen started turning into dancing pastel-colored stained glass. It pulsed with the beat of the music I was listening to. I sort of stared at it doing that thinking to myself "that is really scary." I was a veteran of a few overnight lighting strikes and never experienced anything like it. That sort of thing would have been deadly hanging off a cherry-picker.

That incident last fall made me become a firm believer in halicunations. I could totally believe the "Urgo" ep.

 

[Rowan]

Writing...

Do either of us have a life? Seems like we've spent the last few hours here.:disturbed

29 hours and counting. Sleep is gonna come hit me soon... I hope.

 

[Highlander II]

Originally posted by CynVision


I think they fought hard for the choices they made in the movie. From what I heard in the commentary, the studio was urging them to pick up the pace so much that the scene with O'Neill and Skarra would have been left out of the theatrical version. They fought for that one hard so that it was clear how Skarra had the lighter in the rescue. The movie is rather good at making you feel for the characters. At least some of the time they wanted to paint them an extra dimension and make the audience care.

I think the movie VS. TV guys have the sort of relationship the kids in Jurassic Park had.

"If I do, what will you give me?"
"Respect."

AU isn't something I've tried. I'm a bit scared of it. Not to knock it or anyone happy using a AU but what's running through my head is "those who can do, those who can't cheat." I'ts a cheat I can't bring myself to fall back on. I'm very real with my approach to fic. I'm a writer wanna be and that's my hopeless delusion. As I keep reading stuff on sites I'm seeing I'm going to have to change some stuff. If there isn't a place anywhere saying he's a pilot I'm sol on that angle and it'll be a challange to get it to fit in. Or, leave it alone and as confusing as the show.

in the movie - i didn't think there was enough character development - when i first watched it - i hated it - completely - and i almost didn't watch the TV series when i heard it was coming out b/c i hated the movie so much - i was very disappointed that RDA was going to be in the series b/c i didn't like Kurt Russell's character -- he bugged me - but, being the hard-nosed RDA fan that i am, i gave the TV show a shot - and am very glad i did - i love the show - wouldn't miss it!! but, i still don't like the movie -- i don't hate it like i used to, but i don't like it either - i suppose i more respect it than anything else - i know movie making isn't easy- and for that the PTB deserve respect, but the movie just didn't 'thrill' me - i love the concept - but the movie just seemed to be a 'lead in' to something bigger - (which, ironically it was - the SG-1 series) -- but, i still don't understand why the PTB of the movie do not want anything at all to do w/ the series -- i believe the series may have inspired some ppl to go out and watch the movie - some who wouldn't have initially watched the movie - know what i mean??

personally - i haven't tried an AU story either -- i'm one of those 'by the book' 'stick to the canon' writers myself -- but, if i were to do an AU story it would be more along the lines of 'what would 'character' be like if he/she had made this decision instead --
and on that note -- there is always the "Alternate Reality" angle which does follow series canon - touch the mirror and away you go - (i will warn you that this has been done to death almost to the point of being nauseating, so i would suggest finding an angle that hasn't been used if you choose this) -- i was thinking you could write your story as it takes place in an alternate reality - on its own - not where someone touches the mirror and 'sees' the alternate reality -- ie: you could write two stories - one that takes place in 'this' reality - and a parallel that involves the same subject in the 'alternate' reality -- this, i would consider a writer challenge, and not a cheat -- b/c writing the same story from 2 very different POV's and 'angles' (sorry, can't think of a better word) - would be one heck of a challenge --

these are just suggestions - to take or leave as you choose -

so - have fun w/ your fic -- and happy writing!!!!!!!!


H2

 

[Highlander II]

Re: Writing...

Originally posted by Rowan
Do either of us have a life? Seems like we've spent the last few hours here.:disturbed

29 hours and counting. Sleep is gonna come hit me soon... I hope.

life ??? what's that??

i've heard of those -- anyone know where i can get one???

H2

 

[CynVision]

Originally posted by Highlander II
i love the concept - but the movie just seemed to be a 'lead in' to something bigger - (which, ironically it was - the SG-1 series) -- but, i still don't understand why the PTB of the movie do not want anything at all to do w/ the series -- i believe the series may have inspired some ppl to go out and watch the movie - some who wouldn't have initially watched the movie - know what i mean??

I'm sure that it keeps the movie sales at a steady rate.

I've heard this about the 'movie being a launch' before. They could be bitter more of the screaming fans of SG-1 didn't hit the box office. And, I still think it's because movie people look down on the TV folks. They can see TV as limiting. Tiny sets, cheating and tricking viewers instead of going on a real location shoot. Different unions. The legal 'red tape' of getting actors and staff from stage to TV to a movie, and vice versa, can be sticky sometimes. I think SG-1 side stepped the issue by locating in Canada. It's no accident there's a pack of Vancouver natives on the cast.

I'm not sure just when the commentary was recorded. If in first season of SG-1 the movie storywriters, who were the director and producer, may have had some mixed feelings giving up the idea? Quite quickly they had two paper backs out based on the movie. And, if you look at the first season of any show the writing waffles as the style and tone of the show are found. they could have been upset with the direction things went. They sure didn't like them killing Kolwalsky off. They mentioned towards the end of the DVD that a sequel would have had Kolwalsky in a bigger role. But again they could have liked the actor enough to have favored him that way.

It's a bit amusing that at one part in the commentary the producer laughs a little and notes that they still use the gate dialing graphics used in the movie on the TV show.

Originally posted by Highlander II

'what would 'character' be like if he/she had made this decision instead -- alternate reality - on its own - not where someone touches the mirror and 'sees' - and a parallel that involves the same subject in the 'alternate' reality -- this, i would consider a writer challenge, and not a cheat -- b/c writing the same story from 2 very different POV's and 'angles' (sorry, can't think of a better word) - would be one heck of a challenge --

Yes. Quite a challange. Got to keep it fresh while for the second retelling... One thing that I found with the casual fic reader is if you do a POV they're like "Why is it 1st person?" That was a reaction I had to the first SG-1 fic story. I gave the link out to a chat room guy and he's all confused. That first fic is told from O'Neill's point of view. I'm thinking 1st person is not 'in style' writing form right now. Or, I messed it up somehow.

 

[Highlander II]

Originally posted by CynVision
I'm sure that it keeps the movie sales at a steady rate.

I've heard this about the 'movie being a launch' before. They could be bitter more of the screaming fans of SG-1 didn't hit the box office. And, I still think it's because movie people look down on the TV folks. They can see TV as limiting. Tiny sets, cheating and tricking viewers instead of going on a real location shoot. Different unions. The legal 'red tape' of getting actors and staff from stage to TV to a movie, and vice versa, can be sticky sometimes. I think SG-1 side stepped the issue by locating in Canada. It's no accident there's a pack of Vancouver natives on the cast.

I'm not sure just when the commentary was recorded. If in first season of SG-1 the movie storywriters, who were the director and producer, may have had some mixed feelings giving up the idea? Quite quickly they had two paper backs out based on the movie. And, if you look at the first season of any show the writing waffles as the style and tone of the show are found. they could have been upset with the direction things went. They sure didn't like them killing Kolwalsky off. They mentioned towards the end of the DVD that a sequel would have had Kolwalsky in a bigger role. But again they could have liked the actor enough to have favored him that way.

It's a bit amusing that at one part in the commentary the producer laughs a little and notes that they still use the gate dialing graphics used in the movie on the TV show.

well -- Kawalski was played by a totally different guy in the movie - i kinda like Jay Acavone better (think i spelled his name wrong tho) -- and i'm not sure exactly why they killed Kawalski - they could have kept him around - they'd given him a command - unless Jay didn't want the full time commitment surrounding a serial tv show like that -- there are probably a lot of things we'll never know ---

Yes. Quite a challange. Got to keep it fresh while for the second retelling... One thing that I found with the casual fic reader is if you do a POV they're like "Why is it 1st person?" That was a reaction I had to the first SG-1 fic story. I gave the link out to a chat room guy and he's all confused. That first fic is told from O'Neill's point of view. I'm thinking 1st person is not 'in style' writing form right now. Or, I messed it up somehow.

well- POV doesn't necessarily mean 1st person - you can do a Jack POV in 3rd person - it's kinda tough - b/c you have to remember that you're not writing in an omniscient style, but it can be done --

1st person is hard - it takes practice and a little skill to pull it off - and many characters are strong enough to support a 1st person POV (jack isn't one of those not strong enough characters, but there are some) --

i just finished a fic that was 3rd person POV of one character - basically - you just have to leave out any thoughts/ reasoning for the other characters' actions - ie: if it's 3rd person POV Jack - you can tell the reader what Jack is thinking, but unless Jack got some really cool ESP, he won't know what Sam is thinking when she says "Excuse me, sir, but you really are a dork." (don't know why she would say that, but you get the idea) -- so - after that statement - Jack would be confused, as would the reader, and rightly so - but the reader is supposed to be confused - b/c Jack is -- so, you could then go inside Jack's head and have him asking himself what the heck Carter meant by that - and have him puzzle over it for a paragraph or so -- but still in 3rd person -- it's a bit complicated, but is possible --

(i think i'm getting really good at rambling)

hope i'm helping ---

good luck w/ your story!!

H2

 

[Rowan]

Life

I'm not the one to ask. I seem to be superglued to this keyboard.

As for AU vrs canon. Actually everytime we 'create' a story, we're right on the edge of AU. When I wrote a piece about Jack and his feeling about the holidays I went AU because I gave him a past ['Holidays' Gateways #2]. When I wrote about Daniel after his finially finding the harcesis child in 'Maternal Instincts' ['Son Light' on the lists] I had to get inside his head and make a guess at how he'd feel. Or Kasuf after Daniel left Abydos and went back to Earth ['Good Son' Potporri #2].

When we build stories, we make alternitives. Now, most of us, me at least, try to keep them as close to canon as possible but since canon is constantly unfolding [the fun of writing for an on-going seris vrs one that has ended] you never know what's next.

The fun of being a writer.

 

[Highlander II]

Re: Life

Originally posted by Rowan
I'm not the one to ask. I seem to be superglued to this keyboard.

As for AU vrs canon. Actually everytime we 'create' a story, we're right on the edge of AU. When I wrote a piece about Jack and his feeling about the holidays I went AU because I gave him a past ['Holidays' Gateways #2]. When I wrote about Daniel after his finially finding the harcesis child in 'Maternal Instincts' ['Son Light' on the lists] I had to get inside his head and make a guess at how he'd feel. Or Kasuf after Daniel left Abydos and went back to Earth ['Good Son' Potporri #2].

When we build stories, we make alternitives. Now, most of us, me at least, try to keep them as close to canon as possible but since canon is constantly unfolding [the fun of writing for an on-going seris vrs one that has ended] you never know what's next.

The fun of being a writer.

you are right there, Rowan - if the series is still going on - we are sort of creating AU each time we write -- but, the fun there is seeing what the PTB do w/ 'their' version of events - no matter what we (fic writers) have come up with -

my thing is - i write so darned slow - the canon's already changed b4 i finish my story - i was working on a highlander fic - and they killed Richie b4 i finished my story - so i changed my story - of course, i've since gone back and started writing it again b/c i didn't like the way it went - so - it's takin' even longer ---

oh - i don't have a life either - i've been at this keyboard all day (i'm at work, use AsciFi as temp diversion from the monotony of my job) --
<sigh> back to work --

H2

 

[CynVision]

Originally posted by Highlander II
well- POV doesn't necessarily mean 1st person - you can do a Jack POV in 3rd person - it's kinda tough - b/c you have to remember that you're not writing in an omniscient style, but it can be done --

1st person is hard - it takes practice and a little skill to pull it off - and many characters are strong enough to support a 1st person POV (jack isn't one of those not strong enough characters, but there are some) --

I went over all the different levels of POV a few months ago and have forgotten them. I get a bit nervous using words like "omniscient." I just know a few different styles and yep, it's a right pain to have to keep in mind who's viewing, feeling and if I'm giving anything away with a narrative. I think that's my approach. I think I'm so departed from any proper English structure. I've forgotten it all. Yep, I'm an editor's nightmare.

Jack isn't a good canidate for 1st person?

 

[CynVision]

Re: Re: Life

Originally posted by Highlander II


you are right there, Rowan - if the series is still going on - we are sort of creating AU each time we write -- but, the fun there is seeing what the PTB do w/ 'their' version of events - no matter what we (fic writers) have come up with -

I do hear you about the AU aspect of having fics where a character returns or an event is referred to in a following fic. I've aways try to make the fic return a sort of staus quo by the end. All my SG-1 stuff is an ep that could fit in allllmost anywhere in the arch of a season.

 

[Rowan]

PoV writing

Depending on the type of story and the character I find 1st person actually easier to write.

I love writing Jack. I've served under CO's like him, worked alongside firemen, policemen and emergency med folk like him. The personality is clear and sharp with deep undercurrents. Sam, I can't write her to save my soul. Don't know why. You'd think being a military female, it would be easy, but it isn't. I think I've done one Sam piece in all my time writing.

It's always a challenege to put words in her mouth and have them sound right.

 

[Highlander II]

Originally posted by CynVision


I went over all the different levels of POV a few months ago and have forgotten them. I get a bit nervous using words like "omniscient." I just know a few different styles and yep, it's a right pain to have to keep in mind who's viewing, feeling and if I'm giving anything away with a narrative. I think that's my approach. I think I'm so departed from any proper English structure. I've forgotten it all. Yep, I'm an editor's nightmare.

Jack isn't a good canidate for 1st person?

no no -- Jack is wonderful for 1st person -- i said (and it's almost a dbl negative - Jack isn't one not strong enough for 1st person) - no - Jack's wonderful for just about anything ---

i actually wrote a fic in 2nd person from Jack's POV - talk about HARD!! writing from inside Jack's head - that's not only difficult, but dangerous -- that man!! <eg>

1st person, 2nd person, 3rd person -- then in each of those, you choose a character and tell the story - 1st and 2nd person are limited to one character throughout the entire story, 3rd person - you can switch btwn characters - but preferably not in the middle of a scene - that gets confusing -- or you can tell the whole thing from a 'outsider' POV - which is the 'omniscient' POV -- the author has all the details and knows everything that is happening in the fic - kinda like a tv show - the viewer knows things that the characters don't -- or, you can tell it in 3rd person from one character's POV -- the trick is to be consistent -- if you start in one - stay there - don't move around ---

there are lots of websites that offer help if you just need general fic writing info -- one of my faves was done for The Sentinel fic - and if i can find the URL i'll put it in here ---

found it ---

http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Academy/5307/guide.htm

it's a great site -- points out all those little things you probaby didn't even realize you'd forgotten ---


have fun!!

 

[Highlander II]

Re: PoV writing

Originally posted by Rowan
Depending on the type of story and the character I find 1st person actually easier to write.

I love writing Jack. I've served under CO's like him, worked alongside firemen, policemen and emergency med folk like him. The personality is clear and sharp with deep undercurrents. Sam, I can't write her to save my soul. Don't know why. You'd think being a military female, it would be easy, but it isn't. I think I've done one Sam piece in all my time writing.

It's always a challenege to put words in her mouth and have them sound right.

know the feeling - i can't write Teal'c to save my soul -- what is it about him? it's not his speech patterns, but something about how best to use him -- my problem is i'm a 'conversation' writer - most of my action takes place in conversations - not in descriptions (which is odd, b/c i used to write description almost to rival charles dickens) --

Sam is tough - i find her hard to write too -- Jack - Jack's a cake walk!! and Daniel -- i can get him -- Hammond - he's the boss - and a lesser (not in a bad way - just not used as much) character --

but, then again, i've only done a couple SG-1 fics -- i have so many fandoms, i have too many ideas and not enough time -- you wouldn't believe the number of WIPs i have lying around just waiting to be finished --- ugh ---

 

[CynVision]

Yep, I missed the double negative. I enjoyed using Jack. Chance to try out all sorts of cleaches <sp> and humor a the human condition. Better than a poke in the eye, six ways to Sunday, slicker than snot etc.

Thanks for a link. Always good to learn what I'm talking about.

I don't think I ever take 3rd omniscient. I enjoy having a mystery. Or something.

I began working the 'don't change pov unless scene break' in some other free writings I have worked on since childhood. As you can imagine it's messy cleaning up a scene I wrote ten years ago and having to get out of the wrong head. :grin: Taught me a lot.

I still didn't know that there was one where you could switch so often as that and still keep people with you.