Dragon Foes

[Young stormlord]

Remember Black Harren of Harenhall? Small reminder : king that had an army, biggest castle ever built, enough spears and arrows to defend the bigest castle ever built. His end:he and his sons died from molten stone and dragon fire.
For another history reminder check one of the first Tyrion chapters, when he thinks about The Field Of Fire.Summary: 3 kings, 200k soldiers vs Aegon the Conqeror, his 2 sisters, 10k soldiers of the last king Aegon killed, and of course 3 dragons. You all know the result.

So my theory is this : the only way to kill the dragon is either by magic (horn or warg) or by poison (which maessters did once but that were two last small dragons).

 

[Aegon the Unworthy]

Thats because (and this is my opinion nothing else) those commanders you mentioned failed to adapt to the change in "technology". I think we'll see a different score come this time around.

The Harrenhal example is a perfect microcosm of what I speak of. He buttoned up in his castle content to let the walls protect him...at no point do I suggest allowing the dragon to come breath fire on you. That seems lacking in creative foresight.

And in the end Young Stormlord you could well be right....but speculation is a must at this time and place with no new novel to quench my thirst for dragonfire.

 

[Weasel Soup]

Jon v. The Dragons

interesting....

In one sense that would somewhat explain the title of the series, but it would blow the theorey that he may become one of the three heads of the dragon.

But, other than Howland Reed, a friend pointed out to me that Barristan may also know Jon's parentage (in the R + L = J belief) so it is quite possible that Dany may know of their relation prior to coming to Westeros.

But as for killing dragon's, eesh, I need more time to think on it.

 

[Fourth Hunter]

Adapting to technology, absolutely right. The result of the first battle with dragons is the Westerosi equivalent of the American Civil War and World War I. Mass casualties, little gained by either side. New weaponry that no one knew how to use. Then in World War II we see the introduction of stormtroopers, small groups of elite troops targeting a specific area or mission, slowly compounding on other groups' success. My point? Maybe there will be professional dragon hunters. Get them when they sleep.

 

[Commonmind]

Where's Fizban and the heroes of the Lance when you need them.

 

[southron sword]

is there anywhere in the books that said how the old dragons died? or if they were killed? that mite b an answer. unless none of the dragons were defeated during battle, otherwise i wouldnt know. the dragon hunters idea sounds allright.

 

[Young stormlord]

is there anywhere in the books that said how the old dragons died? or if they were killed? that mite b an answer. unless none of the dragons were defeated during battle, otherwise i wouldnt know. the dragon hunters idea sounds allright.

Mormont of Selmi (not sure.feel free to correct me)say something like this "the dragons that kingdom knew best was those from Targaryens. They were breed for wars and in wars they were dying" and " it is hard to kill dragon but not imposible". And messtar Marvin says to Sam : "Who do you think killed all dragons? Brave dragon slayers with swords? In the world that Citadel creates there is no place for dragons, glass candles and magic."

So I guess this answers your question.

 

[Culhwch]

I dont know if the spears idea mentioned earlier would be as good as you may think, they would rely on the dragons mass to punch through its hide and if it never moved towards the spearmen then your offense is lacking.

Er, pop culture reference, attempt at humour...

 

[TomServo]

Don't worry, I caught your pop culture reference, I continued it a bit and am still waiting for someone to finish it.

 

[Aegon the Unworthy]

Ahh....If I had a dime for every time I didnt understand a "pop culture" reference.....well actually I do so nevermind. Bwahahahahaha

 

[Boaz]

Aegon, aaaaaah! The mutual admiration society! It usually takes me a six pack to get there.

The problem with that particular reference is that it worked incredibly well between father and son, but probably not as well between friends/acquaintances. And perhaps it's not a joke between us, but just a reference to the joke in the movie. I dunno. I am one of those who love to joke, but "Momma" jokes are strictly off limits imo. Mothers deserve all respect from their children. That's just one of my rationalizations that makes my Boaz World go round. ...and you can feel free to call me a prude, I won't mind.

Stepping off my soapbox...

Fourth Hunter, who do you think these Dragon-Hunters-to-be are? Jon? Tyrion? Jaime? Euron? Brienne? Thoros? Anguy? Gendry? Edric Storm? Asha? Arya? Bran?

I know this question is going to be beyond Aegon's expertise, but do you think Bran (or another Stark) will be able to see through/control a Dragon?

Young stormlord, good references. Now I must play Devil's Advocate. Why are none of the legendary warriors of Westeros called Dragonslayers? Would that be because they were rebels against the Targaryens and thus erased from history? I don't care how many bandits Ser Gerold "The White Bull" Hightower and Ser Arthur "Sword of the Morning" Dayne slew, if someone killed a Dragon in the last three hundred years since Aegon I landed at King's Landing then I think we might have heard of that person. Many bards, now that the Targaryens no longer rule, would have sung of these unknown Dragonslayers. I think it'd be a favorite right up there with "The Rains of Castamere" and that Bear Song.

My pardons for continually capitalizing Dragon, but I feel it's almost a proper noun. Might be my anti e.e. cummings feelings.

 

[Culhwch]

I would say that the fact that there are no songs about dragonslayers would seem to indicate that there were no dragonslayers. At least, no singular dragonslayers. I'm sure that to bring down a dragon it would have taken more than one knight with a sword - this isn't that kind of book, after all. Instead I imagine that it took a great many men at a very great cost.

Which leads to the question, why aren't there any songs about battles where dragons were brought down? Perhaps simple oversight on the part of the author? With Martin, I doubt it.

And I wasn't finishing that quote as this is a family-friendly site...

 

[leoj826]

as far as dragon slaying goes in FFC pg282 Brienne tells Nimble Dick of Ser Galladon of Morne, the Perfect Knight had a magic sword that he used to kill a dragon. With Bran i think he will be an allie of Dany, and have to warg into a dragon in order to become the winged wolf.

 

[Weasel Soup]

Bran and Dany
Ice and Fire

Old Gods and Everything else

I am not sure but I see them more as parallel story lines.
And to be honest, I think Bran is the biggest threat to the dragons.

But just me, my weapon is soup.

 

[Young stormlord]

as far as dragon slaying goes in FFC pg282 Brienne tells Nimble Dick of Ser Galladon of Morne, the Perfect Knight had a magic sword that he used to kill a dragon.

Agreed. After that Nimble Dick tells her the story of old Clarense Crab that beaten a dragon barehanded (he made dragons neck in knot if I remember correctly).

 

[Aegon the Unworthy]

All good points....

I agree with Weasel---somewhat. Bran and Euron are the dragons biggest threats. As it stands right now theres no one out there with the foresight, physical presence and wherewithal to be a "Dragonslayer" (coughAryacough). If youre gonna do it, youre gonna want to bring a lot to the party.

Obviously no one in recent memory has slain a dragon. You would probably have to go back more than three generations for something like that to lose itself. But you cant tell me its never been done, I refuse to believe it. It would crush my little world Ive imagined for myself. Ive even been thinking of printing buisness cards as being the number 1 Dragon Slayer Theorist on the web.

I think its obvious theyre creatures of blood, sinew and magic. So slaying them will probably be more difficult than slaying a large, incredibly quick, fire-breathing, flying monster may seem. And thats saying a lot.

You know someone somewhere did it though. Or at least made a good go of it.

 

[Boaz]

Guys, thanks for the information and the spectulation.

I agree that someone or some group has killed a Dragon in battle. But shouldn't we know more details about this act? The Easterers are measuring the value of Dragons in terms of kingdoms and armies.

Now YS, quoted Marwin as saying something to the effect that "Dragons have no place in the Maester controlled New World Order." Does this mean that the Maester's have means of killing Dragons?

I do think the way to go is a lone hero or special squad to attempt to take the Dragon by surprise. I think this is probably the best option and I'd put the odds at less than five percent chance of success.

 

[southron sword]

u know how dragon glass kills the others. well is there any chance that valyrian stell could do the same to dragons? arent those blades supposed to be magically forged? well what if the magic helps bring down dragons? and thats y all the houses with valyrian blades prise them so much. and also cos they r really sharp n all that. but i spose if that were the case then it would be said sumwhere. unless all that knowledge is lost?

 

[Young stormlord]

Tyrion once said that everything that was left from two last Targ dragons were two deformed sculls mastiff size. And Marvin (that maessters call mastiff (not so important connection people ) said what he said. My guess is that maessters poisoned dragons minute they hatched. And about valyrian steel, well Danny says that it was forged in dragon's fire, and Sam found that it was called dragon steel. Valyrians had many dragons so it figures . My guess is, it is posible to kill dragon with steel that cannot be melted with dragonfire.

 

[Boaz]

In that case, a suit of Valyrian Steel Plate Armor might come in more than handy.