Jaqen H'ghar

Lord_of_the_morning

Valar Morghulis
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Sep 30, 2007
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I've always wondered (and don't get me wrong when I post this thread don't think i am ragging on Jaqen cause i am not)

Wasn't Jaqen supposed to be a high ranking faceless man..But in the story he get's caught ...wut did he get caught for and who caught him...cause i am pretty sure faceless men are supposed to be some stealthy guys,always canging there appereances.....but anyway can someone help me out on this one ??
 
Perhaps he needed to get caught in order to get close to his target.
Also we don't really know if he's high-ranking.
 
Feast For Crows Spoiler!!







Heh did you guys know that Jaqen turns into "The Alchemist" the dude from the opening chapter of Feast for Crows and after that possible takes on Pate's apperance
 

Well, I guessed most people already knew, I just realized it when re-reading FFC today.:p
Odd that he'd take Pate's apperance though. I mean, he got a Grandmaster's key to open any-door he wants. Wonder why needs to pose as a useless acolyte.
 
Why indeed? Why indeed.....



Thats harsh TK. I usually limit linking to just one or two threads......hee
 
Shack, that is your real welcome into the club. Smack! Smack! Smack! Smack! Don't worry about it because it's no big deal noticing something and posting regarding it and then finding out that the topic's been done before.

If it'll make you feel better, I'll tell you that I once posted a completely new observation and hypothesis... then TK immediately posted and said that it was an old topic and linked the thread... then Aegon posted and said that I had actually posted on said thread... he had the nerve to link where I had actually had the opposite hypothesis on that topic in the previous thread... most embarassing.

If you cannot make a fool of yourself here, you can't do it anywhere.

Anyway, who caught Jaqen? How was he caught? What was his crime? We don't know. Mayhaps it was in his mission to get caught. Was he supposed to kill a gaoler? Was he supposed to kill a fellow prisoner?

But we do know that Jaqen was going to be sent to the Wall with Yoren. In Yoren's group, there were only three people who might have ranked high enough to merit a hired knife.

Arya joined at the last minute. There's no way Jaqen knew she'd be going... plus she's still alive. So she's out.

Gendry was needed dead by Cersei, but she'd have not spent much money killing a *******. And there's the fact that Jaqen did not kill Gendry. Gendry's out.

This leaves Eddard. Eddard was supposed to go with Yoren to take the Black. Eddard was the highest ranking political prisoner in the kingdom. If he'd died in jail, it would have looked like the Lannister's murdered him. They were sending him to the Wall, but they did not want him living long and passing on secrets... so Eddard had to die soon after he confessed. We know that both of the murders that Jaqen commited for Arya seemed either natural or strange, but that neither looked like murder. I think Eddard was supposed to have an accident on his journey north. Most likely after crossing Moat Cailin... if Eddard died in the North, then the Lannisters would not seem to have been involved.
 
This leaves Eddard. Eddard was supposed to go with Yoren to take the Black. Eddard was the highest ranking political prisoner in the kingdom. If he'd died in jail, it would have looked like the Lannister's murdered him. They were sending him to the Wall, but they did not want him living long and passing on secrets... so Eddard had to die soon after he confessed. We know that both of the murders that Jaqen commited for Arya seemed either natural or strange, but that neither looked like murder. I think Eddard was supposed to have an accident on his journey north. Most likely after crossing Moat Cailin... if Eddard died in the North, then the Lannisters would not seem to have been involved.

Wow i never thought of that, completely forgot that the plan always was for Eddard to go to the wall and it was Joffrey that ruined it for all :)

So even if it sounds so very scary, Boaz i think your theory is sound and logic.
 
Shack, that is your real welcome into the club. Smack! Smack! Smack! Smack! Don't worry about it because it's no big deal noticing something and posting regarding it and then finding out that the topic's been done before.

If it'll make you feel better, I'll tell you that I once posted a completely new observation and hypothesis... then TK immediately posted and said that it was an old topic and linked the thread... then Aegon posted and said that I had actually posted on said thread... he had the nerve to link where I had actually had the opposite hypothesis on that topic in the previous thread... most embarassing.

If you cannot make a fool of yourself here, you can't do it anywhere.

Anyway, who caught Jaqen? How was he caught? What was his crime? We don't know. Mayhaps it was in his mission to get caught. Was he supposed to kill a gaoler? Was he supposed to kill a fellow prisoner?

But we do know that Jaqen was going to be sent to the Wall with Yoren. In Yoren's group, there were only three people who might have ranked high enough to merit a hired knife.

Arya joined at the last minute. There's no way Jaqen knew she'd be going... plus she's still alive. So she's out.

Gendry was needed dead by Cersei, but she'd have not spent much money killing a *******. And there's the fact that Jaqen did not kill Gendry. Gendry's out.

This leaves Eddard. Eddard was supposed to go with Yoren to take the Black. Eddard was the highest ranking political prisoner in the kingdom. If he'd died in jail, it would have looked like the Lannister's murdered him. They were sending him to the Wall, but they did not want him living long and passing on secrets... so Eddard had to die soon after he confessed. We know that both of the murders that Jaqen commited for Arya seemed either natural or strange, but that neither looked like murder. I think Eddard was supposed to have an accident on his journey north. Most likely after crossing Moat Cailin... if Eddard died in the North, then the Lannisters would not seem to have been involved.

Sounds possible BUT can you really see the Lannister's wasting money on a Faceless Man? They are more in the area of hired knives and cheaper methods.
 
Sounds possible BUT can you really see the Lannister's wasting money on a Faceless Man? They are more in the area of hired knives and cheaper methods.

Excellent idea Boaz. This is the first time you've posted a crazy idea that actually makes sense to someone not named Boaz....

It relies on the assumption that Jaqen got caught to kill someone and didnt get caught after killing someone....but with that assumption allowed Ned would be the most likely target.....

I want to take it one step further and say Shaklock is correct....Cersei wouldnt have done it. But if there was someone who wanted to ensure the north went to war with the Lannisters and destabilized the realm...they might hire a quality killer to implicate the Lannisters n'est ce pas? If they had the money.....

Hmm who do we know that wanted Westeros at war and was quite well off?....
 
Excellent idea Boaz. This is the first time you've posted a crazy idea that actually makes sense to someone not named Boaz....

It relies on the assumption that Jaqen got caught to kill someone and didnt get caught after killing someone....but with that assumption allowed Ned would be the most likely target.....

I want to take it one step further and say Shaklock is correct....Cersei wouldnt have done it. But if there was someone who wanted to ensure the north went to war with the Lannisters and destabilized the realm...they might hire a quality killer to implicate the Lannisters n'est ce pas? If they had the money.....

Hmm who do we know that wanted Westeros at war and was quite well off?....

I'm going to hazzard a guess at Littlefinger/Vary's/some mixture of the two with the roses thrown in.
 
Your getting warmer.

Varys? Maybe but he's not really that wealthy.

Littlefinger? That would mean he's just not only benefiting from the situation for his own benefit but actually planned it from the beginning (which I think is giving him too much credit) and would mean that he is "in" with the Targs.

Illyrio would of been my bet.
 
Your getting warmer.

Varys? Maybe but he's not really that wealthy.

Littlefinger? That would mean he's just not only benefiting from the situation for his own benefit but actually planned it from the beginning (which I think is giving him too much credit) and would mean that he is "in" with the Targs.

Illyrio would of been my bet.


'course, forgot about the scheming Magistrate. But he's working with Vary's so I was kinda right.
 
Yeah it would have to be a financially backed Varys (with Illyrios money) because I doubt there was enough time to get a message from KL to the Free Cities then hire a faceless guy and have him travel back to KL.

So that means Jaqen was on retainer and nearby or already hired and on his way to kill Eddard before he got deposed by Cersei.

Remember it was Varys who brought Eddard the offer of taking the black. Was it his suggestion as well?
 
another theory that I heard is that jaqen is syrio forel. If you believe it you know exactly how he got to the black cells.
syrio background suits well into the cover of a faceless (nobody know where eddard found him, but he is bravossi). it allows for his weapon skill, his interest in arya and for that cut in his death scene, we don't actually know if he died (or for that matter hurt his finger).
So you conspiracy masters, what do you make of it?
 
another theory that I heard is that jaqen is syrio forel. If you believe it you know exactly how he got to the black cells.
syrio background suits well into the cover of a faceless (nobody know where eddard found him, but he is bravossi). it allows for his weapon skill, his interest in arya and for that cut in his death scene, we don't actually know if he died (or for that matter hurt his finger).
So you conspiracy masters, what do you make of it?

Ah but Syrio was the Sealord's champion (I forgot the exact title for the Lord and the Champion but meh) So, he dident exactly appear out of nowhere. And if he was a Faceless Man I doubt he'd have such training as a Waterdancer, although not so sure what combat training Faceless Men exactly recieve.
Anyway Jaqen said he was Lorathi, not Bravosi, which admitedly doesent mean much when he's a guy that can change his appereance.
 
I never liked the Syrio = Jaqen theories. The evidence presented is never solid and requires some major jumps to make the connections. I actually hope it's not true since I like the thought of Syrio and Jaqen being their own people since they are both interesting and dynamic characters.

A lot of theories seem to be invented because people just really don't want to believe certain characters can be dead. If we try hard enough we can probably come up with a theory stating that Eddard is still alive even though half of King's Landing saw his head chopped off.
 
A lot of theories seem to be invented because people just really don't want to believe certain characters can be dead. If we try hard enough we can probably come up with a theory stating that Eddard is still alive even though half of King's Landing saw his head chopped off.
In my opinion the case of Syrio calls for the assumption he is not dead after all. Why else did martin conceal his death so bluntly?
a question then. can you find any evidence as to the fate of Syrio? Who was the white shield that tried to arrest him? is there any talk in kinglanding or bravos over his death? Do we know for certain he actually was first sword for the sea lords? is it possible to be first sword and a faceless man? if the theory is correct, do you fined any pattern in the activities of the faceless in westerose? (The death of balon grejoy, syrio open life in kinglanding (is there any evidence to a secret life?), jaquin hagars actions in harrenhall and in the service of the brave companions and the most recent secret invasion of the citedeil. another question that comes to mind, was ariya recruitment planed by the faceless of by higher power (a.k.a grrrm)
 
Syrio may very well be alive but Syrio = Jaqen is just one theory I won't ever believe until it's proven in the books themselves. It's just too sketchy right now.
 

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