The Revived Tolkien Trivia

[The Judge]

The Red Book of Westmarch?

'The original Red Book has not been preserved, but many copies were made... The most important copy... was written in Gondor, probably at the request of the great-grandson of Peregrin... Its southern scribe appended this note: Findegil, King's Writer, finished this work in IV 172. It is an exact copy in all details of the Thain's Book in Minas Tirith. That book was a copy, made at the request of King Elessar, of the Red Book of the Periannath, and was brought to him by the Thain Peregrin when he retired to Gondor in IV 64.'

The LotR, The Fellowship of the Ring; Prologue 'Notes on the Shire Records'

 

[Marky Lazer]

The pipes were my idea as well...

 

[Grimward]

Right you, your honor; that's the one I was looking for...

*Hands the Judge a copy of the Thain's Bell, tastefully damasked in red, and not yet tarnished by the Hornblower smoke wafting from the founder's corner....*

And the floor is yours, too.....

 

[The Judge]

Thank you for the bell, Master Grimward, and for the absence of Old Hornblower... and for the very clever question.

So, my puzzle:


It sounds like a bird has met his match in a rock, but with what eventual result? *

J

* The answer is not squashed bird.

 

[The Judge]

I'm not sure if it's the good weather which has kept everyone away or just the terrible attempt at cryptic-ness (?crypticity) of my question.

Anyway, the weather here has turned so I thought it might be time for a clue, which is...

The rock could just as easily have been ice (but single).

J

 

[HareBrain]

Don't know about anyone else, but the clue seems at least as cryptic as the question, and that reads like a crossword clue from the Daily Telegraph!

Anyway, "It sounds like" implies to me that we're looking for perhaps a name that could be interpreted as meaning "bird met its match in a rock". And the clue implies that the word for "rock" could also mean "ice", is that right? But I can't think of any words that fulfil both. (And I've no idea what to make of "but single".)

Are any of these thoughts in the right direction, or is it actually more straightforward than I think?

 

[The Judge]

Anyway, "It sounds like" implies to me that we're looking for perhaps a name that could be interpreted as meaning "bird met its match in a rock". And the clue implies that the word for "rock" could also mean "ice", is that right? But I can't think of any words that fulfil both. (And I've no idea what to make of "but single".)

Are any of these thoughts in the right direction, or is it actually more straightforward than I think?

Kind of in the right direction...

'It sounds like' does exactly what it says on the tin - but you're reading too far along the sentence for the homophone. If I change the punctuation and a pronoun:

He sounds like a bird. Has met his MATCH* in a rock (or ice**).

J

* This is a clue.

** 'Ice' can be a synonym for 'X' in the same way that 'rock' is, but usually when 'X' is in the plural, and you only want one.

 

[HareBrain]

Lordy, that was a merry chase. I was convinced for a while that it had to be something to do with the death of Smaug, which involved a bird, and a hole in a diamond waistcoat (or American vest, as in Vesta, as in Swan Vesta *embarrassed cough*)

But the "eventual result" was Faramir I, born 1430 from the match of Peregrin I to Diamond of Long Cleeve (from LOTR, Appendix C, Family trees: Took of Great Smials)

 

[Grimward]

I probably shouldn't have looked at this after a long work day....it's hurting my brain! Good job, sir Hare!

 

[The Judge]

Excellently solved Sir Rabbit and I hand to you a giant carrot shaped bell which I hope you will find appealing...

To you also is the duty to intrigue us with the next question.

J

 

[HareBrain]

Thanks Judge, but I don't peel my carrots ...

Anyway, the question: four legs, then none, then two - who?

 

[Grimward]

Lúthien, en route to Beren's aid, then Angband?

4 Legs (in use):

For Huan, consenting once more to be her steed, had borne her swiftly hard upon Beren's trail.

The Simarillion, Quenta Silmarillion, Ch. XIX, Of Beren and Lúthien

No Legs (in use or described, anyway!):

By the counsel of Huan and the arts of Lúthien he was arrayed now in the hame of Draugluin, and she in the winged fell of Thuringwethil. Beren became in all things like a werewolf to look upon, save that in his eyes there shone a spirit grim indeed but clean; and horror that was in his galnce as he was upon his flank a bat-like creature clinging with creased wings.

The Simarillion, Quenta Silmarillion, Ch. XIX, Of Beren and Lúthien

Two legs:

But suddenly some power, descended from of old from divine race, possessed Lúthien, and casting back her foul rainment she stood forth, small before the might of Carcharoth, but radiant and terrible.

The Simarillion, Quenta Silmarillion, Ch. XIX, Of Beren and Lúthien

(Page numbers eaten by Marky's dog)

 

[HareBrain]

Sorry Grim, that's not it. (I would count the bat as having legs in any case.)

But in a way, you're very close ...

 

[Stylus]

Then Sauron shifted shape, from wolf to serpent, and from monster to his own accustomed form; but he could not elude the grip of Huan without foresaking his body utterly.

The Simarillion, Quenta Silmarillion, Chapter 19, Of Beren and Lúthien

 

[Grimward]

Ah, curse the need to work that keeps me from seeing these updates sooner (paying for the internet would be hard without the job, of course). And the creature is bat-like, not a bat, but academic now. Shouldn't have assumed the legs actually got used!

Good job, Stylus...assuming the "monster" in question had no legs....

 

[Pyan]

Good answer, Stylus - and I've always thought that the "monster" was the serpent, not another intermediate form...

 

[Stylus]

In fairness to Grimward, I hadn't really considered Beren and Lúthien's story until you gave your answer. So assuming I'm correct, kudos to you for doing the (ahem) leg-work on this one.

 

[Grimward]

*Grins*

Leg work....

No, no, I tend to be a little too literal, and unlike Py I read the Sauron section without seeing "through" the monster, so I'd have gotten no closer until tonight when I got back to the books, if at all. Thanks for the kudos, but (assuming HB agrees) that one's all yours, chief!

 

[HareBrain]

Well done Stylus, he it was.

A bell with a volume control for you (because it's mute-able - mutable - changes shape? No? Oh never mind ...) and have at us with the next question.

(Edit: I assumed "from monster" meant either "from serpent" or "from the various non-human shapes he'd tried")

 

[Stylus]

Thank'ee, and my question:

This inseparable pair sought safety in the boughs of which festive tree?